PEDdy Hellebuyk's Masters career wiped off the books

Too bad he did'nt have Lance's legal team..

cheaters suck PERIOD. Just like ol' Lance "dope me up" Armstrong. Everything they did should be obliterated and removed from the records and they should be stripped of all medals and officials winnings. NO EXCUSES!!!!

Eddy made a grave mistake by taking EPO, but deleting all his records is an injustice, because he was only on the stuff for a relatively short time, and many of his records were legit. It is tantamount to giving a life sentence to someone guilty of homicide who killed (accidentally) in self defense.

Once again, Eddy did wrong, and he has been punished, but to delete all his records is not right, because he earned some of them. The complexity of the case and the precise time line means we will never know which records should stand and which should be erased. This is a very unfortunate case.

The type of hysteria and gut reaction in this case is typical when people have been stoked up to paint all cheaters under the heinous crime category. Otherwise perfectly rational and reasonable people become illogical in their reasoning when arguing about this case. It is depressing to think about man's inhumanity to tarnished individuals in cases like this. Eddy is a convenient scapegoat, because as an American of foreign origin, he is an easy target for many. One susptects a dose of jealousy may also enter into the denigrations of the man, the tragedy being that Eddy really did not need to take those things. He would still have been at the top in the age group categories.

Ghost in Saudi,

www.kfupm.edu.sa

, apply today

His offense is inexcusable. He got off way to easy. He should have served jail time. The defense of this behavior is also inexcusable. People that defend this behavior are a big part of the reason that this problem even exists. Lifetime ban from sport including removal of any records that occurred before the person was caught.

Mistake is a singular occurence. Doping is not a mistake it is a choice to cheat and as such is premeditated and using your analogy would not be an accident

Again using your comparison despite commiting fraud he has not served 1 day in jail. You can hardly compare a running ban to a life behind bars!

This is a running site we are not casting him into eternal damnation but when it comes to running he is finished to me and a lot of other people. As for it being a national thing I've run against him when younger and used to really look up to him

As I said on the other thread great that your crisise coach Colm but support a cheat

ghost wrote: Eddy is a convenient scapegoat, because as an American of foreign origin, he is an easy target for many.

To that I say, "Bullshit." Quit making excuses for the man. I'd have much more respect for Eddy if he gave back all the prize money he stole from other runners due to his doping.

To imply that Hellebuyk did not "steal" money from other runners is moronic. I know a top masters runner who won several national masters titles, but he also lost a few times to Hellebuyk. He trained his ass off and worked in a running store to support his family. He definitely could have used the money that would have been his. All runners deserve to compete on a level playing field. Cheating gives the sport a bad name.

It's not just the prize money that he cheated others from, AND HAS NOT RETURNED, it is also all the expense money he cheated out of races that others might have receieved. And to say that he only did it BRIEFLY (because he said so!) is beyond belief. He's a proven liar, so why should anyone believe him about anything. He's a criminal and should be behind bars, and never coaching anyone.

Interesting that EPO cheat Deeja Youngquist also lived in Albuquerque, who else that lived there (especially in Peddy's houses) that abused the drug?

Pick It Up wrote:

To imply that Hellebuyk did not "steal" money from other runners is moronic. I know a top masters runner who won several national masters titles, but he also lost a few times to Hellebuyk. He trained his ass off and worked in a running store to support his family. He definitely could have used the money that would have been his. All runners deserve to compete on a level playing field. Cheating gives the sport a bad name.

Well I heard you made $200,000 last year, and you drive a Mercedes. A friend of mine down the street works his butt off selling tomatoes, and could have used that money that would have been his for his family! We should have a level playing field of tomatoes, but cheating by driving a Mercedes is rotten! Therefore all Mercedes should be banned.

It sounds as though you aren't very familiar with the case. The arbitration panel merely extends the invalidation of Eddy's competitive results to the period of October 1, 2001, to January 30, 2004, based on Eddy's admission, corroborated by Shawn's testimony, that he was using EPO throughout that time, including at least six specific instances. In fact, although Eddy admitted that he used EPO as early as August 2001, the panel did not extend its ruling back that far, because Shawn testified that Eddy's admission was mistaken in that regard.

