Sad story from the 1988 Men's Olympic Trials 1500m

Should alcohol be banned? I think we tried that once.

GUH wrote:

[quote]

Like I said, alcohol is society's illness. Plenty of statistics on marital, financial, traffic, and health problems are the proof for this.

shocking wrote:

A shocking story...I mean 4:11 is really the fastest time any high school runner from Colorado has ever run?

CHSAA for record purposes only accepts marks set in Colorado soil and during the season so post season marks or outside the state don't count. Here is a list of the top mile/1500 times run by Colorado preps

MILE + - converted from meters

1 Connor Winter Arapahoe 11 4:07.02 Distance Gala-Lisle, IL 6/11 (2nd)

2 Mohamud Ige Denver South 06 4:08.06 Music City Distance Carnival-Nashville, TN 6/3 (8th)

3 * Bryan Dillion Sterling 00 4:08.56 Foot Locker-Raleigh, NC 6/17 (4th)

4 * Charles White Cherry Creek 07 4:09.36 Nike Outdoor-Greensboro, NC 6/16 (h3 4th)

5 Daniel Roberts Crested Butte Acad. 06 4:10.10 Arcadia-Arcadia, CA 4/08 (2nd)

6 Steve Kresl Ft. Collins 80 4:10.26 Golden West-Sacramento, CA 6/14 (5th)

7 Walter Schafer Cherry Creek 10 4:10.51 Distance Gala-Lisle, IL 6/12 (5th)

8 Mike Peterson Mapleton 70 4:11.1 Golden Mid-West, Lomard, IL 6/13 (1st)

9 Manuel Miranda Doherty 77 4:11.4 Atlanta Classic-Atlanta, GA 6/4 (2nd-tie)

10 Randy Stoneman Aurora Central 76 4:11.7 International Prep-Evanston, IL 6/12 (4th)

11 Ryan Deak Smoky Hill 04 4:12.22 Arcadia-Arcadia, CA 4/10 (1st)

12 Rich Martinez Widefield 81 4:12.45+ State Meet Final

13 Jon Luff Denver South 86 4:12.63+ Golden West-Sacramento, CA 6/14 (5th)

14 Jared Scott Lewis Palmer 00 4:13.2 Golden West-Sacramento, CA 6/11 (8th)

15 Tom Reese Wheatridge 94 4:13.84 Prefontaine Classic-Eugene, OR 6/4 (3rd)

1500 METERS

1 Alex Accetta Durango 88 3:49.06 Junior TAC Meet-Tallahasse, FL 6/25 (6th) =4:07.3 Mile!

2 Charles White Cherry Creek 08 3:49.62 Boston HP Series-Waltham, MA 5/24 (1st)

3 Jon Luff Denver South 86 3:51.94 Great Southwest Classic-Tempe, AZ 5/31 (1st)

4 * Andy Samuelson Rampart 88 3:52.2 Great Southwest Classic-Tempe, AZ 5/28 (4th)

5 Steve Kresl Ft. Collins 80 3:52.86 Great Southwest Classic, Tempe, AZ 5/31 (2nd)

6 * Rich Martinez Widefield 80 3:56.18 National Jr. Olympics-San Jose, CA 8/17 (4th)

7 * Walter Schafer Cherry Creek 09 3:57.56 Midwest Distance Gala-Lisle, IL 6/13 (9th) enroute

8 * Alex Clayton Liberty 02 3:57.72 USATF Jr. Olympics-Omaha, NE 7/28 (2nd)

9 Michael Williams Colo. Sprgs Christian 07 3:58.48 USATF Jr. Olympics-Walnut, CA 7/29 (2nd)

10 Ian Burrell Air Academy 03 3:58.54 Great Southwest-Albuquerque, NM 5/24 (3rd)

11 Nate Butler Green Mountain 89 3:58.7 Great Southwest Classic-Tempe, AZ 5/27

12 ** Bryan Dillon Sterling 99 3:58.63 USATF Jr. Olympics-Omaha, NE 7/31 (1st)

13 * Jared Scott Lewis Palmer 99 3:58.66 USATF Jr. Olympics-Omaha, NE 7/31 (2nd)

{YAWN}

Blowing.Rock Master wrote:

GUH wrote:

And alcohol limits your ability to exert self-control.

No it doesn't, but it makes for a convenient excuse.

Are you honestly stupid enough to think that alcohol doesn't impair people's judgment and hence their ability to control their own behavior? It's one thing to say that someone with an alcohol problem who goes out and drinks anyway has exhibited a lack of self-control, but if you're claiming that even drunk people can behave reasonably if they only try hard enough, then you are even dumber than your other stupid posts have already established. (This is not to excuse anyone's behavior under the influence; it's just a statement of medical fact.)

Another dead beat father.

The man is a selfish A-hole

AK-53 wrote:

Should alcohol be banned? I think we tried that once.

GUH wrote:

[quote]

Like I said, alcohol is society's illness. Plenty of statistics on marital, financial, traffic, and health problems are the proof for this.

I'm aware (having stated it in the post prior). It is a pity that the ban failed, but that is because of the difficulty of enforcing the ban, and because it happened before a period of great economic upheaval (the great depression).

At this point in time it is simply impractical to ban it, because it is so deeply rooted in American culture/ society, and like any evil rooted in society, it is extremely difficult to get rid of. Even an illness like slavery cost over 600,000 lives [civil war] before being defeated outright in 1865.

