edited: Tasering at Club Nationals Afterparty

i don't know if it's illegal for a man to be in a women's bathroom or not. i know i was chatting with about 4 different women and they were fine with it, silly party stuff. No harm, not a big deal.

When the cop came in, as soon as he looked eye to eye at me, i remember thinking, "he has a wild-eyed look" and i put up both hands and said, "We're all good in here." It was an attempt to show him i was calm. That's when he grabbed me and threw me out the door. By the way, when he asked me to leave, he was standing in the doorway, no way for me to get out. Could you please move officer so i can leave? As you requested.

i've seen good cops subdue rowdy people with only their hands. i've never seen a 200+ pound cop taser a 150lb guy. A trained cop can subdue somebody with their hands. The cops i know have told me they only pull out the taser if there's a weapon in the perp's hand. Sounds reasonable.

Point is, officers are supposed to diffuse situations, not escalate them. i was in the women's bathroom - WOW! Ask me to leave and i will - i WAS trying to leave and could've if the officer had given me space. No need to throw me out.

More than once, in clubs or in theatres, I have seen situations where women are let into an unoccupied men's room when the line at the women's room gets too long. It can be done without any disruption or embarrassment.

Somehow cops have been taught lately that tasering is a safe and reasonable way to defuse situations. It isn't.

You have got to be joking wrote:

'Question authority'? NO. Get out of the way next time.

As a citizen in a democracy, it is not only your right, but your responsibility to question authority when it has overstepped its bounds. These cops clearly did overstep their bounds if the statements made on this thread by people who witnessed the incident are accurate. Sure, you aren't supposed to go into the women's room if you're a guy, but it isn't that big a deal, not even worth having the cops show up for really. Tasing is justified when there is reason to believe that the person will hurt or kill a cop or bystander. There is no other time at which it is justified. Even then, it is only really justified to tase the person if they are armed, as a trained police officer should be able to apprehend an unarmed suspect without using weapon themselves.

There might be more to this story than is coming out in this thread, but if the accounts here are accurate, the police were wrong.

My observations as someone who was at the party and had interaction with the police earlier in the evening.

Behavior of the athletes was pretty similar to most post meet parties, in fact, less rowdy than last year in San Francisco and maybe a little less than or similar to the post race party in Rochester.

Some people did dumb things but when told that they couldn't do something, whether it was against policy or illegal, they quickly complied. Most of us break the law on a regular basis, often daily, and only avoid doing things that we want to avoid a penalty on, after all while you can often drive at 40mph in a 35, it doesn't make it legal. When we know something is against the rules and it will be enforced, we usually comply pretty well.

Some of the officers seemed fairly friendly, some very aggressive/assertive. Earlier in the evening when I was stopped, it took some effort of not responding to what felt like baiting to calm the officers down. At least one officer made a number of verbal threats/implications regarding legal actions that could be taken. Some of those sounded credible, some did not. By staying calm and telling him we understood he had to do his job and cooperating with him, he eventually released us. As someone that is nearly 50 years old and didn't drink any alcohol that night, the level of aggresiveness seemed a bit surreal. That said, I understand they had a job to do, we were in a conservative family resort town, and they probably didn't have much experience in crowd control or if they had, it had been with a violent crowd.

I didn't see the altercation that resulting in the tasing, but I feel bad for the athlete and wish he had a better read of the situation and stayed further away while asking questions about what was happening to his friend, so he would have been yelled at rather than tased and arrested. I'm guessing that whatever actually happened the tasing won't be anywhere near as bad as the legal headaches that will follow. I can't imagine that if someone is close enough to make an officer feel threatened enough to be tased that they won't be charged with something pretty serious. I think that a lot of people forget how behaviors that are tolerated or encouraged in one locality may be cracked down on pretty harshly in another.

As far as enforcement, a lot of things could have been better handled by turning up the lights and killing the music for a minute and telling people what specific behaviors had to be knocked off (most of the arrests and releases without charges that I saw were for having outside purchased beer indoors at a private party in a conference room). They could have told everyone over the PA that outside beverages needed to be removed immediately and give everyone five minutes to do it. Instead individuals were stopped and I think that, that, probably caused some of the officers to feel frustrated by people continueing to do dumb things or otherwise increased the aggression level with their interaction with the crowd.

I hope that the local chamber of commerce (that's my understanding of who bid the event) works with the police on crowd control techniques before future events and also works with local venues such as the parking lot that the morning group run went through where they were chased off by a security guard in a truck who told then that the route to the bike path they were heading to, was private and they were tresspassing. It was a huge parking lot, probably a mile and a half long at a waterpark and it was empty. I'm guessing the legal route to the trail would have been were it crossed a main road a couple of miles away. Most of us are used to running accross parking lots on training runs even though most parking lots are in fact private.

Overall my experience was that it was a nice meet, (I would have liked it if they actually used the big sledding hill) but the wee bit weird responses from locals for what was a major revenue event for them was uneven at best.

