I was thinking an older runner like Ngeny, since 800/1500 runners have largely disappeared and the top 1500 runners are all strength types, but none other than Tim Cheruiyot has run 1:43 and 3:28.
Yeah lets go Jimbo... So the goal pace is 55... 1:50... 2:44. Wabbit out smooth not like Duesseldorf '67 or Bakersfield '67... despite chopped cinders and poor phase of moon Jimbo holds tight to Keino who is almost allout at 1:49 for 880...Jimbo gathers head rocking side to side and passes Keino instantaneously as the bell clangs.. unleashes his trademark pulsing final 440 all the way through like a Penn steam loco...eyes closed in the classic RyunRictus as his arms flail the tape... nevertheless 52.7....for a 2:42.5...
Now the surficial, atmospheric and environmental conditions must be accounted for.
Rough cinders and divots eaten away in the earlier 220 by John Carlos who not for the last time was drawn in lane 1 by the white supremacist Brundage. Swirling wind. No competition Keino can barely stay upright for a 58 and a 2:47.2... finishes forty yards behind Jimbo as they all were in '67... vento^3 adjusts by his conservative 1.2 per lap for a DVTT(tm) 3.6 sec better...
I remember Roger Bannister saying that he thought the 1200m was probably his truly natural “race.” He did some absurd time in training, can’t remember what it was but considerably faster than his mile world record pace. 2:53 or something.
ya, Bannister reportedly ran something like 253 in training on those very so so tracks, and perhaps with pacing for a bit. Bannister talent was vastly underrated, and his 4 minute mile vastly over rated. Derek Ibbotson ran a 357 off very lousy training as well, on a very so so track. which is off the track for the 1200m.
obviously the 1200 lies exactly between the 800 and 1500, so guys with near WR in the 8 and 15 qualify for the record.
i think 53 seconds all the way would be a reasonable WR.
Coe came through in 144 145, and went 200m more
so you can see coming through in 146 800m, there is a shot at going another 400m at that pace.
of course you need the very good conditions and pacing to do such a thing.
going through in 147 800, and continuing would be a "definite" possibility
an El G Coe Ngene, would be the candidates, as I have El G at 142 flat in the 8. Cram who was good for 327 is in the conversation.
Someone like the 1:40.80 800m runner Wanyonyi. He'll break 800 WR in '25-'26
No way anyone could run that fast.
Sure they could. use the 5% rule. 800 pace x 5% = 1200. 1200 x 5% = 1600/mile. Like a 1:51 runner capable of 4:04.75, but they have to be a bit more strength based to do it. A hypothetical 1:40.4 800m runner is 52.71 per lap for 1200. 2:38.13 Personally I think the 1K record is soft. Even Hoppel could go 2:10.5 if he targeted it. I wouldn't be surprised if the record is close to 2:10 flat in a year and a few runners could get it.
I haven’t read the thread yet, but I’d guess 2:42 flat (54 second laps). I think the fastest someone could run for 1200 would be way closer to WR mile pace than WR 800m pace. Not sure who would hold this time but maybe Hicham.
He is a 1:43/3:29 guy. Fast enough over 800 with 1500 strength/endurance. Trains with an even faster 800 guy but uses a more strength/endurance based program.
The 1200 has not been an official event so if it became official now only currently active runners would participate in it.
Kessler is really young so he would be more likely to gravitate toward this new event. Most of the few faster elite stars of the 800 and 1500 would be more likely to stay where they are.
Kessler is still improving. He is not afraid to stick his face in the race.
He was the only man to qualify for and participate in both the 800 and 1500 at the 2024 Olympics.
He is a 1:43/3:29 guy. Fast enough over 800 with 1500 strength/endurance. Trains with an even faster 800 guy but uses a more strength/endurance based program.
The 1200 has not been an official event so if it became official now only currently active runners would participate in it.
Kessler is really young so he would be more likely to gravitate toward this new event. Most of the few faster elite stars of the 800 and 1500 would be more likely to stay where they are.
Kessler is still improving. He is not afraid to stick his face in the race.
He was the only man to qualify for and participate in both the 800 and 1500 at the 2024 Olympics.
Only 2nd tier runners would gravitate towards the 1200m. A 1320 yard race used to be run in California HS, but the fastest runners avoided it and it was discontinued.
Why would elite runners choose to run a distance with no history that’s not an Olympic distance? I would far prefer seeing Ingebrigtsen take another shot at the 1500m WR or finally, the 5000m record.
