yall keep repeating this same thing, but how many of these supposedly common freshman girls who went 4:48 did so without having run XC as a freshman?
and of course she had a big pr when being rabbitted by someone with more fitness v. racing against hs girls that were nowhere near her level.
alan webb ran 4:02-high (converted 1600 to mile) at arcadia his sr year, then went to pre and dropped 9 seconds from that time against actual competition. it happens.
Come off it. She ran the 1600m five times prior to that race, the mile once, two 3200s, five 800s, a number of relays. That is a lot of racing for a freshmen. Even if it had been her first ever race, you act like 4:48 is so remarkable, but it simply isn't.
And Webb? He broke Ryun's national sophomore mile record, was the first high schooler to break 4 minutes indoors in the mile, broke Ryun's national high school mile record, was second at Footlocker, You are simply grasping at straws, lamely, comparing her to an athlete who showed elite talent right off the bat. That senior year 1600 in comparison was a complete outlier foreshadowed by nothing right when the Johnsons were making a full court press.
Matt Ditzler was coaching Addy Wiley 6 weeks into her high school career. Someone should really look into him if you think that she had a doping issue then. Dig deep let’s run and ROJO! Let’s get to the bottom of this!
Come off it. She ran the 1600m five times prior to that race, the mile once, two 3200s, five 800s, a number of relays. That is a lot of racing for a freshmen. Even if it had been her first ever race, you act like 4:48 is so remarkable, but it simply isn't.
And Webb? He broke Ryun's national sophomore mile record, was the first high schooler to break 4 minutes indoors in the mile, broke Ryun's national high school mile record, was second at Footlocker, You are simply grasping at straws, lamely, comparing her to an athlete who showed elite talent right off the bat. That senior year 1600 in comparison was a complete outlier foreshadowed by nothing right when the Johnsons were making a full court press.
I think it’s remarkable. I just pulled up a very top high school prospect, one that randomly came to mind, to see what she ran as a 9th grader: 4:51.49 in the 1600m.
So why don’t you give us some examples of all these ‘non-remarkable’ athletes running 4:48 in the mile as 9th graders.
You are setting up a strawman just to knock it down. Like I said a 4:48 mile, is a good time, sixth go at the distance or not. But it is well within the wheel house of other good high school milers. Eg, Shea, Engelhardt, Stegall, Whittaker, Macchia. Etc. Just to name a few recent examples.
A 4:48 mile is a good time. But most good high school milers have comparable or better freshmen times. None of them have the massive outlier jump she had suddenly her senior year under the Johnsons' tutelage. Her high school pr going into her senior year was 4:38, a good time but very much in the normal range. The only other runner to run a comparable time to that senior year 1600m was Mary Cain, whose talent was manifest much earlier and who was running for Salazar from 2012 onward.
You actually make the argument for Wiley. Sure there were outliers like Cain, Efraimson, Murphy, Cranny, Rainsberger but still Wiley was #1 in her class as a freshman 4:48, soph , Jr 4:38, sr 4:26 (and 2:04). Had she gone to cu, there would have been a ton of hype around an incoming 4:26/2:04 runner a la Willis and Whitaker, but going to HU, we didn't hear much.
Unlike the outliers, Wiley has not been injured, has no eating disorder, negotiated puberty uneventfully, is at home and has consistent coaching all leading to piling up 5 years of uninterrupted healthy training. That she's now gone over 15 months competing with pros to 4:17/1:57 is really good, but not unbelievable. Just this year we've seen Tuohy, O'Sullivan, Barnett, Appleton, Ramsden, Penn make big leaps, last year Valby.
Obviously, if she does get a doping bust, you can't say it was unthinkable, but it's not the only explanation.
You are setting up a strawman just to knock it down. Like I said a 4:48 mile, is a good time, sixth go at the distance or not. But it is well within the wheel house of other good high school milers. Eg, Shea, Engelhardt, Stegall, Whittaker, Macchia. Etc. Just to name a few recent examples.
Englehardt? She’s been competitively running since the 5th grade. So picking another on your list, Macchia…
You are setting up a strawman just to knock it down. Like I said a 4:48 mile, is a good time, sixth go at the distance or not. But it is well within the wheel house of other good high school milers. Eg, Shea, Engelhardt, Stegall, Whittaker, Macchia. Etc. Just to name a few recent examples.
Englehardt? She’s been competitively running since the 5th grade. So picking another on your list, Macchia…
Here is Macchia’s 1600m PR from the 10th grade: 5:04.5!!
So do you make it a regular habit to come on this forum and makeup stuff?
