If Bill McChesney holds the 5k, and 10k records at Oregon, Why is Pre the dominant idol?

In hindsight that late 70s to early 80s period is pretty amazing when you see how well those times have held up. I kind of took it for granted at the time.

Rudy Chapa is another guy who was great in his day but who is kind of forgotten about.

The irony is that Alberto Salazar is the guy who became an American household name. Yet he is the one guy I honestly did not enjoy watching run at Oregon even though he was great. His form seemed ugly to me and of course he had little speed. There was just nothing that dramatic about Salazar on the track. At least in the races I saw in person. The marathon was definitely the right event for him.

Ryan Foreman wrote:

Yet he is the one guy I honestly did not enjoy watching run at Oregon even though he was great. His form seemed ugly to me and of course he had little speed. There was just nothing that dramatic about Salazar on the track. At least in the races I saw in person. The marathon was definitely the right event for him.

You had to love the black socks though. My all-time favorite race to have watched though was Alberto/Rono/Royle over 10,000m at Hayward Field.

I had forgotten that Billy did hold an American road record for the 20km of 59:17 (1983).

What a great post. Billy McChesney certainly is a running legend, and I had some friends who were very close to Billy and his family, and I was fortunate to meet the parents, just great, great people.

I get tired of people like "was there" tarnishing his name, and saying he wasn't charasmatic. I think one of the greater moments in Hayward Field history is when he garnered that 1980 Olympic berth and kissed the track.

I'm a huge Pre fan, have the poster, the t-shirt, that said, Pre had one WSU Kenyan to beat, John Ngeno, and though he was great, he wasn't in the league of Rono (four WR's) or Kimwoumbwa (1 WR), Tuwei, or even Cheriyot, and others. McChesney ran in the heart of that era. Rono and friends would've blown Pre away. McChesney did indeed beat Kimwoumbwa and others.

He was at his best in Europe. Not sure if this is true, but I heard when he ran his 13:14 he got elbowed off the track and had to get back up.

C'mon, let's give Billy his props. He was awesome, curtailed by injuries, running against the Kenyan wall, and heck, his own teammates were better than Pre's teammates.

I only wish I'd met Billy, heard he was a great guy.

I must admit after reading more and more into the Oregon legends I found that this lad was quite good. I just wished he would have had his day in the 1980 Olympics. I wonder if the early days of the Oregon greats were just all clammering to be recognized. They were all great, and as expected wanted to be recognized for their greatness. Maybe a little jealousy between the lot.

Darbyshire from Great Britain wrote:

I must admit after reading more and more into the Oregon legends I found that this lad was quite good. I just wished he would have had his day in the 1980 Olympics. I wonder if the early days of the Oregon greats were just all clammering to be recognized. They were all great, and as expected wanted to be recognized for their greatness. Maybe a little jealousy between the lot.

I'm sure this aspect of bringing together so many talented individuals had to have had both positive impacts as well as negative ones. Whether it was the 60-70s (Pre, Williams, Geis, Kvalheim, etc), the 70-80s (Centrowitz, Salazar, Chapa, McChesney, Hill, Nelson...), or the current collection, I am sure that the desire to improve or just keep up was a huge motivating factor. At the same time that degree of quality can push one over the line from excellent shape to injured. I've often wondered how hard it must be for some to train day in and day out with a group knowing that you are only a few seconds away but seeing them winning Pac-10, Regional, and National titles while you are not racing.

Hey guys,

Thanks for the kind words.

As to the "negative aspects" of so many great athletes back in that day in one place at one time. I don't think there was that much, and remember we also had Athletics West in town too! Imagine the atmosphere around town, guys running past each other in the streets, on Pre's trail etc. It was crazy amazing. And it wasn't just our crew, we had the tail end of Pre's teammates, we had Kenny Moore and Jon Anderson, and Mike Manley, Craig Virgin, stud almuns passing through town. It was quite a time.

The thing is, you did not go to Oregon unless you had the ability to be national class, or were committed to giving it your all - we knew where we were, and what we were there for. We were there to be the best. Very few people get to be elite, like Pre or Salazar, but you know, you either had a great time going for it, or you left.

One of my first few days there I ran into Paul Geis and Scott Daggatt (

) out for a run near Hendricks...I was still trying to figure out some good routes to run, I introduced myself as a new freshman recruit, and they invited me to run with them. Both, great guys. I did however noticed that the Oregon "easy run" running pace was a tad faster than my high school days, lol.

