In the UK you should run on the right side of the road if there is no pavement(=sidewalk in US English):
https://www.gov.uk/rules-pedestrians-1-to-35/general-guidance-1-to-6If there is no pavement, keep to the right-hand side of the road so that you can see oncoming traffic.
the lowest circle of hell is reserved for sidewalk runners. And sidewalk bicyclists.
screw once but never again wrote:
Find this guy who made the complaint. Run up to his house,knock on the door, and hit him straight in the face. Tell him as he is on the floor wheeping like a little girl that if he has any more complaints about runs you'll be back.
Just burn his house down instead.
It's really the only thing to do here.
i would not worry about this at all.
i would run in the road whether there is a law against it or not.
catch me if you can.
Common sense dictates that if there is a sidewalk you should run on the sidewalk.
Bobby1 wrote:
Common sense dictates that if there is a sidewalk you should run on the sidewalk.
It's called a sidewalk, not a siderun.
If the city considers passing an ordinance that keeps you from using the roads, then demand that the city provide a bike/pedestrian lane in all areas where sidewalks are not even and it is unsafe to run.
Better yet, demand that they invest money in an urban trail system for you and rally some public support. Publicly decry the efforts of a city that does not support an active lifestyle.
Make this a money/infrastructure/health issue for the city, and see who's side they fall on regarding this one imbecile's neighborhood.
Cranky twerp, the heck with him.
When I started running as a teen in the 70s, you got this kind of attitude & hassle here and there.
If I were thinking through the legal issues, I'd start by asking whether walking is permitted on the roads in question. Are people who don't have cars and don't have the money to take public transportation, for example, allowed to walk on the edge of the roadway to get from place to place? Or is pedestrianism prohibited on those roads? Obviously walking is forbidden on certain kinds of limited access highways and the like, as are bicycles.
The reason you start with walking is because I'd be willing to bet that runners are permitted anywhere that walking is permitted. Because from the standpoint of ordinary jurisprudence--as opposed to the rules and regulations governing competition--there's no difference between walking and running.
Do the roads in question have sidewalks? Communities might certainly be able to insist that no foot traffic can take place on roads that have sidewalks.
The analogy between cycling and running is slightly trickier. Bicycles are wheeled vehicles. Runners are pedestrians. Apples and oranges.
I would certainly begin with case-law, and I hope you get good advice here and elsewhere on that.
I think that gated communities and the like can certainly forbid running on their private roads. But you're quite right: public roads are public roads. My response to this person would NOT be a knee-jerk antagonism, but a willingness to take a hard, objective look at the laws that are actually on the books.
No need to submit until the law actually prohibits your presence.
At that point, of course, you can become an outlaw, and use publicity to your advantage. Post YouTube videos of "prohibited and illegal activies." Show Granny jogging in her pink track suit and show a (pretend) cop giving her a beatdown.
I just came back from a run, and because the sidewalks are covered in ice here, I ran mostly on the roads. If the speed of cars is high, if you must run on the road, run so that you can see cars coming towards you, and always be ready to leave the road if necessary. However, if the speed of the traffic is slow (not much faster than you), it can be better to run with the direction of traffic to decrease relative speed and give each other more time to react. If you cannot see around a corner, it can also be better to run on the "correct" side of the road once you know that the road behind is clear.
In residential areas with slow traffic but frequent intersections, drivers will actually see you better if you run on the "correct" side of the road rather than on the sidewalk. In these case, running on the road may be the safer option.
Wherever you run, whether running on the roads or crossing roads, NEVER use headphones, and wear plenty of high-viz gear and LEDs. Drivers expect everything on the road to be illuminated, especially anything that moves faster than a typical pedestrian.
au contraire wrote:
I would certainly begin with case-law, and I hope you get good advice here and elsewhere on that.
I think that gated communities and the like can certainly forbid running on their private roads. But you're quite right: public roads are public roads. My response to this person would NOT be a knee-jerk antagonism, but a willingness to take a hard, objective look at the laws that are actually on the books.
Case law? Whether one can run on particular roads is likely a matter of municipal ordinance, maybe state law. There is likely not going to be case law on something like that; if there is, it isn't going to be the best place to start. There might be some common law principle on this issue, but still, I wouldn't start there.
Just google your towns municipal ordinances and look for something about public roads; if that fails try the state statutes.
get involved wrote:
Just a Runner Man wrote:So now we have to meet with the city and this man. I am not sure I understand it entirely, but he thinks we should be quarantined to parks. His argument is that roads are for cars and runners need to stay off of them.
