This actually happened in 3200m at Arizona HS State Championship

Most wars are fought for resources not religion.

Religious extremists are not genuinely religious. They are wolves in sheeps clothing. Narcissists who would use any cause to further their own glory.

Any good thing there is in the world, some megalomaniac has co-opted for their own benefit. It does not detract from the truth of the message.

E.g. LOTR. Tolkien got it. Peter Jackson got it. The cast and crew got it. The nerds get it. The Amazon pricks buy it and turn it into some pandering BS to make money.

Don't hate the truth because some have twisted it.

I get that we need rules and structure, but the lack of flexibility that displayed by adults in and around track and field is frustrating. If a kid insisted he checked in, those in charge need to pause the meet to figure out what happened. If there is any disagreement, let them run and DQ after the race if necessary. The alternative is exactly what happened, kids not being allowed to run, due to official's error.

And if SIX ATHLETES insist they checked in, you're an absolute retard if you don't slow down and double check.

I had this happened to me my first year out of high school went to a meet in North Carolina at North Carolina a&t. I went to check in three different times and they told me to come back 30 minutes later each time because they were behind I heard final call for the 800 so I returned back to check in and they told me I had not declared for the race in that tent had a table where I needed to declare to race. Coincidentally this sign in table was right next to the official table and they didn’t tell me once about it and this was not in the packet info or meet information. I was so confused because of the amount of times I came back to try to check in. They ended up putting my teammate and I in a 800 by ourselves after the 4 x 4 I ran 1:49.1 a seasons best at the time, and my teammate broke two for the first time. Once the final results came out, we were deed from the meet, which was ridiculous because I would have won the meet and my teammate had a big PR that he could use for meet later in the future, but never had an official result.

But likely should’ve happened in both instances is that meet management should’ve taken over and not the officials. I don’t understand how this happens or why this happens with officials, but it’s almost like they go on power trip sometimes depending on what state you’re in.

Yes, my HS athletes were severely impacted by the AIA decisions. My HS guys finished 1, 2, 3, and 4 in the State Final 3200 (prior to them adding another 3200 after the meet was over).

From my perspective, this is what happened:

The AIA mixed up and admitted to making an error on check-in. They held out the six kids that they believed had not checked in. A few others protested and walked off the track. Without saying a word over the intercom or any announcement, 15 kids started racing the 3200. It looked odd and the defending state champion was not running but no one really knew anything so they raced. Nothing was ever said during the race at all and it was a strategic, pedestrian, race.

My guys finished 1-4.

The defending state champion and a few others LEFT the meet so they never heard about the second 3200. I don't know if they would have been allowed to run or not.

About one hour after all of this started, they announced this 'added' 3200. And finally, an official came out to explain what was going on to several irate coaches. So I asked Mary Wimmer, head of the AIA at the meet, and before the start of this second 3200, what they were going to do with the results from this other group. Keep in mind, this was the Division 1 State Meet. ALL Divisions compete this upcoming weekend so the top times from this meet compete one week later (top times from all 5 divisions). Mary told me that the 'points and medals' would not be affected by this second 3200. I volunteered to put my guys back on the track for the second 3200 as my guys would easily have won that race too. But when she told me that, I said 'ok, then my guys won't run' and I walked away.

Boston Walseth was the only guy in the second group to run faster than my guys but when they inserted this new group, every kid got affected from the actual State Final 3200. Around midnight, the results still had my guys finishing with points and medals. Boston's time was listed but '0' points associated with his performance.

The next morning, David Hines got involved (Executive Director from the AIA) and put out a statement. It is copied here:

An issue arose Thursday evening in the boys Division I 3200-meter race, between the check-in area and the clerk of the course. This resulted in alternates entered in the race and other athletes told they had not checked into the event and not taken over to the starting line. This error by meet management should not have happened. After discovering all the facts, the meet referee determined the athletes be given the opportunity to race, while the other athletes that protested the race were given the opportunity to race after the running of the 4X400 relays. The individuals that had protested the decision and ran in the race after the 4X400 relays did receive times and those times will be merged with the other 3200- meter runners. The results of the merged races will determine placement and scoring of the boys 3200 meter run in Division I.

There were a variety of problems at the meet (they also stopped jumpers from competing - including the top jumper in the state - for lack of check in). They did NOT add a separate flight for these jumpers but have now allowed them to complete this weekend although they did not qualify through the normal course which was to be a top performer at the D1 State Meet.

Anyway, I have asked the AIA to respond to my protest, in writing, so that I may take the next step. The AIA has yet to award anyone a medal from the event but they docked our team the points that were earned in the event already.

Clearly, this has a negative impact on everyone that followed the rules and raced the actual State Final and clearly, my guys could have run faster (the top 3 all finished within 1 second of each other and really only ran a closing 400).

I am asking the AIA review their stance so they can make this right. There are other options than to create another 'final' and let the field know exactly what they need to run to win the state meet. And you are right, Zarian has not lost to anyone in this second group all year. My other guys as well.

That is where things stand today. The 'combined' State Meet (all divisions) is this weekend. My guys will all race there as well. I believe the AIA hopes that having these guys race again will silence the coaches but I've already fielded phone calls about why Zarian lost the state final along with coaches that watched the race and knew the results. Only to see the printed results not match the video from the race. This is not good. Zarian is a Junior. He is only beginning the college search process.

