one issue that no one has thought of....
maybe when he ran like sh*t his teammates bashed him, talked shit on the long runs (i know there was mad drama at Adams State and long runs clicks emerged). so lets say his grades were piss poor, he was running like sh*t, his teammates were talking sh*t, he was homesick....yeah i can see him leaving
incoherency.
Dear Lucas, Hope we never hear from you again, you loser.
That's just a scenario you made up in your head. More likely he had coaches, agents, or whomever from the tri world whispering in his ear all along about how much money he could make in triathlons. This decision is all about the money, and you can see it in that Slowtwitch interview of his. C.R.E.A.M.
One of my favorite letsrun posts of all time (and I've read a LOT of letsrun threads going back ten years). Bravo.
Freelove wrote:
That's just a scenario you made up in your head. More likely he had coaches, agents, or whomever from the tri world whispering in his ear all along about how much money he could make in triathlons. This decision is all about the money, and you can see it in that Slowtwitch interview of his. C.R.E.A.M.
But what you post here is only slightly more based on the publicly known facts than what the Adams State dude said. I think his post was one of the most insightful, because it shows that we just don't know the situation. In general, I think quitting the team shortly before regionals/nationals is pretty crappy, but again there could be all kinds of things going on that we don't know about. Team loyalty in many cases is something I take seriously, but there are many other factors, too. Maybe he wants the money to pay for the treatment of his sick friend's cancer. Who the hell knows?
You think he would have left if he didn't have a choice if he was never good at triathlon? And somehow he wouldn't be a selfish person then? Sounds like you got dumped which I sympathize but no one cares. Its not like people didn't know he always had the wandering eye between running and triathlon for years. You can blame him for having an embarassment of riches that you were willing to spread eagle give him a full ride on your best program hoping he'll stay and now you got dumped. Oh well.
MOUSE wrote:
In the end, this is athletics and he doesn't owe anything to anybody.
You're wrong. The young man was on scholarship, and in addition to that he had an entire coaching staff along with his team mates devoting a great deal of time and effort towards helping him succeed in his athletic career. In return, all they ask is that he competes.
MOUSE wrote:
He did not ROB anyone of anything. UO is sitting at home next monday because the team they fielded yesterday failed to perform well enough to qualify.
Garbage. It has already been statistically proven that if LV had competed as regionals in the same manner he had earlier this season, they would have qualified. Additionally, if he as simply going to abandon them the UO athletic department could have devoted his scholarship to a talented young guy who would actually run at regionals! Instead, they received absolutely nothing in return. Pathetic.
MOUSE wrote:
Athletes have an very short window of time to maximize their successes, and sometimes you need to make tough decisions with self-interest in mind.
So, you are telling me that LV's "window of time to maximize (his) success" is so small, he couldn't wait another 2 or 3 weeks before he started his triathlon career? I'm sorry, but do you realize how absolutely ridiculous that sounds? You have made some good points, but that definitely isn't one of them. That sounds more like an excuse that you used to hear during an episode of Seinfeld!
rojo wrote:
Truthiness wrote:proof this board is bought and paid for by Nike, Salazar, U of O, and Phil Knight.
Frankly its disgusting. Solinsky is practically ignored because he was first before Rupp.
Heavy heavy Nike slant on this board.
Don't ever let the facts get in the way of a conspiracy.
In general, I'd say the people who are most critical of LetsRun are the Oregon/Nike/Salazar/Rupp people as they aren't used to being criticized. They certainly think we are slanted against them.
To my knowledge, Nike has never spent a dime advertising directly with us and yet you say we are biased towards them. I'll copy your post and send it to the the Oregon crew the next time they complain about something.
In reality, LetsRun.com is popular because we aren't afraid to call a spade spade. If Webb, Rupp, Lukas, Oregon does something stupid, we'll say it. The elites aren't used to it and often get upset but if you want to read a press release, go to any other running website.
In this case, I don't think it's over blown to be criticizing Lukas at all. I do have a few reservations because he's 18 years old but not a lot.
Thht being said, I do think the 'real' adults need to be criticized even more here than he is- particularly the US Triathlon people. In all honesty, if I were them, they should be like "We're thrilled you want to do the triathlon. Please finish out the season at UO."
Let's don't act like this is some naive kid without advisors. He was allowed to manipulate his image for much of last year. If you are going to do that, then you can get ripped when you screw up.
When Lukas was running the Reebok indoor meet last year (or was it adidas outdoors?), his country was original listed as LIT but then his people had it changed to USA even though he isn't an American citizen. Clearly, Lukas and his handlers want him to be considered an American as the endorsement dollars are way, way bigger for Americans. The manipulation has worked as Lukas' wikipedia page calls him a Lithuanian-American athlete even though he's not an American citizen.
Ultimately, Lukas will be a US citizen and I'll be glad he's competing for the greatest country on earth - where he has made his home. But if you are playing in the major leagues and doing PR type things to control your image, then you have to be willing to be criticized.
What's wrong with society in the year 2011 is people think they can do just what is right for them without any thought as to what it means for others.
Michael Jordan wasn't ripped for pursuing his baseball dream but he would have been ripped if three days before the playoffs he said he was going to try baseball.
Agreed.