Not a big deal. Meet with the city, let this nutjob talk himself into a hole. Unless this guy has some pull with your city council or there is a big anti-runner sentiment where you live it's going to be real hard for him to put forth any kind of winning argument. The council will listen to him, maybe ask your group a few questions, then brush him off and move onto the next bit of business.
Just a Runner Man wrote:This is a mid-sized town and the neighborhoods are not super busy.
He seems to think our small running club is responsible for every runner in the city simply because we host 3 races a year.
I expect some of you to agree with him, but what is the legal view on running in roads? It seems to me that until very recently (last 50 years), roads have been for everyone to use. Not just speeding cars. Right?
FWIW, he is also after the cyclists.
The legal view of "running on the roads" has various meanings depending on the circumstance (biking on the roads, same thing). In some places it may not be legal. I can think of 2 places fairly close to where I live where bikes/pedestrians are banned even though when I drive those roads they look fairly typical to roads that you would expect to be able to run or bike on (i.e. they're definitely not interstate highway type roads).
One thing I gotta say, I do not understand why runners train in the street when lightly traveled sidewalks (in good shape) are present. I can understand running in the street if you're in an area where the sidewalks are either crowded or poorly maintained. Example, where I live there is one main road to get from the north end of the city to downtown, it's about 4 miles and has lightly traveled sidewalks on both sides the whole way. At some points it's 2 lanes for cars in each direction, but mostly it's 1 lane for cars in each direction. Mostly it's not a super wide road. In 25 years running on that road I've never felt the need to run anywhere but the sidewalk. At least once a week I see somebody running in the street - experienced runners and newbies. I don't get it. Once somebody told me they ran in the street because it was softer than the sidewalk and saved their legs. Seriously? We're talking asphalt vs concrete, not feathers vs concrete.
Are you saying your running group (or a lot of your local runners) deliberately runs in the street as opposed to on the sidewalk in this guy's neighborhood?
One reason i sometimes run in the road even when there are sidewalks is people who are walking use the sidewalks. Its just easier that way. When you catch someone from behind sometimes there reaction is to move out of the way and they may have been your intension too. So you end up almost running into people. I think people should be free to run on local roads as long as they are close to the side and don't interfere with traffic.
I run on the sidewalk wrote:
some of us think that runners should run on the sidewalk.
Most people are quite friendly, say hello or wave, but two people in the last few years have told me to not run on the sidewalk. I told them to FO and leave me alone. One of them I filed a report on as he was making threats and waving a big stick.
I run on the roads, sidewalks, dirt roads, grass, tracks, and any other suitable surface.
A few years ago a guy driving down his culdesac (a running path goes through the end of it) aimed his car directly at me while laying on his horn. He swerved to the side just as he got to me, and then pulled in his driveway. I stopped, walked up his driveway, and tapped on his window. He wouldn't open the door, then opened the garage door, drove in and closed it. I run by there every day and he never bothered me again after that.
Then run with your nuts and jugs out!
Some states (e.g. New Jersey) maintain that right of way/usage of roads corresponds to the historical precedence of road access. In other words, pedestrians will always have the right of way over anything. Ridden/driven horses are next, followed by cyclists, followed by automobiles. This is often invoked especially when an accident occurs and can usually be used to "trump" any local laws.
so, find out this guy's schedule, everyone in your running group shave your heads and wear togas, trenchcoats, and shades, then make a point of running and chanting around him every instance when he is driving around in his car.
when he leaves his car, chant and do a native or Russian dance.
do all of this on the sidewalk.
I would agree that running on sidewalks with mere pedestrians is a nuisance. In fact the only time that my high school teammates and I do run on the sidewalks is when we go downtown on easy days and try to get in people's way.
And yes, we are the runners that give the rest of you a bad name.
p.s. If you don't like running on sidewalks or roads I am sure that a local golf course would love to have your company.
I run on the sidewalk wrote:
WhitePony wrote:Why would we agree with him?
Possibly because some of us think that runners should run on the sidewalk. But as an above poster mentioned, this is a matter of local ordinance (and state law).
So when you are running on a sidewalk and come to a road you have to cross what do you do then?
Bummer that you have to deal with this crabby old f@rt. So how often does your running club run through this neighborhood?
I think some drivers get mad that I sometimes run in the street when there's a sidewalk, but the sidewalks are uneven and dangerous, especially in the dark. I think non-runners just don't understand that.
otter wrote:
So when you are running on a sidewalk and come to a road you have to cross what do you do then?
Most people would use the crosswalk, which is considered to be a part of the sidewalk.