Cliff Lee: One of the greatest postseason pitchers ever

Nobody's gonna hold claim to the greatest ever without at least one ring to show for it - no matter what the sport is. Lee is likely gonna need more than one ring (and a lot more than 7 wins) to make the short list on this one, sorry. There are a lot of solid pitchers that owned their piece of October going back decades. Not sure why you can't just say his pitching is lights-out right now and just leave it at that.

Guy at the gym wrote:

Make that 7-0 and 1.26 ERA for the greatest postseason pitcher of all time.

Because of the rampant use of PEDs in MLB today, Cliff Lee's stats are invalid and cannot be compared to the old days of the majors.

Wendell Gee wrote:

Do you really think Texas will beat NY? I am very doubtful. With Lee in Game 3 and Burnett lined up to hand over Game 4 to Texas, NY would have to win 5,6,7 (against Lee!) to win it. I'll be shocked if NY wins.

I do agree Philadelphia is the best team. They are loaded and should win this series. If Texas goes 7 and Lee can't pitch three times against Philly, I can't see Texas winning the series.

You're right, Yankees are in a lot of trouble. I doubt Burnett pitches game 4 now. They need to go to CC on short rest. He's proven in the past that he can handle it, when he dominated the end of the season with the Brewers. If the Rangers win one more game w/o Lee on the mound, it appears the series is over. Amazing game tonight. All his pitches were money. I'd like to see Lee go into Philly and pitch lights out, that would make a good story line.

Lee, Lincecum, and Halliday are as heavily doped as Solinsky, Symmonds, and Rupp.

Why do all of you Ftards want to compare everybody to everybody else?

Can't you just watch and enjoy? What Cliff Lee did this evening was a pure joy to watch. Never got above 93 mph and had the yanks guessing all night and usually guessing wrong. He is the one guy right now I adjust my schedule to watch pitch.

Seriously, is there an American or World Record in track or distance running that isn't Drug aided? There is a troll on the loose (or several) who obviously hate on baseball because their father was too busy to play catch with their wimpy ass.

n=8

Lee has now had 8 starts in the post-season and his team has won them all (7 wins and a no decision team win).

He really looks like he is having fun, too.

Is he going to be a Yankee next year?

toro wrote:

n=8

Lee has now had 8 starts in the post-season and his team has won them all (7 wins and a no decision team win).

He really looks like he is having fun, too.

Is he going to be a Yankee next year?

I don't think he'll be a Yankee. I have a feeling Texas will retain him. Although they've had budget issues, I've read that Texas was interested in bidding for the Japanese pitcher Yu Darvish. What is the point of bidding for him if you already have one of the top pitchers in the game? I think they find a way to lock Lee up, winning a WS would make it easier. Regardless, I just don't see him pitching in pinstripes next year, but perhaps that's just wishful thinking.

I posted this thread on the homepage BEFORE the game last night.

Cliff Lee is so good that jinxes don't apply.

I wasn't sure what all the outrage on AJ Burnett was. Then I saw he was 10-15 with a 5. ERA.

Who the hell was the Yankees 5th starter then? That is aweful.

And why the hell does he get $16 million a year. It looks like the Blue Jays are the ones who upped his salary after a 10-8 season in 2007.

Tommy Hunter was 13-4 this year. I didn't realize he was that good.

Go Rangers!

Like I said Cliff Lee rocks. We need more Asian pitchers!!

wejo wrote:

Then I saw he was 10-15 with a 5. ERA.

That's not 10-15 with some mediocre offense either. 10-15 with the Yankees. You have to really suck to do that.

By the way, after August 1st, 1-7 with a 6.61. They were 1-3 in his no decisions.

I agree, I'd start CC on short rest. Or one of the younger pitchers.

toro wrote:

As a Phillies fan, I like Oswalt but still wish they would have kept Cliff Lee and JA Happ for that matter instead getting Oswalt.

Can't complain too much about the rotation but Halladay, Lee, Hamels and Happ would be sweet.

Halladay, Oswalt, Hamels and Blanton ain't too shabby, though.

Umm...if the Phillies had kept Lee, they would not now have Halladay. Your team has the best starting pitching in MLB right now (PERHAPS the Cardinals could have an argument, but I still say Phillies)...be glad about that brother.

If Lee gets a ring with the Rangers, there is a good chance that he will stay with them. He is married with kids and Arlington, TX is only a 1 hour flight or 5 hour drive away from his permanent residence in Little Rock, AR. This is the closest he has ever been to home.

The trade to get Halladay did not involve Lee. The Phillies traded prospects with Toronto to get Halladay.

The same day or next day they traded Lee away to Seattle to get their prospects.

They didn't have to make the trade with Seattle, so they could have had both Halladay and Lee (and Happ) to go with Hamels.

They then went on to trade prospects, including JA Happ who was doing well in the majors, for Oswalt.

The Phillies could have Halladay and Lee but only for this year as Lee is a free agent after this year and the cost to keep him and pay Halladay would be too high as someone pointed out.

So getting Oswalt helps ease the pain of losing Lee. No I really can't complain.

By the way, Burnett dominated the Phillies in game 2 of last year's WS in a game where Pedro Martinz pitched well. That prevented the Phillies from taking a 2-0 lead heading back to Philly and I think was the pivitol game of the Series.

Yeah I agree. I was thinking only in terms of statistics when I said that. Nobody else has had 8 postseason starts and not had a loss. As for the people who say he needs to win the big ones before he can be counted as one of the greatest, it's not Cliff's fault his team couldn't get the job done. He won both his starts against the Yankees, but the Phillies blew it all other games he didn't pitch.

Wendell Gee wrote:

wejo wrote:

Then I saw he was 10-15 with a 5. ERA.

That's not 10-15 with some mediocre offense either. 10-15 with the Yankees. You have to really suck to do that.

By the way, after August 1st, 1-7 with a 6.61. They were 1-3 in his no decisions.

I agree, I'd start CC on short rest. Or one of the younger pitchers.

The problem with CC on 3 days rest is then do you keep the rest of the rotation on 3 days rest?

I take it the Yankees 5th starter is worse.

wejo wrote:

I take it the Yankees 5th starter is worse.

In my opinion, no. The problem is, AJ Burnett makes so much $$. If you don't use him in a 4-man rotation, when is he ever going to get used.

I'm not saying I feel that way, but I suspect that's management's take. I'd rather see Moseley/Nova or a combination of relievers with Joba starting than rely on Burnett. Maybe he'll surprise me.

ummm Moe, Cliff Lee is not Asian but I think you know that.

Sorry, I must have been thinking about his Taiwan counterpart Criff Ree.