Who says it's criticism? Why so defensive? Do you not agree that it's a statement of fact, then? If he hasn't been able to improve to that level yet, then that's how it is. It's not a final assessment of his career, it's an assessment at this point. I was just saying that right now, today, he hasn't done well enough on the world stage to have his name mentioned in the same breath as the Crams, Coes, Ovetts, or even Cachos, Silvas, and Heshkos of the sport.
Spiderpig wrote:
the diceman wrote:Erratic? Since 2004 Webb has been pretty darn consistent.
Not on the world stage, unless you mean consistently bad.
Uh, I'm not being defensive at all. I am simply counter arguing your above (initial) point. How exactly has he been consistently bad? By not advancing in his first international championship meet at age 21? By making the WCs 1500 final as a 22 year old? Your post was a knock against him, plain and simple. And I don't think that any intelligent person is going to compare him to guys like Coe, Ovett, etc. just yet. My one and only point was in response to the possibility that he is doping. Thus, I posted about his steady (ie consistent) progress over the past 3 years- hardly the type of progress that you see from more suspicious types. You chose to take a shot at him on an unrelated topic (ie his success on "the world stage"). Your point is neither here nor there.
It wasn't a knock, it was assessing his performances on the world stage honestly. He hasn't been a success. What's the alternative to being a success? As for my point, it only arose because you possibly misstated your own. Just saying he's "consistent" is really open-ended.
Spiderpig wrote:
It wasn't a knock, it was assessing his performances on the world stage honestly. He hasn't been a success. What's the alternative to being a success? As for my point, it only arose because you possibly misstated your own. Just saying he's "consistent" is really open-ended.
Last post, man. With regard to your point about him not being a success: I disagree. I don't know what you expect from a 21 or 22 year old kid at championship meets these days. But I consider his making the 1500 final in 2005 a "success" for the kid. The top guys in that race were out of his league. The fields are ridiculously tougher than they were back in the day of the guys that (only) you are comparing him to. It's certainly not black and white: it's not all success or all failure, unless you are Pre or a Pre disciple.
My point was not open-ended at all. I was not talking about his being "consistent" on "the world stage". I was talking about his consistent and steady improvement in 1500 times over the past 3 years. I don't really understand how you failed to pick up on that in my initial post. The subject was Webb and doping, and I was using his consistently improving 1500m times as a defense. No mention of championship races, as they are pretty much irrelevant in the case of times. And that's all I have to say about that.
Pre? Please. You must forget how old Coe was when he went on that record tear in the summer of '79. You must also imagine that I said somewhere that I expected more from Webb on the world stage by this point. I didn't say that you were necessarily talking about consistency on the world stage, but you didn't indicate in that statement that you weren't so I went ahead and covered that base. Sue me.
Spiderpig wrote:
Pre? Please. You must forget how old Coe was when he went on that record tear in the summer of '79. You must also imagine that I said somewhere that I expected more from Webb on the world stage by this point. I didn't say that you were necessarily talking about consistency on the world stage, but you didn't indicate in that statement that you weren't so I went ahead and covered that base. Sue me.
Please. If you ladies are done bickering, I'd like to weigh in on the subject...
Comparing Coe's era to Webb's (uh, how many guys just broke 3:31 in ONE RACE a few days ago) is comparing apples and oranges. Who the f*** said anything about Webb being as good as Coe, anyway? Spiderpig, I do believe you're talking out of your ass.
Well then whatever's coming out of my ass is still flying clear of your dense little head.
Spiderpig wrote:
Well then whatever's coming out of my ass is still flying clear of your dense little head.
Hmmm. Not really. You want to talk about Coe? OK, he won Olympic gold when he was... 24 and 28. He went on his tear in '79 when he was... 23. Coe's 800 time was out of this world, but Webb is not an 800/1500 guy. He's a 1500/5k guy. What makes you think that, had Webb been running in 1979 or 1980, he couldn't have been just as successful in the 1500? What don't you understand about different eras? Coe's lifetime 1500 PR is all of .8 faster than Webb's PR right now. No one is going to argue that Webb is as good as Coe was, but comparing the two for whatever reason (time, championship success, etc.) is silly. That's like saying Herb Elliot was better than Coe because he was younger when he won the Olympic 1500m. Big f***in deal. It's apples and oranges. Keep talking out of your ass and trying to cover your irrelevant posts.
something tells me that you aren't even qualified to hold webb's jockstrap. why in the world are you even attempting to compare him to coe? anyone, no matter how young, who doesn't compare to the entire career of one of the greatest middle distance runners EVER sucks? that's a profound concept.
Yes, really.
Learn to read, I never said that anyone "sucks" and Coe wasn't the only standard on the world stage that I used, far from it in fact. Only an idiot couldn't see that.
Mr. Obvious wrote:
Stan van Gundy wrote:Has an American male distance runner ever tested positive for anything? In the history of track and field?
Pretty sure we're entitled to feel superior in these arguments.
Eddy.
I believe Eddy is originally from Belgium.
Who cares, the USA is one of the most drug infested countries going. In terms of sports that it. Them and those African nations you like to defend so much.