Is Jake Whightman going to be "the next guy" again?

snowflakes wrote:

False nn wrote:

False. Diamond League races are clown events.

When you have runners entered with no intentions of finishing the race (rabbits) it becomes gimmicky.

If Jakob can only when a gimmick is used, he’s not real racer.

I guess half of El Guerrouj’s WC wins were gimmicks and not real wins then since he was paced in them. If Jakob had someone every year pace him at the WC and he won in 3:26-3:27 every time, would those wins count? Do wightman and Kerrs wins not count since they were technically paced by Jakob? This logic is so dumb. The BEST runner is the one who wins the most consistently and runs the FASTEST. This excuse of “oh he is not the best racer” hides the fact that his competitors are just not as good as him in fitness. This is why I call distance championships clown events. The world leaders rarely win and when they do its just a cherry on top of their world record performances and winning streaks at the highest level meets in the world.

False nn wrote:

snowflakes wrote:

I guess half of El Guerrouj’s WC wins were gimmicks and not real wins then since he was paced in them. If Jakob had someone every year pace him at the WC and he won in 3:26-3:27 every time, would those wins count? Do wightman and Kerrs wins not count since they were technically paced by Jakob? This logic is so dumb. The BEST runner is the one who wins the most consistently and runs the FASTEST. This excuse of “oh he is not the best racer” hides the fact that his competitors are just not as good as him in fitness. This is why I call distance championships clown events. The world leaders rarely win and when they do its just a cherry on top of their world record performances and winning streaks at the highest level meets in the world.

If Jakob runs 3:26.5 with a rabbit and still loses when it counts, yes his 3:26.5 would still be gimmicky. Because if you can’t win without rabbits, you aren’t a true racer. You can claim to be the best time trial runner all you want. But you will be chopped liver for medals.

If you need to use or recruit others, it’s gimmicky. Which is why championship medals count more than Diamond League races.

snowflakes wrote:

justanothercuriousdude wrote:

Is this the level of debate you want: You calling me stupid without any reasoning, and me maybe doing the same back (without arguments at all)..?

Why do I think Jakob (at least partially) regards WC / Olympics as clown races? -Well, rewatch his 2023 WC 5000m win, especially his face afterwards. -See some joy there? Why not, he won? Isn’t that what it’s all about? No it isn’t, because without a dominant honest performance a race becomes a clown race. Jakob wants to win in a proper way! (His own words; dominant. And preferably fast). And I interpret this as one of his points is that running is that everything is about, not racing. A good runner is a good runner -not a one time hitter / racer.

Exactly, that is the mindset of one of the best ever. He doesn’t really care about just winning (obviously he does but I am just going by what he said on interviews), He wants to win dominantly. Jakob wants it to be fast and hard because that truly shows who the best distance runner is. If he can do that, then that medal has even more meaning.

justanothercuriousdude wrote:

False nn wrote:

If Jakob runs 3:26.5 with a rabbit and still loses when it counts, yes his 3:26.5 would still be gimmicky. Because if you can’t win without rabbits, you aren’t a true racer. You can claim to be the best time trial runner all you want. But you will be chopped liver for medals.

If you need to use or recruit others, it’s gimmicky. Which is why championship medals count more than Diamond League races.

Jakob PR’ed in Silesia practically without pacers (the gap was too huge).

Of course Jakob can win without rabbits -he would have beaten Kerr with up to two seconds if not being sick.

Champ medals don’t count more than Diamond League races -Kerr was ranked 3 in 2023 despite a lucky gold (two sick favourites). Wightman’s win in 2022 was real in everything meaning of the word, Kerr’s (only) formally real (but of course not his fault)…

Being lucky or being a parasite (that Jakob had to be in 2023 WC 5000m) is no honest way of winning.