The other thing is, what if Hocker held off Fisher and the times were flipped? If Fisher still breaks the 5K WR at BU, are we even questioning if Hocker could?
Not only would we question it, Hocker will absolutely not break Fisher’s indoor WR. If 1500/5000m and 5/10 guys are even at 3000m, the 5/10 runner will have a significant advantage for 5000m. If they were even over both distances, Hocker would also have a shot at Fisher’s 10000m AR.
Not only would we question it, Hocker will absolutely not break Fisher’s indoor WR. If 1500/5000m and 5/10 guys are even at 3000m, the 5/10 runner will have a significant advantage for 5000m. If they were even over both distances, Hocker would also have a shot at Fisher’s 10000m AR.
3k/5k are much more similar than 5/10.
Fisher has run 26:33 and medals at both distances. He is absolutely a 5/10 guy and the runner that won Olympic gold at 1500m, is not. The crossover appears to be at 3000m.
What if Teare is pacing Hocker to try and beat Fisher's WR? Weren't they supposed to be running last week at Valentine BU? Maybe they skipped it to see Fisher's time and try to beat it (somewhat similar to what Jakob did to Nuguse, except the part where he didn't plan it on purpose a week later).
No. Their plan all along has been to run this weekend, just as the OAC guys are running next weekend. Hocker did note after the 3K that while the initial plan was to merely chase a qualifier, he'll be willing to push for a faster time considering how fit he is. That's why this will probably be paced more for a 12:55-13:00 time plus a kick, rather than taking it out at a comfortable 13:00-13:05 pace before a kick that gets the winners to ~12:57 or so.
Heard on Citius that it was very likely his goal was just to try to hit the standard. That sounds credible and logical. Not every race will be a WR. And to those hating the fact he's not doing USAs, I get where you're coming from AND... no.
It's not like he's histotically a dodger of all big races. He's not the only athlete, by far, who is limiting their indoor season. His eyes are on outdoor USAs and worlds, which rightfully should be his primary goal given his level.
Heard on Citius that it was very likely his goal was just to try to hit the standard. That sounds credible and logical. Not every race will be a WR. And to those hating the fact he's not doing USAs, I get where you're coming from AND... no.
It's not like he's histotically a dodger of all big races. He's not the only athlete, by far, who is limiting their indoor season. His eyes are on outdoor USAs and worlds, which rightfully should be his primary goal given his level.
Isn't Jessica Hull basically the only 1500 and up runner doing GST and World Indoors? That's a different scenario too with her being Australia-based as well. Well probably Nozomi Tanaka as well. I guess the point is all of the US-based athletes who have to prepare for GST have all pretty much decided that the travel required to do both World Indoors and GST is excessive.
Man, I guess I understand why everyone wants to get on that BU surface, but I have to say I am a fraction surprised by the amount of racing Hocker is doing this indoor season especially as he is on deck for GST in only a few months. Like he's in 7.23 shape now, will probably bust something way under 13 in this one, but dude, you have at least 11 outdoor races between now and worlds (8xGST, Pre, 2xUS Trials) - and this doesn't even account for any other DL's he might wanna do. Just seems like a lot, especially compared to previous seasons.
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Man, I guess I understand why everyone wants to get on that BU surface, but I have to say I am a fraction surprised by the amount of racing Hocker is doing this indoor season especially as he is on deck for GST in only a few months. Like he's in 7.23 shape now, will probably bust something way under 13 in this one, but dude, you have at least 11 outdoor races between now and worlds (8xGST, Pre, 2xUS Trials) - and this doesn't even account for any other DL's he might wanna do. Just seems like a lot, especially compared to previous seasons.
It's only two races. 3k and 5k. Then he's done until GST.
I think there's a possibility Hocker sets the wr. Hocker only lost to Fisher by .2 in the 3k. Fisher is definitely better at the 5k right now, but hocker will likely have teare with him until at least 4.2k which will make a huge difference. Fisher was alone for 3k. There's a chance.
1) No. Just no. The idea that Hocker will beat Fisher's 5000 pb and WR is laughable.
2) This race shouldn't be allowed. There should be a dead window to protect the sanctity of the US champs. If Hocker and Teare wanted to run fast in the 5000 at BU, they should have done it last week with Fisher. You shouldn't be allowed to pick up World qualifiers while skipping out on USAs.
3) Hello Cooper. You of all people should not be skipping USA indoors. I told you last year not to skip World xc as that was the only US team you'd be making in 2024 and that proved to be correct. You are not good enough to be skipping opportunities to run for the US.
2) This race shouldn't be allowed. There should be a dead window to protect the sanctity of the US champs. If Hocker and Teare wanted to run fast in the 5000 at BU, they should have done it last week with Fisher. You shouldn't be allowed to pick up World qualifiers while skipping out on USAs.
"sanctity" lol. if you think you need to prevent people from running elsewhere to get them to run in the US champs, maybe that should be a tip off that US indoors isn't really important to anyone.
the olympic champ is stretching himself for fast times at other distances and you're crying that it shouldnt be allowed because he should be racing hobbs kessler and a bunch of nobodies
knowing that these guys are best friends, and that teare recently said he would focus on the 5000m this year, i expect hocker to be in the race as a pacer for teare. not sure why hocker, as the reigning olympic 1500m champ, would want to go all out on a 5000m all of a sudden. he will be focusing on the 1500 and mile (possible WRs)....
I think there's a possibility Hocker sets the wr. Hocker only lost to Fisher by .2 in the 3k. Fisher is definitely better at the 5k right now, but hocker will likely have teare with him until at least 4.2k which will make a huge difference. Fisher was alone for 3k. There's a chance.
