FL Champ Chad Hall runs open 400 in 51.72

kaitainen wrote:

and it's funny to me how many people apparently believe that 51.7 for a foot locker champ is impressive. he's obviously a superb runner with a great future. but 51.7 is not impressive. maybe when you take into account all of the circumstances - march, not doing speed training, not a particularly important or stacked race, ran the last 15 meters backwards, etc. - it becomes impressive. however, on its own, a 51.7 400 for a FL champ in his senior (?) year of high school doesn't tell us much about his potential ability in the 1500 - 10k.

Let's be realistic. 51.7 is Bob Kennedy speed. The fact that many here seem to thik this is exceptional speed says how out of it many long distance people really are. It doesn't mean you can't have a good/great college career, win NCAA titles, run sub-4, etc. Cram ran 1:42 off a "slow" (for mid-distance) 400 time of about 48.5. But in an WC/Olympic final where you have people that run a 49 and do the mileage for 10000, the 51.7 guy has no chance of winning a medal. Remember what happened to Bob in Atlanta: THAT'S what's wrong with it.

Chad will likely move up to the 10000/marathon, just like Ryan Hall did. Nothing wrong with that. But it also doesn't mean that the 51.7 can't be improved with the right program. See the Vigil article on Deena's training with sprints of 400 speed and faster, weights, and plyometrics.....and that's for a marathoner.

this is all definitely true. and i was attempting to allude to some of it with the last line of my post - this particular 400 doesn't tell us much. it's sort of average. if he could only pull off a 53.5 in may/june after a bunch of speed work, then we'd know that he has to run the marathon long-term. if he can break 50 in high school, then we would know that he has enough speed to be a 5k guy on the international scene (but he could still be better off in the 10k or marathon - obviously a 400 time won't tell you someone's best event; although it may tell you someone's limitations).

with a 51.7 in march? doesn't tell you much at all. it's not "impressive". it's not bad. it is what it is - an average 400 time for an exceptional high school distance runner.

Coach D wrote:

See the Vigil article on Deena's training with sprints of 400 speed and faster, weights, and plyometrics.....and that's for a marathoner.

Where is the article?

Tuone Udaina wrote:

I believe that it was Renato Canova who said that "you don't lose speed running distance; you lose speed not training speed."

I believe that was Wetmore/Colorado.

Kennedy couldn't break 50. Geb most likely couldn't break 50 or that much under it.

Stephen Cherono, at the time of his WR in the steeple, could not break 50.

The guys future is anywhere from 1500 to marathon at this point and this 400m does nothing to tell us otherwise.

Let's put this into perspective. If he was not the FL Champion and if you take away all his good distance running event times. And all he had to show was a 51.72 "Open". He would not get one phone call or letter from any University. But yet, with all of his accomplishments in Distance running, everybody and their mothers, wants him to run for them. I think it's obvious that he needs to stick to distance running. 5k and Above.

wah waaah wrote:

4:06 mile/ 8:47 2 mile

You're thinking Evan Jager.

Robert Lachenay wrote:

wah waaah wrote:

4:06 mile/ 8:47 2 mile

You're thinking Evan Jager.

That is, if you're talking about 1600 and 3200 times....

this does not warrant its own thread. 51.72 from hall is really not that impressive

sprints and weights wrote:

Coach D wrote:

See the Vigil article on Deena's training with sprints of 400 speed and faster, weights, and plyometrics.....and that's for a marathoner.

Where is the article?

There are also a couple of interviews on the web about Deena"s weight training, with Dr. Vigil expressing the view that the weight program hekped her build up her strength to be able to handle the training (a couple of 140 mile weeks, though that has apparently been cut back since Athens to "only" a max of 120).

51.72 from anyone (male and able bodied) isn't that impressive.

he is too slow to win anything under 10km. You have to have sub 50 raw speed to win international champs...he should move up to the marathon like his bro

It's impressive from the FL 5k champion in March in an OPEN race.

Do you people even run? This kid is a HSer and isn't training for the 400.

bad connection wrote:

Stephen Cherono, at the time of his WR in the steeple, could not break 50.

I'm pretty certain that the fastest man over 3000 meters in the steeple could pull off a 49-point.

R.L. Scribner wrote:

bad connection wrote:

Stephen Cherono, at the time of his WR in the steeple, could not break 50.

I'm pretty certain that the fastest man over 3000 meters in the steeple could pull off a 49-point.

Scribner- I wouldn't take that bet. I think he can now because Renato's worked on that a bit, but when he set his world record in 2004, he could not.

From his coach, Renato Canova:

"So, for example, I'm sure that Stephen Cherono and Nicholas Kemboi are not able running under 50.0,"

I'll take his word, not speculation

51.72 in an open 4 is just what I\'d expect in an open 4 in early march from a kid who will probably see the low end of 4 minutes in the mile this year. He\'s split 49 before, as have several top high school distance runners

nothing spetacular or anything to get too excited about, its promising though

sure he couldnt....sure....the guy who closes his workouts in 23.0 cant run under 50.....anything you say renato, anything you say ;)

Sub 53.high wrote:

I heard Kevin Tschirhart can run 53.high 400 split.

i think he ran sub 52 back in high school.