This post is how I learned Bati didn't win D3 nats.
To be fair, he did take a hard fall in the beginning and was ~137th or so 1km in. Slowly worked his way up to the lead pack by about 4k. Not sure how much that took out of him, but he was gassed the final 400 and got out kicked.
As I'm working on the HP tonight, I came across an article on Navy's who also ran CIM.
He graduated in the spring so it's not like he ran CIM right after NCAAs. Two-time Patriot League champ in xc but was never top 100 at NCAA xc (was 13th in the 10,000 last year - 28:23.81 pb).
His time? 2:11:58. I think if the very top D1 guys ran it, you'd DEFINITELY see some 2:08s. Faster for guys like Samuel.
Former Navy cross country and track & field standout Murphy Smith ('25) qualified for the 2028 U.S. Olympic Trials in the marathon with a 10th-place finish at the
NCAA needs an annual marathon championships held in conjunction with CIM or Houston.
Institute a rule that entries must be declared by November 15. Entered athletes may not compete at the NCAA XC Championships that year nor may anyone that competed at NCAA XC Championships enter.
This would be an opportunity to find hidden gems at mid-majors or down roster. I would even consider opening it up to D2 and D3 athletes (same rules as above). Some 28 - 29 minute seniors might want a crack at glory instead of just finishing out their eligibility in obscurity. For some, this might be the path to a pro career after college instead of running straight to a cubicle.
I love this idea, but the ncaa is very concerned with cutting costs, so they are unlikely to consider it. Partnering with a major marathon would be behind the scope of what they could comprehend, so that’s unlikely too.
NCAA needs an annual marathon championships held in conjunction with CIM or Houston.
Institute a rule that entries must be declared by November 15. Entered athletes may not compete at the NCAA XC Championships that year nor may anyone that competed at NCAA XC Championships enter.
This would be an opportunity to find hidden gems at mid-majors or down roster. I would even consider opening it up to D2 and D3 athletes (same rules as above). Some 28 - 29 minute seniors might want a crack at glory instead of just finishing out their eligibility in obscurity. For some, this might be the path to a pro career after college instead of running straight to a cubicle.
No coach is going to approve scholarship athletes to skip XC to run a marathon and top runners aren’t going to want to run one, either. They would be lucky to squeeze a 2:15 out of the guys that did run it. What’s the hurry anyway? The cubicle can be put off for a year to allow a runner to show off his chops in the marathon.
It wouldn't be the top guys doing this. More like the junior or senior stuck at #10 or deeper on the XC roster. His 14:05 / 29:10 isn't going to make NCAAs and might not even score at the conference track meet. I could see a coach like Eyestone training up two guys a year at the back end of his roster for marathon or a mid-major program branding itself as "Marathon U" and developing those kids that get shut out for being a tad too slow in high school or transfers cut and replaced by foreigners at their first school.
Work your butt off to place 197th at NCAA XC? Not make the travel squad at a P4 program with five rostered Kenyans? Or...finish top 10 at the collegiate marathon and get an OTQ while still enjoying institutional support?
Dude's track pbs are 14:15/30:10. How is that possible? Only explanation I can think of is the genetic superiority of Africans at 26.2.
Guys born in America aren't made for 26.2
OK- follow me on this:
There is a high school in my area that traditionally had some really bad distance coaches. They've often had runners not get recruited, go D3 and become very good runners.
I'm not saying that's his situation but how many great runners never pan out because their High School coach doesn't know what he's doing and their career ends after 12th grade?
It wouldn't be the top guys doing this. More like the junior or senior stuck at #10 or deeper on the XC roster. His 14:05 / 29:10 isn't going to make NCAAs and might not even score at the conference track meet. I could see a coach like Eyestone training up two guys a year at the back end of his roster for marathon or a mid-major program branding itself as "Marathon U" and developing those kids that get shut out for being a tad too slow in high school or transfers cut and replaced by foreigners at their first school.
Work your butt off to place 197th at NCAA XC? Not make the travel squad at a P4 program with five rostered Kenyans? Or...finish top 10 at the collegiate marathon and get an OTQ while still enjoying institutional support?
I’m not sure how your 197th placer in XC example supports the idea of having an NCAA marathon. He’s not going to break 2:15. Ed Eyestone is already “Elite Marathon Coach” and why would he want to put any effort into coaching a bunch of 2:15 to 2:20 guys. The OP was talking about developing 2:10 guys, anyway.