One point I don't see mentioned - someone called the police. They didn't just materialize, there was a complaint registered by someone.

BellingSam wrote:

a chic who punched out a growler in the men's bathroom.

Ole Timer wrote:

What the hell does this mean?!

Snuck out the back..... wrote:

It means she dropped the heater.

I must be REALLY old cause that doesn't help a bit.

I believe it was hotel security that made the original call.

charmin wrote:

Plus, they were invited into the bathroom by women. If they were in there a few minutes, didn't seem that any of the women seemed to mind.

Think real hard for a minute.

You are at a restaurant, or a mall, or a grocery store, or a park out in the country. ONE woman invites you into the bathroom, to do whatever.

Do all the other women in there HAVE TO PUT up with this invasion of privacy, this potentially scary or intimidating situation just because some dumb-ass distance runner (you!) says it should be OK?

Although it would not happen in this situation, this is how rapes can occur.

Was the "pre-party" just for people who weren't running? Or for people who didn't care about how well they did?

Last time I checked the night before a National Championship you ate your meal, stayed off your feet and saved your emotional and physical energy for the next morning by going to bed on time.

Wehn did parties the night before become par for the course?

Did the "heater" stink?

Was it retained as evidence?

The party was after the race and after the awards.

I'm guessing "pre party" meant some people considered the "party" to be the all nighter they'd pull with their buddies later.

As far as the bathroom thing, while legal in some places, definitely not smart as the cops had already been there for a few hours.

darkness wrote:

Last time I checked the night before a National Championship you ate your meal, stayed off your feet and saved your emotional and physical energy for the next morning by going to bed on time.

Wehn did parties the night before become par for the course?

The party was Saturday night, after the race. The altercation was after 11:00pm. I saw the ambulance pull up as I was walking back to my room at 11:30. That's when they turned on the lights and closed the bar at the party.

the majority, NOT all, but the majority of cops are power-hungry, over-aggressive meatheads who want the authority to beat the shit out people. PERIOD. THere is such an incredible thin line between who grow up to become the bad guys and who grow up to become the cops, that sometime you can't tell the difference. for real.

I know so many jack-ass, juvenile meatheads that became cops through various connections that it blows my mind. These kids were drug users, constantly getting in fights, hard-drinkers, etc. How did they become cops? They didn't get a record when they were young because their dads were cops, or their friends' dads, or they received sealed juvie records which basically allowed their youthful offenses to get brushed under the rugs. They they slightly cleaned up their acts and became cops, while kids just like them, but with a few less breaks in life, a few less connections, and maybe only a couple more missteps than the kids who became cops went on to become "the bad guys." What a joke. I also worked security once at a hospital where we would deal with some pretty f'd up people (drugged up psychos) that we had to restrain. Most of the guys I worked with worked there while they were biding their time to become cops. They used to LOVE to beat the crap out of the patients they got called to restrain. They constantly overdid it. And they'd get a total adrenaline rush and all fired up over the beat-downs. Even I, who was against that over-aggressive shit almost would get caught up in it.

Put neanderthal almost-criminal power-hungry types in positions of power where they have the authority to beat people down, and you get situations like what you got. How about the black cop that killed his pregnant girlfriend last year with his child watching? How about the Petersen cop who it appears killed TWO of his wives?!! And there are dozens of other such stories. Read about the state cop at Atlanta airport that grabbed that 50 y.o. woman from her car and whipped her to the ground and cuffed her because she nudged him accidentally with her car?? COPS ARE OUT OF THEIR F***ING MINDS.

Was it white on white ? Was a Jew involved ? If so, we'll have to get the Ohio Hitler Youth or the Jewish Defense League on this case.

you sound like a 17 yr old dumbass.

Leirbag wrote:

You guys realize that this was posted at 8:57 PM, the party hadn't really started yet. I'm calling bogus.

How old are you?

you guys are dumb, just because...

- you've went into a women's bathroom

- you were talking with women in there

- you've seen other people do it before

- you don't think it's that big of a deal

doesn't mean you are in the right by entering a women's bathroom. It's an invasion of privacy, and the hotel did not appreciate it I am guessing. Therefore they have the right to remove you from the place. Do they have to? no, sometimes they don't. But I'm guessing if the hotel security called the cops and then the cops came, you were in there for a while. It doesn't mean they're wrong for physically taking you and removing you from the place. Had you been drinking? I'm sure that didn't help the situation.

Lots of people on here are females or have daughters, and I'm sure they wouldn't appreciate it if a man was standing in the ladies room chatting with a few ladies.

you have a stick up your ass

If you're going to get tasered, at least get tasered for a good reason.

This situation is even dumber than that video of the dumbass getting tasered in the library at UCLA.

whats so crazy about standing in a womens toilet room, they dont have pissoirs, you are not gonna see more than if you are standing outside of a womens toilet room.

Whats up with all the tasering in the US?

Was it the same Cop that tasered the Student who dared to ask John Kerry a question?