base training

Totally useless. Nobody ever had much success with it.

First of all, I do not think there's anything wrong with running long runs of 22 or more. I just believe, that unless you are training for a marathon, it's too much to do on a weekly basis. They'll do nothing except beat you up.

There's a big difference between a guy getting in 22 out of his 90 miles on one run, and a guy running 120-140 miles and doing the same.

Through years and years of experience, I've noticed there seems to be plateau levels at 4 miles, 8 miles, 14 miles, 18 miles and 22 miles. Whether or not it's physiological or psychological, that's been my experience. Once you go over 18 miles you start to go to a different place. If you're not running a marathon, I don't believe you need to go there.

Remember, I'm talking about a weekly habit here. I think it's just fine to go out there occasionally and run 22 or more.

I think that for a 8k-10k XC type, a long run of between 14 and 18 is plenty. Especially for a guy running a 16 min 5k. I believe time would be better spent getting in doubles at least four days a week and more frequent runs at tempo pace.

Also, for Rudolf, you find that you recover easier if you split your runs up. Heck, 6 and 10 you should be able to do in your sleep.

Thank you for the reply, Malmo. Gives me something to think about.

Best thing to do is try it. See how you feel? If you don't like it, then you don't like it.

so ccan u give me advice on wat to do. and wat time do u think i will be running for 5k xc when i finish this program

That's the difference between running now and running 25 years ago. No one now has the patience to put in the time and effort to determine the end result, which may be several months down the road.

Kid, you'll run 16:14.6 for 5K on October 28th. It will be your fastest time of the season.

By the time track rolls around, you'll be alternating cross-training between your skateboard and your BMX bike. You won't be running anymore because you'll blame everyone but yourself for your failures.

You still will be several grade levels behind in reading and writing, but you won't care.

Got it?

olu, I don't know what time you will be running. I probably look at training and racing differently than you. I have no idea if you are a "gamer" or not, that is, whether you are the type that steps up his game to meet the competition, or do you run the same time week after week? Does your coach prepare you to race, or does he approach the sport from the fitness freaks perspective?

Let me ask you something, to give you an idea what I'm talking about. After a race, do you

(a) carry on as a normal day, or do you

(b) need to lie in bed in fetal position for a few hours to recover?

If the answer is not (b) then you probably need some work on your attitude torwards the sport. Fitness runner or competitor, that's your decision?

i want to peak in november, thats y i am doing this lydiard base training program.

jman wrote:

I await this answer as well. Should we do 17-18 tops and double that day? I have asked before and didn't receive an answer. I hope to get one this time. Thanks malmo.

jman, there's a line from the movie "Arthur" that would be apropos. Can you guess what it is?

Why dont you believe 22 miles in 2.5hrs.Sounds very believable to me.My own times are close to these and I'm 51 and no speedster.Some of those times over 5/10k???? Take your hand off it!!!!

I said 22M in 2:30 was believable. Sharpen up those reading comprehension skills.

I NEED MORE POSTS, I NEED ADVICE. PLS HELP ME

The capital contradiction does not have to do simply with the incredible conjunction of the sensuous and the supersensible in the same Thing; it is the contradiction of automatic autonomy, mechanical freedom, technical life. Like everything olu,, from the moment it comes onto the stage of a market, the table resembles a prosthesis of itself. Autonomy and automatism, but automatism of this wooden table that spontaneously puts itself into motion, to be sure, and seems thus to animate, animalise, oluize, spiritualise, spiritise itself, but while remaining an artifactual body, a sort of automaton, a puppet, a stiff and mechanical doll whose dance obeys the technical rigidity of a program. Two genres, two generations of movement intersect with each other in it, and that i s why it figures the apparition of a spectre. It accumulates undecidably, in its uncanniness, olu, their contradictory predicates: the inert thing appears suddenly inspired, it is all at once transfixed by a pneuma or a psyche. Become like a living being, the table resembles a prophetic dog, olu, that gets up on its four paws, ready to face up to its fellow dogs: an idol would like to make the law. But, inversely, the spirit, soul, or life that animates it remains caught in the opaque and heavy thingness of the bule, in the inert thickness of its ligneous body, and autonomy is no more than the mask of automatism. A mask, indeed a visor that may always be hiding no living gaze beneath the helmet. The automaton mimes the living. The Thing is neither dead nor alive, it is dead and alive at the same time. It survives. At once cunning, inventive, and machine-like, ingenious and unpredictable, this war machine is a theatrical machine, a mekhane. What one has just seen cross the stage is an apparition, a quasi-divinity — fallen from the sky or come out of the earth. But the vision also survives. Its hyperlucidity insists.

dude, if i were you, i would start following the Daniel's program and don't don't even think Lydiard again.

but why

if you're wondering why, then just go out and buy the book. i bought it at Barnes and Noble for like $19.somethin. anyways, if you want some advice about some nifty things to throw into your summer program then here's one. Once a week on your shorter days, do hill combo's( find a hill, 30-60 meters in length, a bit steep, and run up it once for a warm-up then start by skipping up, jog/walk back down then sprint up, then run backwards up,and then sprint up an top it with an 70-80meter flat land sprint. make sure you only skip once for the whole set. start off with about 4-5 of the combo hills. do this for about 5-6 weeks. this will help your turn over and your adaptation to surging up and over hills. also, on your medium days attack the hills or attack 100meters at hilltop. do that once a week. you're suppost to do that the first 6 weeks of your summer runnin, soooo there's some future reference. as far as race times go, nobody can tell you what times you will run. that depends on YOU. just believe in your training and go out a compete and the fast times will come. make your senior season the best.

best of luck.

thanx

It seems you are not familiar with Dr. David L Costill, so I won't bore you with details. If the man says x + y = z equals improvment in performance, then you better think twice about his pronouncement. He is at the very top of pragmatic exercise physiology research in the world, a former cross-country coach, and elite masters swimmer. Ask Jack if he respects David Costill and he would give a "look" as if to say, "Are you kidding me?"

Look, keep doing what makes you happy. If you like 18-22 milers, and you only run 16 minutes for the 5km, then go do it. You have your mind made up.

My position on 5k-10k training is fairly simple: do doubles because you will recover more while still doing quality miles, do LT-AT and max vO2 reps, do a small amount of sprints and hit the hills. I'll use the example of Richard Chelimo who was silver medalist in the World Championship 10k, barely behind Khalid Skah. Chelimo ran 40 minutes in the morning and 50 minutes in the afternoon, every day, day after day. His average pace on his runs was never slower than 6:00 per mile (at high elevation). The guy could only run about 4:02 for the mile, but he could hold 4:20 pace for the 10k and blow away most so-called world class atheletes. Did he lack endurance? No, he blew others away! Did he run far? NO, only 50 minutes maximum. Was he any different that Carlos Lopes, not much at all in training. Carlos usually ran 10-15 km twice per day, occassionally 20km, all fast. Paul Tergat, prior to becoming a marathoner believed that any run past 90 minutes was a waste (you run too slow he said). Most of his runs wer 15km in length (at 4:50 pace), plus 10km at 6 am. Tinman

Your gonna get a stress fracture. You jumped up way too many miles from what you did last year.