LeBron doesn't owe the city of Cleveland anything.

timbroerocks

Message:

I am so tired of people saying he had nothing around him... They had the best record in the NBA back-to-back years

Glad that your on a running website, cause this statement shows your lack of understanding of basketball....Lebron is extremely talented, and had solid players around him, however you can not compare the teams Jordan had to the teams Lebron had. First off Jordan got to play with Pippen in while both of them was in their prime, yes Pippen wasn't that great as the first option on a team....however he was one of the GREATS as a number 2 option with all the focus on Jordan. Secondly, name a single player that Cleveland added to play Robin to Lebron's Batman that either wasn't past his prime already or wasn't overpaid/overrated? (Be careful and think about this one) Thirdly, having the best record in the regular season, ha ha ha.....well that does prove that Lebron does make the surronding players around him better, HOWEVER the surronding players around him are not good enough for playoff basketball. The difference between playoff basketball and the regular season is SUBSTANTIAL!!! Regular season your constantly traveling and each team/coach has very little time to prepare for each other....this favors Cleveland as Mike Brown is a good coach but not good enough to make the adjustments needed to win a best of 7 against teams like Boston and Orlando. Too many holes in Cleveland gets exposed in a 7 game serious where the team can actually prepare for you and make adjustments.....such has a real number 2 option for Cleveland, and Mike Browns lack of ability to adjust his game plan.

So you are correct in the fact that Cleveland has had the best record in the regular season 2 years in a row, and that statement alone makes your argument....UNLESS you actually dig a little deeper and take a real unbias look at why and how is this possible!!!

AND another thing NO Cleveland did not help to build Lebron up to what he is....the NBA did that, no matter where Lebron went he was going to be built up the same way, minus the hometown hero.....and that portion is only important to the people in OH, if even then!!!!!!!

Not Classy

Message:

Don't try arguing with Nat Turner and NObama, they have no idea what they're talking about, just like most of the people not from Ohio spouting off in this thread.

Who do you think gave the ok for the Cavs to sign all those free agents? I'm pretty sure LeBron had a pretty big influence on it. LeBron forced the Cavs to mortgage their cap space in order to win now. The Cavs would have had around 24 million in cap space had they not traded for Jamison, enough to sign a Wade or Bosh or Stoudimire.

Ahhh yes Lebron forced management to make piss poor decisions, got to love that argument.....since no one knows if this is true, and even you admittedly say your only pretty sure....think about this

People said this about Jordan also, however after he retired and everything was analyzed, it came out that Jordan was very displeased with a lot of moves the Bulls made until they actually panned out(I believe this to be very true based on Jordan's track record making personnel decisions with Washington and now Charlotte)...hmmmm seemed like Bulls management got it right in this regard and Cleveland didnt. It is one thing to keep your superstar happy and another thing to let a player make management decisions.

I know that if I was Gilbert or the GM there is no way in hell that Lebron is make personnel decisions....he may not like it initially but at the end of the day if I put the right pieces around him and we win the Championship, all is forgotten and forgiven. Lebron is a player for a reason, Management is management for a reason, well obviously not in the Cleveland situation though!!

And in regards to there cap space, lol no they would not have had 24 million in cap space if they didnt trade for Jamison...they wouldnt even had enough cap space to sign a top tier free agent, since their cap space was maxed out the only room to maneuver was through trades...Lets not forget the Cavs could have traded for Amare, but the Cavs didnt want to give up JJ Hickson, and they also thought Amare was too much of a defensive liability...well isnt that funny considering Brown wouldnt give Hickson the PT he needed and Jamison turned out to be a huge defensive reliability

give us one shred of evidence that he quit on the team. his playoff numbers were 29/9.3/7.6, 1.8 blocks, fifty percent shooting. That's hall of fame, not hall of shame.

Once again, you show just how little you understand about the NBA. Last season, the Cavs traded Ilgauskas' 11M dollar expiring contract for Jamison's 11M dollar non-expiring contract. Also, Jamison's salary goes up this year. Add that to the roughly 8M the Cavs have in cap space (it might be more since Stern boosted the cap by roughly 2M to help this whole fiasco), and your up to around 20M. Still not enough? West's contract can be bought out for roughly 500k, saving the Cavs or whoever will eventually trade for him another couple million.

