I'd rather keep my $150k per year job and continue training for the Olympic Trials in the marathon. That's more than any trail jogger makes.
Elite ultra training takes too much time, and alone isn't enough to build a decent savings account.
The only way Roche makes good money is by scamming people into paying for his training program where he sends the same exact plan to everyone. I have too much integrity to scam people like that.
Given his 'personal coaching' pyramid scheme Roche probably brings in a good $150k-200k a year also! And he's a full time runner and a full time dad. So take that! He and his wife like to summer in Aspen.
I suspect Roche is a trust-fund kid. Went to Columbia and Duke law and then immediately went into online coaching. Seven years at Columbia and Duke law costs half a million dollars, and only a very small percentage receive aid (particularly at law school). 98% of people who go to places like that have to work at big law firms to pay off the half a million dollars in debt they accrue. If you don't, usually it means that you came from serious money.
Seems like the 400 workout is what he used as an indicator of 4 minute mile fitness. Not sure if this has been brought up already but 400s at Boulders elevation would be FASTER than 400s at sea level.
Given his 'personal coaching' pyramid scheme Roche probably brings in a good $150k-200k a year also! And he's a full time runner and a full time dad. So take that! He and his wife like to summer in Aspen.
I suspect Roche is a trust-fund kid. Went to Columbia and Duke law and then immediately went into online coaching. Seven years at Columbia and Duke law costs half a million dollars, and only a very small percentage receive aid (particularly at law school). 98% of people who go to places like that have to work at big law firms to pay off the half a million dollars in debt they accrue. If you don't, usually it means that you came from serious money.
I think he may have worked a few years in environmental law or something? But didn't his wife go all the way through medical school too? And then she never really actually practiced as a doctor because she is also a coach at the SWAP cult doing "personal individual training" or whatever they call it
None of his workouts suggest that he's even in sub-4:10 or 14:40 shape. Only in a bizarro world in which you've never interacted with an elite male track athlete would you think that running 12x400 in 64/5 or 10x600 in 1:42 (even in Boulder) would translate into sub-4 shape. Maybe the goal is just to stir the pot, but he could just say I'm going to show up to States in 14:30 sea-level 5k shape. That puts him on the same straightaway as current-form Hawks and Walmsley and maybe a bit ahead of Jornet and Farvard. Instead, for someone who is all about the science, he comes across as an idiot.
My god, this thread is the usual LRC circle-jerk of negativity and jealousy by a bunch of losers. After 20 years on this site, I've finally kicked my daily habit but just checked in for laughs.
I listen to the Roches' pod sometimes and it is definitely "relentlessly positive." Not totally my cup of tea, but whatever. Some people love it. But I've never heard David say he's in sub-4:00 shape, so I call BS on that. Give us some evidence. I think you can't.
If I remember correctly, he said he runs his strides under 4:00-pace, which is a different thing entirely of course.
I didn't read every post carefully, but, yes, Megan has an MD/PhD from Stanford and David worked as an environmental lawyer (public interest, I believe). I think they make their money from coaching, from the podcast, and from patreon. David's race results are now good enough that he might get some sponsorships but none that I've heard of so far.
Yeah, look, running 9 min pace for 100 miles between 10-12,000 feet is an accomplishment, but it's not a sub 4 minute mile. He literally said that if they changed the format on the morning of the 100 miler to a mile race, he thought he would break 4 on the streets of Leadville, CO.
I’ve had almost this exact same thought/feeling when I was running a lot. 4:24
None of his workouts suggest that he's even in sub-4:10 or 14:40 shape. Only in a bizarro world in which you've never interacted with an elite male track athlete would you think that running 12x400 in 64/5 or 10x600 in 1:42 (even in Boulder) would translate into sub-4 shape. Maybe the goal is just to stir the pot, but he could just say I'm going to show up to States in 14:30 sea-level 5k shape. That puts him on the same straightaway as current-form Hawks and Walmsley and maybe a bit ahead of Jornet and Farvard. Instead, for someone who is all about the science, he comes across as an idiot.
My god, this thread is the usual LRC circle-jerk of negativity and jealousy by a bunch of losers. After 20 years on this site, I've finally kicked my daily habit but just checked in for laughs.
I listen to the Roches' pod sometimes and it is definitely "relentlessly positive." Not totally my cup of tea, but whatever. Some people love it. But I've never heard David say he's in sub-4:00 shape, so I call BS on that. Give us some evidence. I think you can't.
If I remember correctly, he said he runs his strides under 4:00-pace, which is a different thing entirely of course.
I didn't read every post carefully, but, yes, Megan has an MD/PhD from Stanford and David worked as an environmental lawyer (public interest, I believe). I think they make their money from coaching, from the podcast, and from patreon. David's race results are now good enough that he might get some sponsorships but none that I've heard of so far.
Carry on, losers.
When Roche was recounting his Leadville 100 CR he basically that he: "knew he had to be faster than Matt Carpenter" to get the CR and that he'd have to be in "sub 4-min mile shape" and "sub 14:00 for 5km shape" at altitude.
He also cited his 400m rep/interval workout as evidence for this very type of speed and fitness: "sub 4-min mile at altitude" which he equated to a sub 14:00 for 5km at altitude as well and stated this publicly.
What we've seen with David is a lot of exaggerations and shady extrapolations. Combine that with his toxic positivity, humble bragging, and scam-cult like coaching business practices and you've got a real piece of work.
I’d like to see anyone on this thread race David Roche or coach better than David does…
It is entirely possible to simultaneously be a very good runner and a charlatan at the same time. See, e.g. Camille Herron. David Roche has a different flavor of online BS, but his self promotion is still laced with lies. He repeatedly claims to run times that he cannot run to sell his services. The weird thing is that he doesn’t *need* to claim to be able to run a sub 4 mile at altitude or a sub 14:00 at altitude to sell his ultra guides. It’s just stupid vanity or some such thing. He deserves to take some heat for this.
I’d like to see anyone on this thread race David Roche or coach better than David does…
Uh I races him at the US Trail Champs at Loon and first time exposed to him told my wife he is on the spectrum as he was talking out loud to himself repeatedly.
Do you have proof that he can’t run those times? He just did 10 repeats of 4:35ish mile pace at altitude for 3 minute reps with short 1 min recovery… a very controlled session for him. I just don’t know if the bashing is warranted without evidence that he can’t run the times he claims?
Do you have proof that he can’t run those times? He just did 10 repeats of 4:35ish mile pace at altitude for 3 minute reps with short 1 min recovery… a very controlled session for him. I just don’t know if the bashing is warranted without evidence that he can’t run the times he claims?
When you make a claim, the burden of proof is on you, not others to disprove it.
Do you have proof that he can’t run those times? He just did 10 repeats of 4:35ish mile pace at altitude for 3 minute reps with short 1 min recovery… a very controlled session for him. I just don’t know if the bashing is warranted without evidence that he can’t run the times he claims?
So… he says he can run the times, doesn’t run the times, and people here need to prove he can’t run the times. Wtf?
Do you have proof that he can’t run those times? He just did 10 repeats of 4:35ish mile pace at altitude for 3 minute reps with short 1 min recovery… a very controlled session for him. I just don’t know if the bashing is warranted without evidence that he can’t run the times he claims?
So… he says he can run the times, doesn’t run the times, and people here need to prove he can’t run the times. Wtf?
Only SWAP cool-aid drinkers would defend their leader in such a crazy and unhinged manner.
