Baltimore Marathon Drops Prize Money

He's not a local white guy running 2:30. He's run 2:21 and 1:05.....

godgeddy wrote:

Maybe rojo will win it this year - home course advantage.

I need help. I've been living here a year and haven't gotten involved in the local running scence as I can barely break 3:00 for 800. Every time i try to actually get in shape, my calf blows up.

I'm embarrassed. Two guys on letsrun took me for a run and i had to kill myself to keep up for 25 minutes of their 10 miler.

Who wants to coach me/run with me?

Get the Cornell rojo to coach you.

Did you Contact Ryan McGrath? He has a great club.

Look up "team that's what she said"

Nothing stopping a race like Baltimore (besides losing a title sponsor) from going American-only with their prize money and supporting Americans. Can't reason why more races don't do this, esp. if they're dropping their prize money cause they don't want a bunch of foreigners showing up. The solution is easy- support Americans.

I'd love if they did something like a prize for Maryland residents. There's definitely some good guys around MD, they just don't come out to expensive races without any prize $$.

Guy who mentioned the club 10 miler -- is that the best race in the state now? I think it might be if there aren't any Africans coming in to the marathon. I agree that's a crazy competitive race. Doesn't hurt that it's cheap/free for most and there's pride on the line.

TheGarbageDisposal wrote:

Are there any rules that prevent race directors from making the prize money "American only"?

I know I've seen some that only give prize money for "local" runners.

americano espresso wrote:

Nothing stopping a race like Baltimore (besides losing a title sponsor) from going American-only with their prize money and supporting Americans. Can't reason why more races don't do this, esp. if they're dropping their prize money cause they don't want a bunch of foreigners showing up. The solution is easy- support Americans.

Which race directors have stated that Africans are the reason they are dropping prize money? I thought it was the lack of value produced by elite runners in general

Dave Berdan here...

A couple things:

-I am bummed that the marathon took away prize money, but completely understand Under Armour wanting to put that money into local inner city youth programs. I anticipate that the prize money will eventually be back when Corrigan Sports finds a new title sponsor.

- I have planned on running Baltimore since last year...before hearing about the prize money being dropped. I live here, teach here, and coach here. The experience and support I received when leading the marathon for the first half in 2011 was amazing. It has been a goal of mine (I often visualize it during workouts) to win the Baltimore Marathon...and I mean win when all of the East Africans are competing. Unfortunately I've been dealing with some hip injury issues since June, so I'm not at the level I would like to be at right now. Baltimore was intended to be a long specific workout that would set me up to try and run under 2:18 at Philadelphia.

- Someone mentioned this, but the 2:18 was said to be the Olympic Trials standard, but the interviewer misinterpreted it. This happens all of the time....it's hard for the general public to understand the difference.

- They mention the Race for the Cure because it is an event that I have run for the past 4 years as part of my school's team. Each year my school is among the top group fund raisers in the race. Also, the most important part to me is the fact that my wife's one grandmother passed away from breast cancer, the other was treated in 2011 for breast cancer, and her cousin was just diagnosed last year and still going through treatment. No, I didn't run fast. I do the race for the cause and winning allows me to bring attention to it and my family who have been affected by the disease. It's not all about prize money guys!

- I coach the varsity cross country team at Garrison Forest School and we have entered 4 relay teams in the marathon. I love that we are exposing them to something that they can continue to do for the rest of their lives. The experience of the expo and the race itself will stay with them forever and my hope is they will continue to run and compete throughout their life.

- I understand the prize money issue with foreigners. It has frustrated me before as well. I do normally run with or beat the ones in the area, but a race like Baltimore would usually bring in some pretty big names. I do think it would be nice if more races had American or local money. Baltimore did have $1000.00 for Maryland resident each year I have run it in the past. Hopefully that comes back... Here's a quick example about the frustration I'm talking about. I ran a 10k a few weeks ago that specifically states the prize money is American only...but the fine print says something about unless you've been here for so many years/are here for a jog/went to school here and are working here, etc. Anyway, two Ethiopians for DC come up and finish 2 and 3 in the race (prize money was top 3). They tell the race director that they are American citizens! Hilarious considering every other time they enter a race they make sure it says Washington, DC/Ethiopia. Now all of a sudden they are American citizen? I'm still waiting to see what happens with the prize money as she said they would have to give a social security number to get the money. Also, this was a charity race for a Children's Cancer Center at a local hospital. Do you think these guys could talk to people or get interviewed afterwards? No...they waited for the awards and left.