So, what does this mean? It means you should STFU if you don't have any idea what you're talking about. I'm sure the truth will come out about LeBron sooner or later (Shaq, from what I've heard, is chomping at the bit), so I'll stick to my opinions and you can stick to yours, because you have just as many facts as I do about the matter.

Oh, and I'm sure you'll say LeBron's contract would eat most of this up. Well, if money isn't important to him, and winning is, he could have signed for his 15M like he probably will in Miami, and the Cavs would still have had enough room to get a pretty good player (I'm not sure how the Bird exemption works exactly, but the Cavs would not be able to max the salary cap and then sign James).

This also didn't count the fact the the Cavs also accept Telfair's 2.5M dollar contract. So, basically, the cavs would have a little more than 10M in cap space if they didn't make the trade for Jamison, even if they resigned Lebron.

First off, Jordan MADE Pippen who he was. Take Jordan away and he is aa average, a 15 points per night guy. He could play Defense I will not deny that. The Cavs team was built on Lebron's requests... That was all over the papers in Ohio for years and he admitted to asking for specific guys to be brought in. No, he did not have a number two option who was playoff worthy, but as I said before, neither did Jordan, he made Pippen better. Take a look at Pippens numbers without Mike. Now, take a look at Mo Williams numbers before he came to Cleveland. They are actually comparable to Pippens without Jordan. I do not think that Mo Williams was a great number two, but his numbers declined (compared to the previous two seasons) when he came to Cleveland. I do believe that Jamison should have been a good number two for this season. Not for the future, but Lebron wanted to win now. Once again, a player came to Cleveland and got worse. Jamison is a career, 20 pts per game guy, and he averaged 15 a night in Cleveland. Sure, you can say he was past his prime but his numbers over the past 3 years, including this season, didn't show that. This is not all on those two guys. The offensive scheme was horrible, and firing the coach was going to change that. I find it ironic that all season the NBA commentators talked about them being one of the deepest team in the league but now, Cleveland didn't do enough to help him... The guy had 6 role players and two guys that were formidable players, most that he helped management decide to pick up. They couldn't elavate their games in the playoffs and he couldn't help them do it.

As far as the NBA building him up, not Cleveland. Have you been to Cleveland in the last 7 years, or even the year before he was drafted? The place is a mad house for him. Cleveland was worshipping Lebron before the NBA was. They fed his ego to be what it is today. The NBA just picked that up and made it national.

And you are right, I know nothing about basketball. I just watched all this Lebron stuff and decided to comment on this thread. The man deserved to go wherever he wanted. I do not deny that. But could have handled himself with a little more grace towards the city of Cleveland. I think he could be one of the greats. There is no denying that.

I also understand the difference between regular season basketball and playoff basketball. But there is some window for success to transfer to the playoffs. That was coaching, not the players around him. Like I said above, Mike Brown getting fired should have encouraged Lebron. They brought in a run and gun coach and that is how the Cavs are built. Mike Brown is not a good offensive basketball coach, and he was sub-par at making adjustments at half time of games.

I was ready for him to leave when he threw his jersey off after getting bounced in the 2nd round by the Celtics. He handled the situation like a dick, plain and simple. He understands the NBA and how free agency works. Like someone said before, if he gave Gilbert a warning, maybe 2 weeks ago, we could have at least tried to make some moves. Using Bosh's disinterest in Cleveland as an excuse is a complete cop out.

On the other hand, he never liked Cleveland in the first place. He wore the Yankee cap to the Indians/Yankees playoff game. He wore his allegiance to the Cowboys on his sleeve. He was that annoying kid we all knew growing up that always cheered for the big city teams when his hometown played them. This decision is nothing new to him. Loyalty means nothing to Lebron. Though he grew up in Akron, Cleveland is still the city in the national spotlight in northern Ohio. I grew up in a sizable city 30 mins outside of Cleveland, but I'm still a die hard fan. The whole "Akron is my home" BS is another part of his excuse to have no connection with Cleveland.

I was listening to AM 850 in Cleveland this morning and I'm convinced that as far as sports go, this is good for Cleveland. The city is blue collar and Lebron is not. The team that breaks the curse should fit the mold. We need to rely on a team effort, not one individual. I'll bump this in a few years when the Browns win the AFC north and play in the super bowl. Cleveland is down, but not out. The people that aren't from here and have never spent time here can say what you want. The connection to the city and it's people is strong, if you understand. So please stop with the bashing. I moved away but I'll come back from time to time and watch every game possible. I can't imagine cheering for another city to succeed.