Come off it. She ran the 1600m five times prior to that race, the mile once, two 3200s, five 800s, a number of relays. That is a lot of racing for a freshmen. Even if it had been her first ever race, you act like 4:48 is so remarkable, but it simply isn't.
And Webb? He broke Ryun's national sophomore mile record, was the first high schooler to break 4 minutes indoors in the mile, broke Ryun's national high school mile record, was second at Footlocker, You are simply grasping at straws, lamely, comparing her to an athlete who showed elite talent right off the bat. That senior year 1600 in comparison was a complete outlier foreshadowed by nothing right when the Johnsons were making a full court press.
I think it’s remarkable. I just pulled up a very top high school prospect, one that randomly came to mind, to see what she ran as a 9th grader: 4:51.49 in the 1600m.
So why don’t you give us some examples of all these ‘non-remarkable’ athletes running 4:48 in the mile as 9th graders.
did this girl run xc prior to her freshman season of track? and yes it's obviously remarkable right when someone is the fastest runner in their class in the US, especially when every single other girl in the top-10 ran xc their freshman year.
anyone that has ever coached or been around the sport knows that even a freshman boy running 4:48 without having run xc freshman year is fantastic.
the thing about the doping-accusers is they don't know much about running and they don't know anything about doping other than what they read online.
Desperately grasping at an innocuous explanation based on unremarkable times just wont work. Repeat the talking point "number 1 in her class" (which I am not going to bother double checking), but the times are just not there. Her times were a harbinger of nothing particularly special until that Johnson infected 1600 her senior year (Lauren Johnson was pacing her in the race), a time that made zero sense based on all her prior results. And the fact that you claim she had uninterrupted health makes it worse. Claiming that she had this extraordinary latent talent that suddenly burst out is silly. It is clearly not the most logical explanation given the context.
You are setting up a strawman just to knock it down. Like I said a 4:48 mile, is a good time, sixth go at the distance or not. But it is well within the wheel house of other good high school milers. Eg, Shea, Engelhardt, Stegall, Whittaker, Macchia. Etc. Just to name a few recent examples.
Englehardt? She’s been competitively running since the 5th grade. So picking another on your list, Macchia…
Besides the fact she is one of the top two or three current high school runners in the country, entering her Junior year. But in your view, she was just another one of those 9th graders pumping out “not remarkable” 4:48 miles
The slogan isn't working. You acted like she was in the stands with zero training and got put in as an emergency and presto. Not remotely true. Again, 4:48 is a good time.
I think it’s remarkable. I just pulled up a very top high school prospect, one that randomly came to mind, to see what she ran as a 9th grader: 4:51.49 in the 1600m.
So why don’t you give us some examples of all these ‘non-remarkable’ athletes running 4:48 in the mile as 9th graders.
did this girl run xc prior to her freshman season of track? and yes it's obviously remarkable right when someone is the fastest runner in their class in the US, especially when every single other girl in the top-10 ran xc their freshman year.
Her name is Tatum David if you wish to investigate further.
I put that list together in five minutes. It is not comprehensive. Wiley was a good national level high school runner. Had a nice win at Arcadia her junior year. But it was that outlier 1600 that suddenly separated her, for reasons.
Wiley is gong to sign a huge deal soon. If they make running shoes they have come to the table with offers. Over the next week you will see the best offer rise to the top, be accepted, and announced. Terms over dolllars. But trust me, at 1:57.64 and 3:59.18 the dollars are there! As are the terms. Huntington U is going to look STUPID for letting Lauren Johnson go as the coach and then she becomes the lead of a pro group with a major shoe deal.
You all under estimate how much shoes have changed the game. Between a COVID off year and shoe tech these “outliers” you see are not really outliers at all. Wiley will have a long career without so much as a missed test. She is a professional in every sense of the word at 19.
did this girl run xc prior to her freshman season of track? and yes it's obviously remarkable right when someone is the fastest runner in their class in the US, especially when every single other girl in the top-10 ran xc their freshman year.
Her name is Tatum David if you wish to investigate further.
big talent for sure, though she's been competing since 7th grade if not earlier
Oh enough. For all the "undertrained" nonsense, at the end of her junior year her pr was 4:38. So naturally she was a Mary Cain level talent just waiting to shine.
Wiley is gong to sign a huge deal soon. If they make running shoes they have come to the table with offers. Over the next week you will see the best offer rise to the top, be accepted, and announced. Terms over dolllars. But trust me, at 1:57.64 and 3:59.18 the dollars are there! As are the terms. Huntington U is going to look STUPID for letting Lauren Johnson go as the coach and then she becomes the lead of a pro group with a major shoe deal.
I love it when Nick gets all wound up and posts this kind of nonsense lol