Seb Coe Weight Training

Well you've just displayed your ignorance. He didn't run 2 seconds faster than almost anyone else. He doesn't even hold the world record anymore, Wilson Kipketer does. Cruz missed his world record by .04 seconds 25 years ago. At least 7 other guys have come within a second of it. Koskei, Bucher, Rodal, etc.

So clearly you don't know much about the event. But let's put that aside for the moment.

Coe didn't outwork others. He had the best combination talent, coaching, and smarts for his time. THAT was why he was better. Just as every world beater has. If you mindlessly attribute every great performance to drugs... well it would be an insult to fools to call you a fool.

I don't think Coe was on drugs. Combine 21.5 second 200m speed and a lightweight frame of 120-130 pounds with very little body fat, and you will get a GREAT 800/1500m runner, drugs or no drugs. Coe's stride and fluidity were his greatest assets-his mechanics are unparelled, and I don't think drugs can do much for that. Maybe he blood doped but even that I doubt, a small 1:41 guy should be able to run 3:29 without drugs.

Well perhaps Woulhuter was talking about the American collegiate scene in the '70's and perhaps we shouldn't presume that it was as prevalent throughout the rest of the world?

Yes, I'm sure a fair few sprinters and athletes involved with power based field events were taking steroids in the '70's and '80's; and it's now pretty much certain that many GDR athletes were on state sponsored programmes; but I doubt many middle distance runners in the '70's and '80's were taking anything. Steroids aren't going to do a great deal for a 1500m runner, and Coe's frame hardly fits in with the pattern of what happens physically to someone on steroids.

Yes, Coe was almost 2 secs faster than anyone else for 3 years, and should have run faster than he did over 1500m, but that is because of a variety of factors. Coe had a long career and one which entailed many missed opportunities due to illness and injuries. If he'd been on drugs surely he would have made much quicker recoveries? I can think of many careers that seemed to go without any injuries whatsoever, which to me is much more suspicious. Coe was running 1:43 at 21 and still running 1:43 at 33. The longevity of the levels he achieved doesn't really fit in with the characteristics of a drug abuser. And believe me, if there was even a whiff of foul play the British press would have got hold of it some time ago, especially considering his subsequent political profile.

It is truly bizarre that people today with little knowledge of a long gone period in sport are quick to dismiss a performance (or rather a series of performances, as he wasn't just a 1 trick pony) of knocking 1.7 secs off the World record (in an event which had seen little development in the previous 15 years or so and was due a progression) at 800m, but totally disregard a 45 sec WR improvement in a longer event in less than 10 years, during a decade when EPO was around and completely undetectable. By your argument then perhaps Jim Ryan was taking something when he improved the 1500m and Mile records by 2.5secs? That was, after all in the sixties.

And someone whose 2000m and 2 miles pbs are on a par with Ovett but who has only managed to run 800m in 1:46 can run 1500m in 3:26!? Please.

Sorry, but there are a lot of other athletes whose careers and performances hint at drug use a lot more than Coe's. I would suggest that drug use among MIDDLE distance runners at top international level was far higher in the late 90's/early '00's than during the '70's and '80's.

honestly, if that 3:26 is refering to Lagat or El G (either one), they both could have definitely gone a lot faster over 800m (probably 1:42mid to 1:43low)

id be shocked... wrote:

Everyone was at that time. It was MLB from the years 2000-2003. No testing. Accessible drugs. Says it all when Coe breaks 1:42 first man ever and the announcer acts as though he just watched the 319th American break 4:00.

Wuhlhuter admits he had friends who were doping (he said he wasnt)

It was everywhere.

Oh bullshit. There wasn't much of anything around helping the middle-distance guys until Coe was about done. The weight guys and sprinters have been loaded for decades, but most of the middle and long distance were clean, as were most high jumpers etc. You come off as some type of jealous shmuck. Were you running at that time, being beaten, and now blaming a lack of talent on a lack of drugs? And when have you spoken with Rick on this you lying sack of feces? Go ahead and ask him about Coe. He never felt Coe was on drugs.

Uh, why dont you go back and read the link I posted where RIck says there were people doping in the 70's dumbass.

The only British runner of note who makes such accusations that I know of is Matt Yates, who is so paranoid that he thinks everyone was doping and that his own coach was lying to him about how fast his times were in sessions.

Steve Ovett doesn't believe that Coe was doped and neither does Steve Cram.

Make of that what you will. You will probably read too much into it though.

What if they were all doping and so it doesnt really benefit anyone to call the others out...

I'm not saying they were doping for certain. But if I had to wager my life if they were or not. I'd absolutely 10 out of 10 times wager they were versus that they werent.

I suppose you thought Sosa and McGuire were innocent as well.

Notice Sammy Sosa never accused McGuire of using steroids in 98'

If you believe doping helps significantly with running, then how likely is it that none of the best runners in the history of the world, when there was no testing, were simply more talented and worked harder than the Millions who have come after them.

Id be shocked... wrote:

I'm not saying they were doping for certain. But if I had to wager my life if they were or not. I'd absolutely 10 out of 10 times wager they were versus that they werent.

You are obviously trolling.

I have no further comments to make to you on the matter.