Having Josh Cribbs as the city's superstar is pretty ironic. He's an undrafted free agent from Kent State who grew up in DC, and he's mostly a special teams guy. He has no family ties to Cleveland, but he totally fits the mold. The guy let Cleveland into his heart will forever be immortalized in the city. He has worked his way up from obscurity to being a perennial pro bowler. This is the kind of guy that championship teams are made of and the guy that Cleveland will unquestionably support. Good riddance, Lebron.

NOT CLASSY,

So what your saying is that Lebron, not Cavs management is to blame for these poor decisions made. It is real easy and convenient to blame Lebron now that he has chosen to leave. Now that everyone had their feelings hurt, and hopes and dreams crushed, now it is time to Bash Lebron.....If what your saying is true about Lebron being so horrible, why does anyone care that he left? Dont give me some BS answer about it is how he did it, cause that is some BS it didnt matter how he went about it he was still going to get bashed.

Since I am not the expert, explain to me how much cap space the cavs would have after signing Lebron to a MAX contract....since that would really be the only incentive for him to stay with Cleveland, since the Cavs are unable to draw a top tier FA to sign with them.

Bosh wouldnt even go to Cleveland, even though all the reports say Lebron tried to get him to.....Amare? Nope

Wade? Nope

Boozer? Nope, left the first time for a reason(and yes part of that reason is the Jazz offered more money)

Can u explain to me why with Shaqs $20 million contract now gone the Cavs dont have more cap space? Hmmmmmm try out ESPN Insider, it will break it down Barney style for you.....Oh and also read all about the different Cap space rules involving trades!

So I am sorry I obviously hurt your feelings, but I am extremely confident now from your last post your the one that needs to STFU cause you dont know crap about the salary cap!!

The bulls had Dennis Rodman.

Yes stop crying and get ready for the biggest laugh in sports history. The Heat may do okay during the regular season but come playoff time this immature bunch will roll over at the first hint of adversity just like Lebron did during the Celtics series.

MARK MY WORDS! The Heat dont make it past the first round!

You are sooo stupid...here let me break this down for you:

The Cav were over the salary cap last year, by alot. Remember, they wanted to win now for LeBron. The salary cap last year was around 58M, and the Cavs total salary was around 75-80M. That is why Shaq's 21M dollar contract coming off the books didn't matter at all. In fact, the Cavs were already over the cap before they resigned Varejao and using the MLE to sign Parker and Moon. You got that? Or do you need ESPN insider to hold your hand and talk you through it?

I'm fairly confident the Cavs would have had around 8-10M in cap space and the trade assests to pull off sign-and-trade for a max contract (West, Hickson, Varejao were rumored for Bosh, along with draft picks) if LeBron resigned to a max contract. So, yeah, my last comment still holds: STFU if you don't know what you are talking about.

this explains it.

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/random-friday-fun-31.jpg

LOL, hmmmmm well you forgot to speak about the cap holds that are hurting the Cavs cap space, and those cap holds are not going anywhere anytime soon( that is why the cavs were way over the cap space)....or do you not understand how this works and want me to hold your hand and explain it for you??

Lets be realistic, since you dont seem to understand that even IF the cavs would have opened up enough cap space for 2 max contracts (and yes this is plausible to say they would have, hence look at Miami and Chicago they did it...but miami and chicago are better run organizations that dont blame there piss poor decisions on a player), there wasn't and especially now there are not ANY FA worth a crap that wanted to go to Cleveland even with Lebron there.....so follow those rumors all you want, was never going to happen....so really this argument over how much cap space they woulda shoulda or coulda had is rather pointless.

I hope you enjoy your basketball season without Lebron, can you say LOTTERY?

You just keep getting dumber by the post, you should really stop. The only major cap holds the Cavs had were LeBron (which goes away if he resigns) and Shaq (which goes away when the Cavs renounce their rights to him). The other cap holds are Eyanga (who plays overseas) and an empty roster spot which count for less than 2M against the cap. Basically, all these cap hold did was prevent the Cavs from maxing their cap and then resign James using the Bird exemption.