- So, I would like to win, but know my hip/body has to be able to get through the race as well. I'm going to go out there and enjoy running and the support that the volunteers and the people of Baltimore provide!

I think that touched on everything...

I've personally heard complaints from people associated with races, and there's been enough comments made (even this thread alone) that people are tired of races having a bunch of foreign athletes show up, take the money, and leave. Not that this couldn't happen with elites of any nationality, but I hear far more complaints about foreign runners and the lack of value they bring.

I think the fastest race in the state right now is probably Pike's Peak 10k in the spring. Fast, net downhill I think.

Cherry Blossom is DC, but that's obviously fast too.

The competition at Baltimore used to be "sub-elite strong" up front. low 2:1x in the marathon, 1:0x in the half.

But after the top it falls really quickly. I was in the top 15 or 20 out of like 5000-8000 halfers (cant remember the exact #, it's a lot) a few years ago and ran like 1:19 or something

Baltihorse wrote:

This is part of why the Maryland road scene is so abysmal

I couldn't agree more.

The Baltimore running market is over-saturated with events, none of which are driven to the actual promotion of running as a sport or competitive event. The majority of Baltimore running events are now driven to one specific cause, a benefit. A benefit for research, fundraising, chairty, awareness, etc. These are all great causes, these will always have their place--unfortunately, no events are actually looking to cater to promoting a competitive event. And because there's no specific event to look at for actual racing, everyone flees to bigger races and different regions. At these local events, they only draw a handful of people who will break 20 minutes in a 5k, and sometimes fewer.

Yeah France wrote:

He has a great club.

Look up "team that's what she said"

This club has a large association to my reason agreeing with the above comment as well.

It's generally some of the top runners in the area with a few other top guys that come and go. However the group itself has a very elitist view of themselves and is very disconnected from the Baltimore running scene. While they are some of the top area runners, they are above average at best in a more competitive region (low 15s 5k, 70 half). Because they are the top area guys, they choose to go elsewhere to race--all fair and reasonable; but for a group that "embraces" the Baltimore area they choose to do NO racing in that scene (unless they can make a buck in prize money). It's a very clique group that doesn't pay mind to anyone outside their circle unless invited in.

---

I've decided to take a hiatus from racing because of the abysmal Baltimore running scene. I got tired of searching high and low for someone to train with, not having a local competitive race to run, and not seeing any backing for the top area runners. I've sought out local races that I thought would be competitive, and have felt embarassed due to winning because I was minutes ahead of second while doing just under a tempo effort. I can't even find enjoyment in racing big races anymore when I show to the starting line by myself, while I'm surrounded by other competitive guys that are with groups and teams from other areas. I'm in shape to run a race now in what I feel would be a respectable time, but the state of the local running scene has me away from races and out running on my own.

So Under armour drops out as sponsor as they lose the prize money? They claim they have 27,000 people participating plus plenty of other sponsors. They couldn't come up with 10K prize money for that. A local turkey trot in catonsville came up with 3K prize money for this year.

The Grand Prix in Baltimore could not find a title sponsor for 3 years, I highly doubt that Corrigan will be able to find a local title sponsor for the marathon. The way the course finds every hill in the city, poorly maintained roads, and changes the course to appease sponsors every year is another reason that they will have trouble finding quality runners to run this race.

With Marine Corps on a more athlete friendly course and filled more with actual runners than people that walk the entire half marathon event, just two weeks later than Baltimore will get the better runners competing.

this year the race directors are giving medals to the 5K race finishers because they complained that they didn't get a medal to wear to work the next day.

I'm hoping you have some competition Dave, but how much fun will it be to run 2:23 and the next finisher being at 2:35.

americano espresso wrote:

I've personally heard complaints from people associated with races, and there's been enough comments made (even this thread alone) that people are tired of races having a bunch of foreign athletes show up, take the money, and leave. Not that this couldn't happen with elites of any nationality, but I hear far more complaints about foreign runners and the lack of value they bring.

They just hate foreigners. American runners don't bring any more or less value.

Good luck Dave! I'm rooting for you!

uhbuh wrote:

American runners don't bring any more or less value.

Yes they do. What do you think started the running boom 30 years ago?