Dude's track pbs are 14:15/30:10. How is that possible? Only explanation I can think of is the genetic superiority of Africans at 26.2.
Guys born in America aren't made for 26.2
OK- follow me on this:
There is a high school in my area that traditionally had some really bad distance coaches. They've often had runners not get recruited, go D3 and become very good runners.
I'm not saying that's his situation but how many great runners never pan out because their High School coach doesn't know what he's doing and their career ends after 12th grade?
This is a large percentage of promising runners. What's a realistic percentage of high school coaches who know how to advise and develop a distance runner and team to success? It's very low.
NCAA needs an annual marathon championships held in conjunction with CIM or Houston.
Institute a rule that entries must be declared by November 15. Entered athletes may not compete at the NCAA XC Championships that year nor may anyone that competed at NCAA XC Championships enter.
This would be an opportunity to find hidden gems at mid-majors or down roster. I would even consider opening it up to D2 and D3 athletes (same rules as above). Some 28 - 29 minute seniors might want a crack at glory instead of just finishing out their eligibility in obscurity. For some, this might be the path to a pro career after college instead of running straight to a cubicle.
This is a terrible idea.
You think they should have an NCAA marathon champs for people who don't make NCAAs? And you think people who can't make an NCAA teams top 7 should be considering a pro running career?
No and no.
The idea of an NCAA xc marathon champs is great, but you have the totally wrong group I want in it.
Augsburg University is smack dab in the middle of Little Mogadishu...everyones running from the Somali gangs there 24/7...thats why hes so fast.
I love it when people comment on things that they have no clue about. Most Somalis are great people, just like most people. There are jerks like you, but hey that is just life. Grow up and gather some context before you talk about things that you have no clue about.
NCAA needs an annual marathon championships held in conjunction with CIM or Houston.
Institute a rule that entries must be declared by November 15. Entered athletes may not compete at the NCAA XC Championships that year nor may anyone that competed at NCAA XC Championships enter.
This would be an opportunity to find hidden gems at mid-majors or down roster. I would even consider opening it up to D2 and D3 athletes (same rules as above). Some 28 - 29 minute seniors might want a crack at glory instead of just finishing out their eligibility in obscurity. For some, this might be the path to a pro career after college instead of running straight to a cubicle.
This is a terrible idea.
You think they should have an NCAA marathon champs for people who don't make NCAAs? And you think people who can't make an NCAA teams top 7 should be considering a pro running career?
No and no.
The idea of an NCAA xc marathon champs is great, but you have the totally wrong group I want in it.
If anything, I always thought a half marathon championship in March would be cool for 10k guys who will not be consequential on the indoor track.
Shout out to Henry Pick who ran 2:14 at CIM. Another D3 runner who at CMS ran around 14 for 5K and majored in math and CS at Harvey Mudd, so must be a smart guy too. There's also Maya Weigel PP legend who ran 2:28 in the same race.
As I'm working on the HP tonight, I came across an article on Navy's who also ran CIM.
He graduated in the spring so it's not like he ran CIM right after NCAAs. Two-time Patriot League champ in xc but was never top 100 at NCAA xc (was 13th in the 10,000 last year - 28:23.81 pb).
His time? 2:11:58. I think if the very top D1 guys ran it, you'd DEFINITELY see some 2:08s. Faster for guys like Samuel.
Augsburg University is smack dab in the middle of Little Mogadishu...everyones running from the Somali gangs there 24/7...thats why hes so fast.
I love it when people comment on things that they have no clue about. Most Somalis are great people, just like most people. There are jerks like you, but hey that is just life. Grow up and gather some context before you talk about things that you have no clue about.
Yes but of course this message board might run out of content if most people actually knew what they were talking about. “BHD” is just another know-nothing who identifies as an expert.
You think they should have an NCAA marathon champs for people who don't make NCAAs? And you think people who can't make an NCAA teams top 7 should be considering a pro running career?
No and no.
The idea of an NCAA xc marathon champs is great, but you have the totally wrong group I want in it.
Besides getting discounted education, what is the point of carrying 17 athletes in the XC roster if most of them never travel or only get to go to local small schools invites? A marathon, half marathon, or road championships of some sort gives those back of the roster athletes a purpose. Otherwise, everyone is going to adopt SEC numbers and / or stock up on older foreign athletes to remain competitive.
If I am cost conscious AD or assistant AD, I can cut 6-7 guys because they serve no purpose. I can use that money elsewhere or make my Title IX balance easier.
