the runs wrote:
3:50.98 by Jiang Bo at the 1997 Chinese National Games.
The exact same track will used in a the Diamond League meet on 19th May, and was used last year too.
Not true. That stadium has been demolished. Diamond League is a new stadium.
the runs wrote:
3:50.98 by Jiang Bo at the 1997 Chinese National Games.
The exact same track will used in a the Diamond League meet on 19th May, and was used last year too.
Not true. That stadium has been demolished. Diamond League is a new stadium.
Nutella1 wrote:
ggg wrote:The Chinese were never caught. Hence clean.
My argument from page one was that the super amazing times by the Chinese athletes were all run on tracks in China that don't exist anymore at meets from which no full race videos exist. They backed up their world class at the World Championships but they never ran anywhere close to the times they ran in China. If that is due to less doping controls, short tracks or slower clocks (?) is up to speculation. But I think when discussing future performances, we should dismiss these times as a benchmark.
After taking these performances out the gap between 1500m and mile performances is not that big anymore. Then again, whom do you trust in the mile? Probably Sonia O'Sullivan at 4:17.
To break 4, a woman has to run 4 seconds faster each lap. It won't ever happen for a real woman (XX).
That's ridiculous. If the tracks were short, why didn't the men run well above their ability? Workers Stadium was refit for Olympic bids, but it's still there. Shanghai Stadium is untouched from when Bo Jiang ran 3:50.98 there in 1997. Short tracks/missed laps are not an explanation.
Nutella1 wrote:
the runs wrote:3:50.98 by Jiang Bo at the 1997 Chinese National Games.
The exact same track will used in a the Diamond League meet on 19th May, and was used last year too.
Not true. That stadium has been demolished. Diamond League is a new stadium.
Here's a video from the opening ceremonies at the 1997 National Games:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Rfkr7Xa2UsAnd here it is the first year of the Golden Grand Prix:
http://www.shdisabled.gov.cn/clinternet/platformData/infoplat/pub/disabled_132/docs/200503/res/track.jpgStill think it's not the same? It's the exact same stadium. You're dead wrong on this. Show me anything to suggest that somehow Shanghai Stadium was demolished and rebuilt at anytime following 1997. It didn't happen.
Talking about the track, not the stadium. You can build a track that's 390m instead of 400m and the difference is not visible to the human eye.
Anyway, it's just one explanation. We all know something was wrong, we just don't know whether it was doping and/or something else.
I am pretty sure the track was regulation but they started from the wrong line for the Chinese records in '93 and maybe the '97 times.
It would explain everything well including fantastic closing splits.
It would be very blatant cheating that they did just for their top women who were already world class.
No need to do this set up for the men who were too far from record believability.
No videos of these races means we can make these speculations.
Nutella1 wrote:
Talking about the track, not the stadium. You can build a track that's 390m instead of 400m and the difference is not visible to the human eye.
Anyway, it's just one explanation. We all know something was wrong, we just don't know whether it was doping and/or something else.
You wrote one post earlier, "that stadium was demolished" and then you write "talking about the track, not the stadium." Which is it?
If the track had been short, everyone's times would have been phenomenal, not just the middle and long distance women.
toro wrote:
I am pretty sure the track was regulation but they started from the wrong line for the Chinese records in '93 and maybe the '97 times.
It would explain everything well including fantastic closing splits.
It would be very blatant cheating that they did just for their top women who were already world class.
No need to do this set up for the men who were too far from record believability.
No videos of these races means we can make these speculations.
Starting from the wrong line would mean the opening splits would be much more pedestrian compared to the opening 400m.
Times always seem to go down and crazy barriers always seem to be broken. Right now it seem like that one is pretty far away, however what most people are not taking in to account is the effect that genitec engineering will have on our sport very soon.
Found this video of Qu's 1500.
Hard to tell where the start is. Looks like there was some curve. Looks like it may be right but that could be a shot from the prelim.
Then it jumps to her being past the 300m mark and the clock is at 42s.
Now 46s is 3:50 pace. She is on 3:30 pace.
They also show her going into the bell lap and you an see the clock at 2:50.5 with her 5-10m past the line.
So 60 flat from there to the finsish would mean a 61 last lap which is reasonable with a big kick.
I think they could have moved the start 30-40m up from the real start line making it pretty easy to hit 42s at the 300m mark.
From there, a 2:07 800 would be reasonable to get them to 2:49 at the bell where she closes in 61.
The woman to do it would require around 50 for 400m, 1:50 for 800m, 8:00 for 3000m, and 14:00 for 5000m. It's not going to happen, ever. As someone mentioned, they need to improve 3 - 4 second per lap! When men were running 4:12 they were running on dirt tracks, working full-time jobs, training 4 times a week, and eating steak before races. There was room for improvement. What room for improvement is left now?
Come on.
This one of my better posts.
She went out in 42?
Had to start way less than 300m from the finish line.
Click:
Then paste:
Women's_1500m_World_Record_35046_Qu_Yunxia
in the search box. It takes you to a 1:11 video with clips of Qu's 3:50.46 World Record.
yes it will happen, probaly in my lifetime. when will a man run the 5K in under a 4:00 minute pace?
I will not allow this.
Toro has something there. The leader went through 300m under 42 seconds. The pack went through at 43 seconds, super fast.
As long as the next Castor Semenya adopts enough female touches to hide the truth, like many top-tier "female" athletes. See: Morgan Uceny
Are people on this thread actually serious?
Why didn't Dibaba and Defar run any 1500m or Mile at their prime?
It will never happen in my opinion, but the only possiblility if it was possible would be for a sprinter type that moves up and is somehow able to hold on for 4 laps. That would be the situation with males too, soon as the record is low enough where skinny endurance types just can't generate any more speed.
are you hinting at uceny's necklace? thats a reach as she's worn it forever and this is not even a reasonable theory