Wait the athlete that got shafted is on Mike Scannel's team? I somehow missed that. It has to be infuriating dealing with such incompetence from local volunteers.

Help me make sure I understand this.

1) The guys who boycotted the first race in solidarity with the 6 no signup guys weren't allowed to run the re-race? If true, that's wild and the 6 should have boycotted the new race in solidarity with them.

2) Was it clear that one of the winners was going to be one of the 6 that missed the race? What were the seeds of everyone? What was Mike Scannell's runner seeded?

2 things

1 - is this meet predominantly relevant to qualify for next week's meet (which may be a state championship)?

2 - if so, would letting everyone who would have qualified if the 2 events had been fully separate suffice? Eg if top 3 (say) qualify for next week, let the top 3 from both races go through - and the 2 runners that protested as well? Wouldn't fix the stress and it would make for a bigger field next week, but it would minimize the lost opportunities from this screw up

No the guys who boycotted were not allowed to run in the late heat, just the ones who were falsely presumed to have not checked in.

Zarian Rodriguez is Mike Scannel's athlete that won the original heat. He was the heavy favorite. He's hands down the best in the state at the 3200.

The kid that beat him in the 2nd heat was seeded 2nd. He's a good runner, but he is way behind Rodriguez.

Here's the timing site. It breaks it down by heat:

https://live.roadrunnerracetiming.com/meets/52353/events/individual/1948984

Yes it does determine who races at the all-divison championship this weekend. This is a very new system in AZ, only a few years old.

The system is a bit awkward. Athletes and teams that win their divisional title still call themselves state champions. But the all-division meet is this weekend. It is also called a state championship. AIA has recently phased in an all-division title in all sports over the past few years, with XC being one of the few exceptions.

The answers to your questions as far as I know:

1) The guys who boycotted the first race in solidarity with the 6 no signup gusy weren't allowed to run the re-race? If true, that's wild and the 6 should have boycotted the new race in solidarity with them.

I believe they left the meet when the actual state race was going on. They were not there when the AIA officials explained the situation. I only heard this from others. What I do know is that none of the 'walk offs' ran in the second event.

2) Was it clear that one of the winners was going to be one of the 6 that missed the race? What were the seeds of everyone? What was Mike Scannell's runner seeded?

My guys race to win. In XC, I'm sure Boston was also ranked highly but three of the Hamilton guys beat him in XC (Zarian, Dom, and Ryan). All three of these guys were in the 3200 at State T&F. And my top 3 there finished within a second of each other.

1 - is this meet predominantly relevant to qualify for next week's meet (which may be a state championship)?

No, this WAS the Division 1 State Meet. Arizona only added an 'All Divisions State' a few years ago. Next week includes athletes from 5 divisions.

2 - if so, would letting everyone who would have qualified if the 2 events had been fully separate suffice? Eg if top 3 (say) qualify for next week, let the top 3 from both races go through - and the 2 runners that protested as well? Wouldn't fix the stress and it would make for a bigger field next week, but it would minimize the lost opportunities from this screw up

This was the initial thought amongst all the coaches that were protesting. That the AIA would use the times to include the second group in next week's 'All Divisions State Meet.' But that changed the following morning.

Sadly, this has become a 'Hamilton HS vs AIA' thing but in reality, it's a complete failure of the AIA and it harmed every single kid in the 3200.

You can read the post before responding yk. They DID check in but the officials made the mistake.

Odds are that guy was the race official. Made his acc yesterday.

No idea how to correct it? I have been at meets where they messed this up. Yk what happened? They paused and got everyone ready. It ended up delaying the meet by 20 minutes but everyone got to run. And they figured this out at the conference meet. Not even the state meet when you would want to be even more thorough.

Many thanks for your reply here

Re. 2 - I was suggesting that the selection for next week be based on POSITION, not time, in each race. This seems the fairest way of doing things as one race could be tactical and the other a time trial, for example (and it sounds like that's actually what happened). For instance, if the top 3 would normally go through, then just let the top 3 from each race go through, irrespective of time. That doesn't screw over the guys who ran tactically in heat 1. This would, of course, make for a bigger field, but something has to give in this situation and it is fairest to make that the field size. The runners who protested and did not get to run should also get to go through.

Re. 1 - that really does suck. I don't think there's anything that can be done to fix it. A re run has all kinds of problems - availability etc. I can only think to make the winners of each race joint state champs. Obviously this will reward someone that wouldn't otherwise have won, but it probably is the fairest thing. I don't, unfortunately, see any way of accommodating the ones who didn't run in protest in this.

What a mess.

You must lack basic reading skills.

I just can't believe this happened to you and your team, Mike. So sorry to hear it. You deserve better, and so do all of the competitors. I hope they do the right thing and advance kids to the all divisions state meet.

Officials should really not have the power to tell runners signed up for races that they can't run. You ruin kids experiences when you allow random adults to make whatever decision they feel like making at any given time, especially when they are the kind of adults that assume the kids can't be right because they're kids.

It's unthinkable that crap like this happens.

The number one priority for officials should be that if a runner is signed up for a race and is on the track then they need to be allowed to run, no questions asked.

His name, and the names of the other runners who refused to run in protest, should be put on top of the Let's Run front page. They deserve recognition for what they did.