Whilst I agree that doping in the UK (and USA, FRG, CAN....) was really bad in the 70s and 80s, it wasn't quite the same as the GDR & URS, which was Government backed and sponsored and athletes were effectively forced to comply.
However, was UK doping organised? Yes, to some degree it was. The federation turned a blind eye to many things, Andy Norman arranged for urine samples to be switched at meets he promoted, and agreed to not test US runners in an international match in the UK. Athletes would blatantly even consume drugs during domestic competitions.
Anyone that things this 'Golden era' of UK (and US) athletics was built on honesty and by clean athletes is deluded. The Cold War was also the Drug Wars. When I remember what I saw back then, and I look back at the footage, the articles, the magazines, I laugh that people actually thought Fatima Whitbread was clean; that Linford Christie escaped his own ban in Seoul; that Geoff Capes not only admitted to doping, but you could see him doing in on the track; that to this day Kathy Cook is lauded as a natural talent ahead of her time; that Coe, Ovett & Cram were just as naturally talented. Whatever! (and the same goes for the US too....JJK, Lewis....there's many a story on them too).
What evidence do you have that Kathy Cook was doping? Because she ran fast? Having lived through the last five decades, I find it hard to believe that British Middle distance runners were doping like the GDR in the 70's, but the 90's guys were so much more virtuous they appeared not to indulge in EPO when it was legal amd then no testing for it. A couple of obviously doped sprinters and javelin throwers doesn't cut it for me.
I'll turn it round - why do you think she was clean?
It took respectively 27 yrs, 31 yrs and 29 yrs for a British woman to beat Cooks times at 100m, 200m, and 400m, and even now, well into the era of professional athletics, faster tracks and super shoes, only one British woman has even run faster than Cook's 200m best (Asher-Smith) and only one British woman has run faster than her 400m best (Ohuruogu) and only then, by just 2/100ths. Cooks 100m time still ranks 6th all-time on the UK lists!
She ran something like just one 400m in 82 and one in 83, then in 84, after a couple of mediocre 51.4's - 51.5's in June, she runs 49.43 in LA.
She may not have been on steroids, but she was on something
Probably not clean. Who knows. He didn't get testicular cancer like Steve Scott.
I liked Coe back then, but I loved Ovett, who was much more fun and colorful. Think of Ovett in '77, winning every 1500 and mile race he got near, with a smile and a wave, absolutely destroying John Walker in the World Cup... 25 second last 200, while waving to the crowd. Ovett was probably a doper too. I guess we'll never really know.
I'll turn it round - why do you think she was clean?
It took respectively 27 yrs, 31 yrs and 29 yrs for a British woman to beat Cooks times at 100m, 200m, and 400m, and even now, well into the era of professional athletics, faster tracks and super shoes, only one British woman has even run faster than Cook's 200m best (Asher-Smith) and only one British woman has run faster than her 400m best (Ohuruogu) and only then, by just 2/100ths. Cooks 100m time still ranks 6th all-time on the UK lists!
She ran something like just one 400m in 82 and one in 83, then in 84, after a couple of mediocre 51.4's - 51.5's in June, she runs 49.43 in LA.
She may not have been on steroids, but she was on something
Good arguments! On the same token, the last one to match Coe's and Cruz's 1:41 was... Amos in 2019. 35 years of improvements including super shoes barely make up for the doping of the 1980s, evidently. Still waiting for the first Brit to match Coe's 1:41...
What evidence do you have that Kathy Cook was doping? Because she ran fast? Having lived through the last five decades, I find it hard to believe that British Middle distance runners were doping like the GDR in the 70's, but the 90's guys were so much more virtuous they appeared not to indulge in EPO when it was legal amd then no testing for it. A couple of obviously doped sprinters and javelin throwers doesn't cut it for me.
I'll turn it round - why do you think she was clean?
It took respectively 27 yrs, 31 yrs and 29 yrs for a British woman to beat Cooks times at 100m, 200m, and 400m, and even now, well into the era of professional athletics, faster tracks and super shoes, only one British woman has even run faster than Cook's 200m best (Asher-Smith) and only one British woman has run faster than her 400m best (Ohuruogu) and only then, by just 2/100ths. Cooks 100m time still ranks 6th all-time on the UK lists!
She ran something like just one 400m in 82 and one in 83, then in 84, after a couple of mediocre 51.4's - 51.5's in June, she runs 49.43 in LA.