1) No. Just no. The idea that Hocker will beat Fisher's 5000 pb and WR is laughable.
2) This race shouldn't be allowed. There should be a dead window to protect the sanctity of the US champs. If Hocker and Teare wanted to run fast in the 5000 at BU, they should have done it last week with Fisher. You shouldn't be allowed to pick up World qualifiers while skipping out on USAs.
3) Hello Cooper. You of all people should not be skipping USA indoors. I told you last year not to skip World xc as that was the only US team you'd be making in 2024 and that proved to be correct. You are not good enough to be skipping opportunities to run for the US.
Rojo is correct here on all 3 points. This is just a microcosm of how fundamentally broken our sport is.
knowing that these guys are best friends, and that teare recently said he would focus on the 5000m this year, i expect hocker to be in the race as a pacer for teare. not sure why hocker, as the reigning olympic 1500m champ, would want to go all out on a 5000m all of a sudden. he will be focusing on the 1500 and mile (possible WRs)....
Hocker has repeatedly said he wants to run the 5,000 at Worlds in future years, including this year. Maybe he and Teare will trade off the lead, but Hocker is in this race to get the standard, not to act as Teare's pacer.
Man, I guess I understand why everyone wants to get on that BU surface, but I have to say I am a fraction surprised by the amount of racing Hocker is doing this indoor season especially as he is on deck for GST in only a few months. Like he's in 7.23 shape now, will probably bust something way under 13 in this one, but dude, you have at least 11 outdoor races between now and worlds (8xGST, Pre, 2xUS Trials) - and this doesn't even account for any other DL's he might wanna do. Just seems like a lot, especially compared to previous seasons.
Agree with this totally, not sure I see the value of this, other than most likely garnering another excellent PR? He must have had some build up to carry these efforts so far, I like to see guys tee it up, but let's be clear this is no race, it is a made for BU TT , no one is beating him here, I would not think. I think he runs under 12:53.
Man, I guess I understand why everyone wants to get on that BU surface, but I have to say I am a fraction surprised by the amount of racing Hocker is doing this indoor season especially as he is on deck for GST in only a few months. Like he's in 7.23 shape now, will probably bust something way under 13 in this one, but dude, you have at least 11 outdoor races between now and worlds (8xGST, Pre, 2xUS Trials) - and this doesn't even account for any other DL's he might wanna do. Just seems like a lot, especially compared to previous seasons.
Agree with this totally, not sure I see the value of this, other than most likely garnering another excellent PR? He must have had some build up to carry these efforts so far, I like to see guys tee it up, but let's be clear this is no race, it is a made for BU TT , no one is beating him here, I would not think. I think he runs under 12:53.
He needs the 5K qualifier for USAs and I think he would agree with your guys that he's already loaded up on early-season racing with the GSTs and Pre. So he's actually being smart here in getting the 5K out of the way, as opposed to doing an early spring 5K between the GST races.
There's no question that Hocker will be training through the first two GSTs at some level and he is a guy who before June last year wasn't sitting dormant. He ran two all-out 5,000s, Pre Classic mile, a workout quadruple at Virginia Tech, and paced Teare for 1100 I think to a 3:32. He also had World Indoors which is a week later that this race timing-wise.
So the racing load will be up, but maybe not as dramatically as you think in the early going. What will be interesting to navigate is what he does after USAs because last year he just did a tune-up 800. That feels superfluous now. Does he do two European 1500/miles? More? Less?
There is something about having a kick that is very separate from being a good 800 runner. Beamish, Kincaid, Chelimo are all guys with tremendous kicks but no strong PRs, let alone 800 times. Nordas is another one who had an insane kick at 2023 worlds. Centro 2016.
Having a great 800 doesn't hurt, but it certainly isn't a prerequisite for a big kick.
right, you see great 800 runners repeatedly running on fumes in modest paced races.
good kickers, mentally and physically save a bit and have the skill do adrenalin dump the last of the fuel. which is good for a 50 meter spurt or some such, and after that hang on for dear life, sometimes guys have a bit in reserve after the kick and "cruise" to the finish. like Ovett, where sure, with the waving, he did have something left, but not much, if you had a head of steam after his kick, you will own him, where the bravado isn't worth beans.
regarding Hocker, for sure the guy could run 5000m under 1250 last year. and this year it's a no brainer.
however,. everyone can forget about a 5k world record without pacers. it's not going to happen. people won't have the mental fortitude to emulate grant''s run.
the guy with the greatest kick, was Coe, turning 11 low 100m. and off a slower pace, even coe could be challenged to close in 50 400m.
today with the hacks. all bets are off. guys are suddenly running the 800 upside down, and have no problem with running 52 plus 49 splits, something that was done by like one guy one time.
Teare took a lot of flack with B sub par seasons, but everybody takes crap when they are injured of sick, when the narrative becomes overly negative.
with the good trainng block and speed work with Hocker, A game Teare can definitely run sub 1250 himself, but a modest progression would be the bet.
Man, I guess I understand why everyone wants to get on that BU surface, but I have to say I am a fraction surprised by the amount of racing Hocker is doing this indoor season especially as he is on deck for GST in only a few months. Like he's in 7.23 shape now, will probably bust something way under 13 in this one, but dude, you have at least 11 outdoor races between now and worlds (8xGST, Pre, 2xUS Trials) - and this doesn't even account for any other DL's he might wanna do. Just seems like a lot, especially compared to previous seasons.
It's only two races. 3k and 5k. Then he's done until GST.
Plus the 2.18.2 1000m which is still not nothing. So really it's 3 and it doesn't change that GST is a really large step up in terms of racing commitment compared to previous seasons, with a full summer season to also manage.