Yeah lets go Jimbo... So the goal pace is 55... 1:50... 2:44. Wabbit out smooth not like Duesseldorf '67 or Bakersfield '67... despite chopped cinders and poor phase of moon Jimbo holds tight to Keino who is almost allout at 1:49 for 880...Jimbo gathers head rocking side to side and passes Keino instantaneously as the bell clangs.. unleashes his trademark pulsing final 440 all the way through like a Penn steam loco...eyes closed in the classic RyunRictus as his arms flail the tape... nevertheless 52.7....for a 2:42.5...
Now the surficial, atmospheric and environmental conditions must be accounted for.
Rough cinders and divots eaten away in the earlier 220 by John Carlos who not for the last time was drawn in lane 1 by the white supremacist Brundage. Swirling wind. No competition Keino can barely stay upright for a 58 and a 2:47.2... finishes forty yards behind Jimbo as they all were in '67... vento^3 adjusts by his conservative 1.2 per lap for a DVTT(tm) 3.6 sec better...
WR 800m pace (1:40.91) averages 50.46 seconds per lap.
WR Mile (1609.344m) pace (3:43.13) averages 55.46 seconds per lap. For reference, 1500 WR pace (3:26.00) is 54.93 seconds per lap.
Average 800/mile WR paces together and you get 52.96 seconds per lap which equates to around a 2:39 1200 for the world record. This is just shy of 1K WR pace which is 52.78 seconds per lap, so maybe add 1 second for the WR being 2:40ish (53ish per lap).
The fastest 1200 ever recorded was supposedly by El G, who ran 2:44.75 en route to 3:26.96 in the 1500. However, this could 100% be beaten in a standalone 1200m race.
If the 1200 was an event, my guess for WR holder would be Noah Ngeny. He was a 3:43 miler and a 2:11 1K guy. Just like the 1000, the 1200 would be a middle ground race for 800/1500/mile specialists. The 1000 would tailor to those better at the 800, while the 1200 would tailor to those better at the 1500/mile.
Regarding your first question, one might look at the time below 60 sec per lap for each distance record. The 800 meter record is 19.06 seconds below, and the 1500 meter record is 19.00 seconds. One would expect a 1200 meter record to be around 19 seconds below 60 sec per lap as well, or 2:41. This reasoning also suggests that the 1000 meter record would be around 2:11 if run more frequently.
WR 800m pace (1:40.91) averages 50.46 seconds per lap.
WR Mile (1609.344m) pace (3:43.13) averages 55.46 seconds per lap. For reference, 1500 WR pace (3:26.00) is 54.93 seconds per lap.
Average 800/mile WR paces together and you get 52.96 seconds per lap which equates to around a 2:39 1200 for the world record. This is just shy of 1K WR pace which is 52.78 seconds per lap, so maybe add 1 second for the WR being 2:40ish (53ish per lap).
The fastest 1200 ever recorded was supposedly by El G, who ran 2:44.75 en route to 3:26.96 in the 1500. However, this could 100% be beaten in a standalone 1200m race.
If the 1200 was an event, my guess for WR holder would be Noah Ngeny. He was a 3:43 miler and a 2:11 1K guy. Just like the 1000, the 1200 would be a middle ground race for 800/1500/mile specialists. The 1000 would tailor to those better at the 800, while the 1200 would tailor to those better at the 1500/mile.
In Junior High Back in the early 1990's we had a kid in my league that ran the 1320yd in something like 2:27. I was just happy to run the event in 3:01.
WR 800m pace (1:40.91) averages 50.46 seconds per lap.
WR Mile (1609.344m) pace (3:43.13) averages 55.46 seconds per lap. For reference, 1500 WR pace (3:26.00) is 54.93 seconds per lap.
Average 800/mile WR paces together and you get 52.96 seconds per lap which equates to around a 2:39 1200 for the world record. This is just shy of 1K WR pace which is 52.78 seconds per lap, so maybe add 1 second for the WR being 2:40ish (53ish per lap).
The fastest 1200 ever recorded was supposedly by El G, who ran 2:44.75 en route to 3:26.96 in the 1500. However, this could 100% be beaten in a standalone 1200m race.
If the 1200 was an event, my guess for WR holder would be Noah Ngeny. He was a 3:43 miler and a 2:11 1K guy. Just like the 1000, the 1200 would be a middle ground race for 800/1500/mile specialists. The 1000 would tailor to those better at the 800, while the 1200 would tailor to those better at the 1500/mile.
In Junior High Back in the early 1990's we had a kid in my league that ran the 1320yd in something like 2:27. I was just happy to run the event in 3:01.
Your post is inaccurate of course. Nobody in the history of known humans could run 2:27 for 1320 yards.