Rick Grimes wrote:...It would be interesting to hear from RD's of decent size marathons (5K-15K participants) what they do for athlete outreach and community connections in the week leading up to their race.

The marathon I work for is about 35th-40th largest in the US (marathon finisher numbers only), so a little smaller than you're looking for but I'll chime in. (FWIW, 5k-15k finishers would only be 11 marathons in the US last year; Disney, Philly, Twin Cities, Houston, RnR San Diego, Portland, San Francisco, Cal Intl, Grandma's, St George, Columbus.)

I would say we don't ask much of our elite entrants in terms of outreach and community connections. We ask them to be available for the press, etc, but we don't bring anyone in prior to the day before the race and we don't want to put a lot of things on their plate when they should be getting ready to race. Some have come to us and asked to be a part of certain programs and we're happy to accommodate their requests, for example being part of our youth run the day before the marathon. If we had them coming in earlier we'd certainly ask more of them.

The international runners who have raced our event over its 25 years, with 1 exception that I can think of, were all really solid with the press and public and put themselves into the category of athletes we'd be interested in having back. We don't get a lot of African runners, but we do get some. We've had 5 international runners win men's, 3 win women's. Most years we have around 10 of our 40-50 "Invited Runners" who are international. On the whole, anything we've asked of US runners we've asked of the internationals, and they've all been accommodating. We'd be open to having more international runners racing here, same way we'd be interested in having more upper level US runners.

Someone forwarded me this since since my name was specifically mentioned, so I'll respond.

As a friend of Dave Berdan's for the 8 years I've lived in Baltimore, I've asked him numerous times why he does this race. He explained his reasons above, so no need to re-hash. I just don't understand why anyone - particularly those of you with nothing positive to say - cares why someone else does a race. If you're spending your time posting anonymously on some running website, I commend you on not making positive contributions to our sport or community.

As far as the marathon, Under Armour ended their title sponsorship months ago. Only a few weeks ago did that news actually get reported, presumably because CSE didn't want it impacting registration. If I were UA, and looking for credibility in running, I would want to sponsor my hometown's biggest running event. But that's just me. They have other goals. The race will still go on and what will be different? You won't have 9 African men and a handful of Russian women coming in and winning money.

Finally, as far as the running scene in Baltimore, and for the one or two negative comments I saw, if you haven't run with me or our group, what do you know about it? If you're "another low 15 guy" then I invite you to come train with people who are as fast or faster than you. To suggest that we're very elitist and not in touch with the running scene is far from accurate. I guess you've missed me at every running event in Baltimore every year? And for every "local elite" runner that trains with us, we have a guy trying to run under 3:15 or a girl trying to do her first triathlon. Don't believe me? Check our blog

http://teamthatswhatshesaid.blogspot.com

and you can see every race result since 2006. Read through every post and tell me I'm out of touch with the scene here. Don't blame Baltimore and it's "abysmal" running scene for why you're taking a hiatus from running. And you obviously didn't search "high and low for someone to train with" because I can give you a list of 100 people to run with here. Come on out, Starbucks in Canton on Boston St every morning at 5:30 and run with us. Or Mondays at Fed Hill, Tuesdays at Gilman, Wednesdays at either CitySports or Under Armour. Thursday mornings at Under Armour. Come help out at the running store and volunteer for one of its low-key races that are designed for old school runners, rather than just complaining. There is no need to be invited to come run with us, you just show up. You want to join us? Email me at

runbaltimore@gmail.com

and get added to the list.

Maybe this serves to illustrate that I take it rather personally when I'm insulted for not "paying mind to people outside our circle" and being "out of touch with the running scene."

We also know the difference between "their" and "they're" - so "there", maybe I'm a little elitist about homonyms.

And for RoJo, I've heard he's run with a few of my friends. Waiting to see him join us on one of our elitist group runs.

To defend the Baltimore folks who have the ability (2:30's or 1:10's) to make Baltimore's Running Festival on par with the talent that Richmond, VA Beach, Pittsburgh, etc. bring out... I can't think of any competitive marathons in the mid-atlantic region that both lack prize money and a "fast" course. Pittsburgh, Richmond, Philadelphia, and Shamrock all offer local prize money and are all faster courses. Also, all 4 of these races have "sub-elite" standards that offer free entry for the folks that have PR's around 2:30.

I'd love for someone to prove me wrong on this.

I am looking forward to seeing what happens next year with the Baltimore marathon's title sponsor.