But yeah, you are right, it's all moot because LeBron was never going to resign here anyway. Instead, the Cavs ended up screwing themselves by resigning Varejao (who James lobbied for very hard) and trading for Jamison (who James also gave the ok to), effectively killing any chance the Cavs had to sign a big name free agent this summer.

But since you are sooooo smart, what would you have done if you were the Cavs GM? Not sign anyone and have Lebron walk? Or make trades and still lose and have LeBron walk? And if you say trade for Stoudemire...hahaha,he wasn't going to help the Cavs win anything either.

I have been driving 2 hours to Cleveland to watch Lebron play for the last 4 years and I already bought season tickets for next year. I have to say Cleveland and their "fans" are pathetic. Everybody talks about how "GREAT" they are. Tell me why the Indians only draw 10k in april and may and 20k during the summer instead of the 44k sellouts for years. Tell me why all they do on the local talk shows was whine and cry about everything which is why I had to stop listening to them. Tell me why they booed Lebron in 2008 in some meaningless regular season game when he missed a couple free throws. Tell me why they booed him and the team this year in the playoffs as soon as things didn't go the Cavs way.

I learned many years ago when I went to an Indians games and listened to the things yelled to Robbie Alomar after he spit on the umpire. A short time later those same fans "loved" him because he was on our side helping us win. Cleveland fans are among some of the stupidest I have ever been around and are real frontrunners that only care when they have a chance to win. Cleveland and the pathetic owner who also showed his true colors over the last couple months deserve what they got.

The ironies about this whole situation are endless.

Selfish fans wanting a championship for themselves calling Lebron selfish for raising a million dollars for charity and giving up money and notoriety (people calling Lebron Scottie Pippen) to try to win which should be the goal of every team and player in the league.

The city known for their river burning were burning Lebron 23 jerseys.

The owner just FIRED the winningest coach the last two years and called Lebron disloyal.

Cleveland would have been mad if Lebron tweeted, e-mailed, text, or wrote the decision on a piece of paper and mailed it to the Plain Dealer.

I am going to be requesting a refund on my season tickets and if the owner is man enough and puts his money where his mouth is he should honor that request. If he doesn't I am hoping to at least sell enough tickets so I can get the cable feed to watch all of Miami's games on tv. I am guessing I can get about 4 times the value for the 2 miami games from bitter cleveland "fanatics" who want to go and boo Lebron the whole game!!!

So you say Cleveland is pathetic and stupid. Isn't Lebron from Cleveland?

Do you even know what frontrunner means? Hahaha! Cleveland hasn't won anything in close to 50 years!

This coming from the guy who says he is going to quit watching the Cavs and start watching the Heat. Who is the front runner? You say Tribe fans are pathetic (the fans who used to have the record for most consectuive sell-outs) and then say you're going to do the same thing with the Cavs. Hahahahaha, the ironies ARE endless.

You know who is pathetic: frontrunners like you who are fans of players instead of fans of teams.

Well your actually way way off on the cap holds

http://www.news-herald.com/articles/2010/05/21/sports/nh2525405.txt

Funny it took me maybe 5 seconds to find this article....and the even funnier thing is it is from an Ohio Newspaper!!

Your right I should stop, because you have repeatedly proven that you post only half the truth if even that, so what is the point??

What would I have done as GM, well for one I would never let ANY player tell me who and who not to sign....reason being, at the end of the day when you surround him with the right pieces to win a championship, that is all that is going to matter.

I would have re-signed Varejao, but only if I was able to get him for his actual value and not some over inflated price!

Would I have traded for Amare, well this one isn't fair cause hindsight is 20/20 and now we all have seen that Jamison was a huge defensive liability and didn't nearly bring the offensive game that Amare did....and well of course the whole age thing, and his expiring contract DEFINITELY makes him a much more attracted trade....and the chance of re-signing Amare and Lebron greatly increases if they win it all.

Also I think the Shaq signing was a little bit of a reach, especially at his age...BUT I do understand considering what happened against Orlando the previous year in the Eastern Conference finals.

Those are just a few things I would have done differently, SINCE YOU ASKED.....however I don't feel that it is really fair of me to say all this, cause I have the vantage point of hindsight, and would I have actually made these moves without knowing all the info I do now??? Maybe, maybe not....but I do know that I wouldn't have let one player dictate such bad personnel decisions....but I also feel that is a cop out for management, to even say it was Lebrons fault.