Im absolutely not trolling.

I think there is a greater than 50% chance he was doping that is all I said.

Lagat, unlike EL G (who just ran 800m with his harem of hares in training and then tries to claim he has a 1:42.7 pb), has run a fair few half miles in his career, but has never got under 1:46! I think that is v. strange for a guy who has run 1500m in 3:26. Sure he could have run faster, but it's hard to justify him running much faster than 1:44 based on his current pb. Would be interesting to know what he's run 400m in.

His pbs at 2000/3000m/2 Miles are on par with what Ovett ran and what Coe was capable of (given the evidence of his 5k training sessions), and his speed certainly wasn't/isn't as good as either Coe or Ovett's, so it seems an anomaly that he managed to run 3-4 secs faster over 1500m? Don't think either Coe or Ovett reached their potential at the distance, but 3:26!

Strange how Baala is also able to run 3:28 with a 1:43 800 pb and an 8min + 3000m pb.

Where do you get these figures from?

Plucked from the thin air I would presume. First you said he was on drugs, now your hedging your bets by saying that its just over 50% certain he was on them.

I guess you just have a "hunch" or heard a "rumour" once and are basing your claims on these. You have produced absolutely no evidence to purport the idea that Coe was anything but clean.

As I said before, his career was long, he made steady progress and won convincingly at major champs/ major events throughout his career when there would have been testing. He took part in various treadmill testing in the '80's in the US; unlike many recent distance champions who have refused to submit to such testing when advances have been made; all of which have been published in various journals. He has been filmed in training, published his training regimes (cited by EL G among others as a strong influence in his own training programmes) and been tested randomly out of season in the UK since the early 80's.

What tells you that he was on drugs other than "he was so good so he must have been"?

So you are saying Lagat was on drugs which only help you run the 1500m faster, but don't help the shorter or longer distances? Do you realize how stupid that sounds?

Honestly, I think its pretty clear that his 3:26 is much better then his other marks, but that doesn't mean he's on drugs. No, he probably just had the race of his life while being towed for 1400+ meters by El Guerrouj.

Also, I'm pretty sure that in 2001-2002 he was a 1:43high guy at least-if a 3:30 Alan Webb can run 1:43, so can a 3:26 Lagat.

"So you are saying Lagat was on drugs which only help you run the 1500m faster, but don't help the shorter or longer distances? Do you realize how stupid that sounds?"

I take what you are saying, and that is part of the point I'm making. Yes, it does sound/seem strange. Most great milers tend to be either 800/1500m men (e.g Coe) or 1500/5000m men(e.g EL G), but Lagat is harder to categorise. He doesn't seem to be blessed with awesome natural endurance or speed (a bit like Ngeny). I mean even Lagat's 1000pb is only 2:16. If you were given all the stats about an anonymous athlete who had run 1:46, 2:16, 4:55 and 7:33, I doubt there is anyone out there who could imagine such an athlete running 3:26.

I am not necessarily saying he was on drugs either, rather making the point to a few posters that if they think Coe was dirty, there is enough evidence to suspect others were more likely to be.

This is a thread about Seb Coe's weight training, not "did Coe used drugs". And middle distance said that he was tested quite often in 80's and the results were published in magazines.Maybe you can copy some information (if you have) about that testing?

And please, do not discuss if Coe did use drugs, because it has evolved to a discussion if Lagat used and it may take forever to try proving it.

Can someone post some information from Coe's weight training? Besize that 6 sets 15, 15, 15, 10, 10, and 5 of increasingly weight from 140 lb to 190lbs.

Maybe I should add something like that to my training...:)

Honestly, this makes me laugh. Brady Anderson hits 50HRs in '96 and this guy claims that NOBODY suspected steroids?!? Did he not have any friends who followed baseball?

Hayduke wrote:

not wobbly wrote:

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Pardon me if I don't take your word for that. Coe was clean whether or not you want to admit it.

I don't even think about who was or wasn't dirty, but I do think about this and laugh.....

10 years ago I used to argue the idea that baseball players were dirty. Either laughter or the boring hand eye skill argument would be the response 100 percent of the time. And I mean ONE HUNDRED PERCENT of the time. From baseball fans, to ball players, to sports reporters. Not a single one could wrap their minds around the idea that a baseball player would use steroids.

middle distance wrote:

Anyone who can run 21.5 for 200m and beat the likes of Coghlan, Foster and McCloud over 4 miles on 800m training; not to mention a VO2 Max of 90 and a sustained heart rate of 250bpm

(www.valleystriders.org.uk/ccol0007.htm); is a freak of nature. Pure and simple.

Of course Coe did not have a VO2 Max of 90, and HOW he achieved his performances is the issue.

middle distance wrote:

Coe was running 1:43 at 21 and still running 1:43 at 33. The longevity of the levels he achieved doesn't really fit in with the characteristics of a drug abuser

You are positively retarded. PEDs INCREASE longevity at the highest levels of competition.

another runner wrote:

that is if you can believe anything the Coes tell you.

I remember watching the video "born to run" with seb doing multiple leg presses of a lightish weight - probably not an example of something he did in real training.

I agree another runner - but just saw that this was written in 2009 and may well be agreeing with myself.