Negative aspects? I didn't seen any jealousy back in that day. The thing is, I think to have had the ability or potential to run at the level the top guys did, you had to believe you were their equal and just hadn't reached it yet...so our teammates, at least or me, were inspiring. You either had the inner strength to stick it out, or you didn't.

There were things like the occasional transfer student coming in cocky and not being accepted, but that is kind of to be expected when people had already shared frosh and soph years together etc. And as has been reported elsewhere, occasionally someone would get too energetic and race in practice, Dellinger would always nip that in the bud. Some guys couldn't make the transition to college training with college studies -- we had some very promising big talents drop out, or transfer. Dellinger would have been better suited at the time to somehow get more volunteer assistants, and train athletes more like his mentor, Bowerman. There was very little individual attention, and we all over trained in those days, it wasn't just at Oregon, according to my buddies at others schools, it was pretty pervasive at alot of the elite programs.

As to Billy?

I think if he could have strung together 3 strong years with out injury, that he would have run under 13:05. He was tough as nails, there was nothing untough about him.

pre841 wrote:I had forgotten that Billy did hold an American road record for the 20km of 59:17 (1983).

that is really not a bona-fide record

malmo went 61'43 in '82 for 1/2M, which wouda made his 20k time ~ 58'30

presumably the race officials were too nincompooped to time him at 20k...

and by that standard meb's (?) just beaten 20k record shouldn't have lasted until recently, since hall was obviously faster in his 59:43 half. maybe hall should still hold the record, as he was probably faster than ritz.

I'd love to hear more about the training from McChesney's era, particularly the paces.

ventolin^2 wrote:

that is really not a bona-fide record

malmo went 61'43 in '82 for 1/2M, which wouda made his 20k time ~ 58'30

presumably the race officials were too nincompooped to time him at 20k...

ventolin, nothing counts unless there is an official certified 20k mark with an official timer in place.

doobydooby wrote:

and by that standard meb's (?) just beaten 20k record shouldn't have lasted until recently, since hall was obviously faster in his 59:43 half. maybe hall should still hold the record, as he was probably faster than ritz.

I'd love to hear more about the training from McChesney's era, particularly the paces.

Research "Goal Pace" and "Date Pace" in the Bowerman system...

As i recall galen holds the 10k record at oregon. Bill was a great runner no doubt about, but pre is remembered because he was cut down in the prime of his career. a modern day example would be if hall got killed in a car accident we would be grieving the unfulfilled potential and the loss of a great man.

I'm not Pre.[/quote]

No, you are just a pretty sick individual.[/quote]

You're crazy. I point out McChesney had a very average college career, especially by Oregon standards, and nowhere near the same level as Prefontianes career, so you resort to name-calling. You're not helping your case one bit.

I'm going to take a wild guess and say that "was there" wasn't there. What a jack a$$!

Other than him, thanks for an awesome thread guys, super enlightening stuff!

Hey... Bill's Roommate.

that is some fantastic stuff. I grew up as a litte kid watching Frank Shorter and Bill Rodgers etc. I remember Pre stories and my older brother actually still has the sports illustrated with him on the cover (Moms attic).

I think you and your other teammates should collectively write a book about this stuff, it is truly fascinating. A lot of younger runners would obviously be interested as would many of us slightly older and slower. Very cool

There was some discussion on here that Steve McChesney was thinking about a book of some sorts. In talking with him he had mentioned that it might be a McChesney family collection of stories or it might be a motivational running book. Either would be awesome.

because he died, martyr's are easier for people

Game, set, match to Billy's Roommate, thanks for chiming in. Anybody who thinks Bill McChesney wasn't charismatic obviously WASN'T there.

Regarding 1984, Bill was for sure not retired. The achilles was at the root of a whole host of issues that kept him out of the trials. I didn't know about the basketball injury, but if you ever looked at his tendon, you wouldn't be surprised it was always hurting him, it was like a thread. He was always fighting it.

Nice video

http://www.eugenerunningcompany.com/home/erc1/smartlist_117/bill_mcchesney_jr.html

pre841 wrote:

There was some discussion on here that Steve McChesney was thinking about a book of some sorts. In talking with him he had mentioned that it might be a McChesney family collection of stories or it might be a motivational running book. Either would be awesome.

The one thing I was kind of disappointed in with Kenny Moore's book on Bowerman and the Men of Oregon was that it didn't follow up on the Bill Dellinger years at Oregon after Bowerman retired. I guess the book was about Bowerman and when he retired as coach, those later years of Oregon track were out of the scope of the book. But the book was so great in going into the details of all the athletes that came in and out of the duck program and then it kind of left you hanging at about the early 70s knowing that some of the greatest races were run in the 10 years after that.