Will the sun rise this morning ? Or will the pity party continue. Let's whie:
Woe is me. I'm the victim. Lukas is a meaning weenie. Lukas is an asiactical hay tor from Lithuania. Lukas left my team so I won't get the new team biggy baggy for my mummy fro X-mas. Lukas should go back to his communinist counntry and kill Jews like Stalin. Lukas beats up little kids. Lukas tortures hamsters. Lukas pees in the toilet w/o lifting the seat. Lukas never replaced the toilet paper when it ran out in the dorm. Lukas never brushed his teeth. Lukas made me punch the wholes in his school handouts since he said "I'm a World Champion". Lukas never game one meth addict his potato chips like the team always did at Hayward. Lukas never paced but expected everyone else to pace. Lukas never let the ladies go 1st unless she was black and wanted to scope out het ass. Lukas made fun of Mexcians. Lukas likes the Ku Klux Klan. Lukas is a Hamasnik. Lukas wants everyone to have an abortion even in cases of rape. Lukas hates Palestinians. Lukas wants the Hutus massacred. Lukas thinks Chinese are Chinky. Lukas thinhs pale white skin people are better than everyone else. I hate Lukas. Woe is me.
Added Perspective wrote:
[
You're wrong. The young man was on scholarship, and in addition to that he had an entire coaching staff along with his team mates devoting a great deal of time and effort towards helping him succeed in his athletic career. In return, all they ask is that he competes.
Garbage. It has already been statistically proven that if LV had competed as regionals in the same manner he had earlier this season, they would have qualified. Additionally, if he as simply going to abandon them the UO athletic department could have devoted his scholarship to a talented young guy who would actually run at regionals! Instead, they received absolutely nothing in return. Pathetic.
[So, you are telling me that LV's "window of time to maximize (his) success" is so small, he couldn't wait another 2 or 3 weeks before he started his triathlon career? I'm sorry, but do you realize how absolutely ridiculous that sounds? You have made some good points, but that definitely isn't one of them. That sounds more like an excuse that you used to hear during an episode of Seinfeld!
Yes, his teammates and coaching staff did have a lot of hope tied up in him for a long, successful career. He was on scholarship at UO. This still doesn't mean he is obligated to stay, or that he owes them anything. He only owes it to himself to make the best choice for him. You want to call him a thief for taking what is his.
If he lines up Saturday, maybe UO is going to nationals next week. From what we've heard, he wasn't with the team for at least a week before the announcement was made. He didn't just pack up and leave 3 days before regionals. The team had plenty of time to accept his decision and ready themselves to compete without him. Now, the blame for them missing NCAAs has been placed completely on LV's shoulders and the rest of the team has been let off the hook while, if you look at the results, they underperformed almost across the board
MOUSE wrote:
Athletes have an very short window of time to maximize their successes, and sometimes you need to make tough decisions with self-interest in mind.
Added Perspective wrote:
So, you are telling me that LV's "window of time to maximize (his) success" is so small, he couldn't wait another 2 or 3 weeks before he started his triathlon career? I'm sorry, but do you realize how absolutely ridiculous that sounds? You have made some good points, but that definitely isn't one of them. That sounds more like an excuse that you used to hear during an episode of Seinfeld!
I notice that MOUSE didn't answer this. It's amazing how often you see people on the losing end of a debate who conveniently forget to reply when they obviously know that they're wrong.
Kids his age are old enough to sign up to fight for us. They don't puss out in Iraq and Afaganistan. LV is nothing compared to them and doesn't deserve to represent us in anyway.
MOUSE wrote:
Notachance wrote:You are so right. He's only 18-19. He should be allowed to puss out until he's at least 27-28.
The fact that you are even using the term 'puss out' just shows that you are bitter because of your own selfish desire to see him compete only as a runner. He isn't 'pussing out' of anything. He's making the decision that he thinks is best for his career as an athlete, regardless of how the USA distance running community feels about it. Nobody on here will agree, but I see his decision as bravery rather than cowardice. The amount of pressure on him is certainly unbelievable. Im sure that nobody on here bashing him would ever be able to understand the pressure that he is feeling to drop tri. and run. It takes a huge amount of courage to walk away from that and pursue what he thinks is HIS dream, not the dream all the sh*tbirds on here
missing in action wrote:
I notice that MOUSE didn't answer this. It's amazing how often you see people on the losing end of a debate who conveniently forget to reply when they obviously know that they're wrong.
Because that is exactly why LV is catching cr ap. Nobody said he should stay 4 yrs and go pro, but he should have stayed 2 more weeks.
Maybe I'm dumb, but aren't athletics the most common place we learn concepts like team work, loyalty, dedication, follow through, honesty, etc?
Considering we are all on the same team, to see someone we, on some level, trusted to represent us at our best doing what we love is seen as a betrayal. I don't think that's overstepping any boundaries.
Isn't this similar to "dopers"? How some people defend it as just a part of the sport, and others deride it as a breach of trust?
I think that's the real issue. People are mad at LV because they feel betrayed by LV whom they supported and trusted to achieve when and where they haven't or can't.
There are 14 and 15 year-old boys and girls at my local high school who have the integrity to not abandon their teams just before championship season. So, don't give me that "he's just a kid" crap. If no one calls him on selfish dick moves at an early age, he will just continue to do so well into his adulthood and probably for the rest of his life, like so many other coddled athletes.
People are disappointed that L.V. did not have the decency to finish the cross country season, a three week commitment, giving his team mates a chance to qualify for nations. No one begrudges him for leaving to become a triathlete. If you don't understand the difference you need either English or morality lessons.
NotaDuck wrote:
People are disappointed that L.V. did not have the decency to finish the cross country season, a three week commitment, giving his team mates a chance to qualify for nations. No one begrudges him for leaving to become a triathlete. If you don't understand the difference you need either English or morality lessons.
OK - we are in general agreement, then. LOL