My principal concern about the panel's decision is its use of highly questionable legal analysis to overcome the six-year limitation period relating to an athlete's admission of doping. I believe (although I am not certain) that the governing procedures now permit Eddy to appeal the decision, which was issued under the auspices of the American Arbitration Association (AAA), to a separate arbitration panel of the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS). Although appellate review of arbitration decisions and judicial review to confirm or vacate arbitration decisions is generally extremely deferential to the arbitration awards, it would not shock me if the AAA panel's decision is reversed in this case. But I have little reason to believe that the basis for reversal would have anything substantial to do with your goofy theories about scapegoating, jealousy, prejudice against Americans of foreign origin, hysteria, or man's inhumanity to man. It would have to do with the importance of adhering to the rule of law, even where it allows an admitted cheater to retain some of the fruits of his misdeeds.

New Master wrote:

So this changes a few of our current Masters records? What do the records revert to? Anyone have that info? Any new performances came close to dirty E's that become the "new" records.

ANYHOOOO! Back to my original question, what does the updated record book look like? Is there a site? Like my name indicates, I am a new masters runner and am interested in following this level of comp. Thanks in advance!

NM

New Master wrote:

ANYHOOOO! Back to my original question, what does the updated record book look like? Is there a site? Like my name indicates, I am a new masters runner and am interested in following this level of comp. Thanks in advance!

NM

Take a look at the web site for the Association for Road Racing Statisticians (ARRS). I believe that, under the recent arbitration decision, Mbarak Hussein may now become the U.S. masters marathon recordholder, but Eddy may continue to hold the masters 10K record (but with a slower time), based on one of his performances prior to October 2001. That assumes that times on certain point-to-point courses (like Peachtree) are excluded from record consideration.

aghast wrote:

Do you really believe Peddy happened to only start cheating right before he got caught???

Come on man

There is another 50+ years old that is running marathons in 2:34 with a couple years of training.

And I have to agree with you. I think Eddy took drugs during his entire career. Maybe he did not start with EPO but roids.

You sound like John Bicourt (Belgrave), but if not, sorry for the mistake. I see your point.

Some runners asked me today whether Eddy might come back to try for records in the 55+ category. Not sure, but I think Eddy has lost his motivation to compete, with so much negativity in the air. Similar to what happened to Cathal Lombard after he won the Irish Intercounties cross country after his doping ban - and facing a lot of animosity at that last win (despite being squeaky clean) gave up for good after that race, even though there was a lot more in the tank.

This seems to be an anglo saxon thing (the deep hatred of cheaters) - because other country national champions have come back and coached in their countries of origin. Examples abound and include people like Boulami (Morocco) - the man who destroyed the best Kenyans when running sub 8 for the steeple many years ago. Boulami is coaching again in Morocco, and his reputation is not tarnished because the philosophy in Maghreb countries and many Southern European countries is that top notch performances require some kind of special substances, many legal and others borderline. You could argue that people sleeping in altitude tents but training at sea level are also gaining an unfair advantage as the benefits of living high and training low are now well documented.

Ghost in Saudi,

www.kfupm.edu.sa

, apply today

Yet the same people with such hatred, have no qualms about cheating the ones who have beaten them.

I think the hypocritical hatred stems from a deep seated frustration with failure.

For example P Radcliffe was getting beaten regularly in track races, especially by Olga Yegorova, the most prominent woman runner at the time. Radcliffe hatched a scheme to discredit Ms Yegorova, by holding up signs at athletic events, spreading false rumors through the press, and in fact caused the end of Ms Yegorova's running career. Radcliffe has no remorse of her actions, despite her own shady career, using altitude tents, special preparations, and usually having a medical doctor in her camp.

Even today the story persists that Yegorova had tested positive, although she was reinstated before Radcliffe and her crew took it upon themselves to destroy her career.