She may not have been on steroids, but she was on something
The late 70's and 80's should have produced the fastest (intrinsic) batch of British runners as that was by far the peak of participation levels and public interest in the sport, as well as being just before video gaming and the the Internet took over children's lives, coupled with hysteria over paedophiles leading to far more closeted and sedentary lives. You also then had Premier league soccer, professional rugby, cricket etc, and then the 'African invasion' in middle and long distance, and kids taught that Africans were natural born runners over a second a lap quicker than Coe and Ovett.
The British children born 1955 - 1965 were the first generation after post war rationing, growing up better fed (to better fed mothers).Athletics (and society) had been opened up to the working class. Prior to the 70's you basically had to belong to the 0.1% of the population who studied at Oxbridge to pursue athletics seriously.
If Kathy Cook was the product of doping, she would have gotten closer to the best of a little country of 12 million (and looked more like them too).
I'll turn it round - why do you think she was clean?
It took respectively 27 yrs, 31 yrs and 29 yrs for a British woman to beat Cooks times at 100m, 200m, and 400m, and even now, well into the era of professional athletics, faster tracks and super shoes, only one British woman has even run faster than Cook's 200m best (Asher-Smith) and only one British woman has run faster than her 400m best (Ohuruogu) and only then, by just 2/100ths. Cooks 100m time still ranks 6th all-time on the UK lists!
She ran something like just one 400m in 82 and one in 83, then in 84, after a couple of mediocre 51.4's - 51.5's in June, she runs 49.43 in LA.
She may not have been on steroids, but she was on something
The late 70's and 80's should have produced the fastest (intrinsic) batch of British runners as that was by far the peak of participation levels and public interest in the sport, as well as being just before video gaming and the the Internet took over children's lives, coupled with hysteria over paedophiles leading to far more closeted and sedentary lives. You also then had Premier league soccer, professional rugby, cricket etc, and then the 'African invasion' in middle and long distance, and kids taught that Africans were natural born runners over a second a lap quicker than Coe and Ovett.
The British children born 1955 - 1965 were the first generation after post war rationing, growing up better fed (to better fed mothers).Athletics (and society) had been opened up to the working class. Prior to the 70's you basically had to belong to the 0.1% of the population who studied at Oxbridge to pursue athletics seriously.
If Kathy Cook was the product of doping, she would have gotten closer to the best of a little country of 12 million (and looked more like them too).
Possibly the most sensible post you have ever done 👍
I know a guy who ran a 4:27 1500m at 14 and another guy who ran 3:54. At 20 they ran 3:35 and 3:36 respectively. I can't say who may have doped, but I know that some 14 year old kids could pass for 11 and others could pass for 17. Maturation rates vary so greatly. Ovett is an example of someone who was a man at 18, while Coe was a boy at the same age.
For those of you declaring he was a doper, Please have the balls to post under your real name so you can be sued for slander. Otherwise you are all just keyboard warrior cowards. Better yet, just delete another worthless thread of accusations. (This one)
For those of you declaring he was a doper, Please have the balls to post under your real name so you can be sued for slander. Otherwise you are all just keyboard warrior cowards. Better yet, just delete another worthless thread of accusations. (This one)
I'm waiting for you to post the same whenever some poster accuses a Kenyan of being a doper.
None of those who raced him thought he doped. His talent was clearly not achieved through drugs. Jim Spivey even named his own kid Sebastian.
And how the hell did he get these drugs in Yorkshire when he was 20 as you claim? You are a moron.
None? Then you name only one man, J Spivey. What would J Spivey, a U.S. guy from Illinois know what P Coe placed in S Coe's body from mid-1970's going forward? Nineteen-eighty-one, S Coe set 800m world record for the second time. What was J Spivey doing in 1981? In 1981 J Spivey was concerned about Drake Relays, Big 10 T&F Championship and U. of Illinois sorority ladies. J Spivey would have had zero knowledge regarding actions of P Coe & S Coe. You need to stay focused. J Spivey competed against S Coe in 1500m races. S Coe's 1500m performances, years later do not puzzle us. Many of us are puzzled by S Coe's 400m & 800m development. How old were you poster, mid-1970's to early 1980's? You must not have know about some of the comments Steve Ovett made about S Coe, late 1970's & early 1980's. Paraphrase: They put him together in a lab ... .
A. Don't call people unflattering names simply because they disagree with you.
B. If you do not know, you can do like most let'srun readers, do not post.
For those of you declaring he was a doper, Please have the balls to post under your real name so you can be sued for slander. Otherwise you are all just keyboard warrior cowards. Better yet, just delete another worthless thread of accusations. (This one)
Is there a shred of contemporaneous proof that Coe was a doper? Genuinely asking. Your feelings being hurt that Coe was faster than you isn't proof, btw.