GUH wrote:

Ha. You are in denial. I would think that you'd know better.

I do, that's why I don't blame my problems on inanimate objects.

This is why I love this site. Blowing Rock Master is matching GUH's sanctimony stride-for-stride with his shameless, even proud ignorance. I think I'd rather listen to a gibbering proselytizer than a garden-variety idiot.

In that case, it's probably also providing various health benefits to you, both physical and psycho-social. That strikes me as an excellent reason to continue to approve the consumption of alcohol in moderation, even for elite athletes. It wasn't doing me a heck of a lot of good when I was drinking a fifth of vodka a day, on top of the g&t's before dinner and the wine with, but that doesn't mean other people should be denied their cocktails.

runn wrote:

I'm drinking a beer as I read this. You know, it's never been a negative force in my life. I can control it. Sometimes, rarely, I get just a little drunk but never out of control and I can always get up and run the next day.

Blowing.Rock Master wrote:

GUH wrote:

Ha. You are in denial. I would think that you'd know better.

I do, that's why I don't blame my problems on inanimate objects.

But how about on a habit related to these so-called "inanimate objects?" How about a habit brought about by a known reaction to these "inanimate objects?" How about the culture surrounding these "inanimate objects," despite this known reaction?

You can argue for the sake of arguing all day if you simply enjoy being petty.

Blowing Chunks Masshole wrote:

Are you honestly stupid enough to think that alcohol doesn't impair people's judgment and hence their ability to control their own behavior? It's one thing to say that someone with an alcohol problem who goes out and drinks anyway has exhibited a lack of self-control, but if you're claiming that even drunk people can behave reasonably if they only try hard enough, then you are even dumber than your other stupid posts have already established. (This is not to excuse anyone's behavior under the influence; it's just a statement of medical fact.)

How many people are there who get drunk without having that first drink? Self control means not having that first drink, or stopping before you become impaired? Alcohol's not the reason you can't control yourself, you are. Take responsibility for your actions and quit trying to blame something else. Weenie.

Don't really have much remorse for this guy after reading the article. There's just one person to blame: himself.

I imagine you're a firm believer in predestination too, right?

Altitude wrote:

There is nothing east of the front-range to speak of, looks just like western Kansas and slopes from 5000 ft to about 3000 ft at the border of Kansas, but no cities to speak of.

If you consider one of the countries 50 largest cities "no city to speak of" then I guess you are right or Boulder or Denver for that matter.

Also, the front range is hardly the middle of CO either.

Blowing.Rock Master wrote:

How many people are there who get drunk without having that first drink? Self control means not having that first drink, or stopping before you become impaired?

This is called "moving the goalposts." There's a difference between not taking a drink at all and not stopping once you've started, and you attempt to conflate them. I spelled this difference out with exquisite clarity in my previous post, and (surprise, surprise) you obviously didn't get it.

Watch someone with a real drinking problem try to exert self-control after a couple of drinks if more booze is available. It doesn't happen. This isn't to excuse the drunkenness of the guy in the article or my piss drunk mother in Somerville or anyone else, but if you think that the difference between you and a truly addicted person boils down to willpower alone, well, then I guess the reason you were never world class is because you're a pussy compared to the greats and just didn't push yourself hard enough.

Also, don't lecture me as if I have a drinking problem, I have no use for the stuff. Calories without nutrients? I can do better.

Sir Lance-alot wrote:

"It is estimated that 26,000 fewer deaths were averted due to reductions in heart disease, stroke and diabetes from the benefits attributed to moderate alcohol consumption."

This is one of those statistics that not only can't be verified, but attempts to superimpose population trends on individuals.

Okay, say there are a lot of people out there stuffing themselves with fat-laden meats and drinking two glasses of wine a night, and say there are a bunch more who eat the meat but either don't drink or goo way too heavy on the booze. The former group is spared adverse coronary events that the abstainers and the drunkards suffer.

Now take someone like me who eats a lowfat and generally healthful diet and doesn't drink at all. With a cholesterol of 160 would I really be better off adding a couple of drinks a day into my routine? I doubt it.

I have seen the CDC claim that obesity causes a few hundred thousand deaths a year. They have revised this figure numerous times. yes, being fat is bad for your health but when anyone tries to quantitate this kind of thing they've soared off into lala land.

This is foolishness. Any malady that alcohol claims to treat, there are plenty of alternatives. Its harms far outweighs any proposed benefits: 26000 people *thought to be* saved by alcohol (which is ridiculous, how can anyone quantify this?) versus 50000-90000 or so who either died of abuse or traffic related etc... it is much easier to quantify the latter, and the number far outweighs the former.

Well, as long as it pertains to American culture, more and more people will be brutally murdered, or else have their lives or families torn apart. It all begins with the first sip...

Well, if Jesus turned water into wine, it must not be SOOOOOO bad...

GUH wrote:

This is foolishness. Any malady that alcohol claims to treat, there are plenty of alternatives.

Yes, it's a cheap rationalization that allows drinkers to think they're not only not hurting themselves by consuming a poison in moderate amounts, but are in fact improving their health. People say the same shit about other questionable but popular and not-going-anywhere habits -- video games may improve reflexes, so playing them 5 hours a day is actually beneficial! Some sumo wrestler finished a marathon in 8 hours, suffering badly, therefore you can be fit AND fat! The list goes on. Cognitive dissonance theory in action, abetted by the media and even the medical community.