Some people HAVE no shame.

Yes, that vilification of Yegorava was unwarranted and in very bad taste. The Russian had served her time, and had the right to compete without impediment or psychological harassment, meted out to her by Radcliffe and Tullet.

Interesting, reading her biography, that Radcliffe finished around 300th in the English cross country championships as a 12 year old, in a field of around 600. This showed that on a genetic level, she was just average. Tribute to her for going as far as she did, especially with her lack of basic foot speed. Running 2.15 was amazing, and when she did that, I think she was second fastest Briton in the London marathon that year.

Radcliffe, with her frequent sleeping in altitude tents, training at altitude in Font Romeu (1600 base, and 2000m all around), and other high and low living. For example, in Monaco (her residence) she is just a 1-2 hour drive away from the Southern Alps (France and Italy) with many ski resorts within easy drive from her home. Monaco, ironically, has also been the home of another athlete (Lance Armstrong) who had been under suspicion for drug use.

Not saying that Racliffe doped, but her lifestyle and ability to invest her time in all the best locales for training gave her an enormous advantage over her rivals.

This past winter she has trained in Iten, Kenya (1800 +), but sadly, I don't think Paula has the legs to compete with the best in the marathon anymore. She is brave, but there comes a time when the legs no longer have the zip of the past.

Radcliffe has a right to make her point, but doing so during a championship was excessive.

Ghost in Saudi,

www.kfupm.edu.sa

, apply today

J.R. wrote:

For example P Radcliffe was getting beaten regularly in track races, especially by Olga Yegorova, the most prominent woman runner at the time. Radcliffe hatched a scheme to discredit Ms Yegorova, by holding up signs at athletic events, spreading false rumors through the press, and in fact caused the end of Ms Yegorova's running career. Radcliffe has no remorse of her actions, despite her own shady career, using altitude tents, special preparations, and usually having a medical doctor in her camp.

Even today the story persists that Yegorova had tested positive, although she was reinstated before Radcliffe and her crew took it upon themselves to destroy her career.

[quote]held up a sign protesting against the reinstatement of Russian athlete Olga Yegorova after Yegorova had tested positive for the banned substance EPO.

I'm no fan of Paula, who seems to have a remarkably self-serving view of the rules and a certain tendency toward revisionist history, but I think that you may be overstating the "shadiness" of her career and her role in "caus[ing] the end of Ms Yegorova's running career." Among other things, it's worth noting that Yegorova's urine sample in 2001 did, in fact, test positive for EPO, and that Yegorova was eventually suspended from the 2008 Russian Olympic team and then banned from competition based on apparently fraudulent substitution of urine samples. Yegorova, as it turned out, was fully capable of causing the end of her running career without Paula's assistance.

ghost wrote:

Radcliffe finished around 300th in the English cross country championships as a 12 year old, in a field of around 600. This showed that on a genetic level, she was just average.

You often seem to be trying to top yourself with increasingly outrageous statements. Do you also think that, because Michael Jordan failed to make the varsity basketball squad as a high school sophomore, he was "just average" "on a genetic level"?

Mike Lundgren wrote:

It's not just the prize money that he cheated others from, AND HAS NOT RETURNED, it is also all the expense money he cheated out of races that others might have receieved. And to say that he only did it BRIEFLY (because he said so!) is beyond belief. He's a proven liar, so why should anyone believe him about anything. He's a criminal and should be behind bars, and never coaching anyone.

Interesting that EPO cheat Deeja Youngquist also lived in Albuquerque, who else that lived there (especially in Peddy's houses) that abused the drug?

its not just the doping either. Eddy was a dishonest character in every aspect. He routinely stole prize money, travel money, gear and equipment, etc from other athletes. Ask anyone involved with the Saucony deal that Shawn had set up. Rarely did the other athletes every see the gear that was sent, Eddy stole it all. Then the athletes would call or ask a person involved with Saucony and the Saucony person said it had been sent to their name specifically but to the house address.

Eddy never showed one iota of honesty, doubt he ever does.