Woody Kincaid- Jerry (Schumacher) told me "I think you're throwing away your career by leaving"

I wonder what Jerry meant. That Woody can't compete clean, or that he can't keep doping on his own without getting caught, or that Jerry's methods are so superior?

Jerry is an absolute loser. He’ll make more money in his life than I do so good for him but I could never live with myself I were him. Good for Jerry

This is correct. Jerry is one of those guys who negative recruits - ie. the only way you can be an All-American, run sub four, etc is to come to (Wisconsin) Oregon.

This was a really good interview! Thanks.

Kincaid is a 30 year-old man, not a kid. And Schumacher was his coach, not his dad. And it's not like Kincaid said he was going to try out triathlon or the 1500, he just wanted to try different training. If you're remotely mature and want the best for people around you, you wish them well. You don't tell them, essentially, "you're nothing without me." Schumacher's probably more upset that he's lost his reliable pacer for Fisher and Ahmed.

Mike Smith had higher finishes in the men's 5k than Jerry did. Go join the better group

It seemed clear to me from the context of the interview that Schumacher was commenting on Kincaid leaving BTC to go solo--not a high percentage play for anyone. Not just giving up solid coaching, but also giving up teammates, support staff, facilities, travel arrangements, meet entry, PTs, etc, etc. Kincaid himself said it was very tough to train just two months on his own. It's hard for a pro distance runner without a team, and that's what Schumacher was talking about. If I was his coach I'd have worried he was throwing his career away too. Not because he needs MY coaching, but because he needs SOMEBODY'S coaching (and also training partners).

Athletes seem to be leaving him rapidly.

Who has left him since the burrito problem?

Will he only be left with the burrito lady by the time she comes back?

Funny how when salazar was coaching all the negative press and opinions were cast to him. Now that he’s out the picture, it’s jerry. Jerry was the good guy then, now he’s the new salazar. Mike smith is an average coach in a great situation and doing a damn good job with it. If you think he’s reinventing the wheel, put him at a small D3 school and let’s see what he produces.

*American Record holder mindset

That's the way the Schumacher comment comes across to me. IOW Kincaid going out on his own rather than sticking with the group.

Saying “I think you’re making a mistake” vs “I think you’re throwing your career away” carriers tonal differences from the word choice alone.

I’m going to disagree per my earlier comment about the head game approach to adversity he learned from Martin Smith. I’ll further add that BTC did not even acknowledge Woody’s performance last night. Unless I missed it….crickets. That speaks volumes in my book. I am NOT a BTC basher, but I think they now have a bunch of work to do to address the PR and culture issues that have arisen since Shelby’s positive test.

Woody says that he shifted to double thresholds when he was training on his own, and then continued doing so with Mike Smith. He has trained with the NAU guys for three weeks now, and they've been doing double thresholds three times a week, pretty much the same as Jakob. Woody describes this as 6 miles of intervals at threshold pace in the morning and again in the afternoon, in contrast to doing it all in one long tempo with Jerry--a ten mile tempo. Then they started on race specific sessions this month as well. You can easily see how an athlete who was always getting injured with Jerry would excel, at least in the short term, with this kind of training, which is much easier to get through without injury.

Helps it a little bit, but still Jerry really thinks Woody doing 70% of Mo/Grants workouts before dropping out is the best training for him? He doesn’t see why Woody would want something tailored to him. Woody is 30 and there is a wealth of information of training online. It sure seems even if Mike Smith wasn’t coaching him before Jan. 6 they were in-sync with double threshold, and the level of intensity. Woody being put in the B heat last year was just emblematic of the issues with Jerry running the show. The line from Jerry comes across as arrogant/stubborn. Hopefully he *can* evolve somewhat with his athletes who need some individualization.

Your brother created this thread with the intention of stirring up s#$ and then you act surprised when people are critical of Jerry's remark.

It was better than the first one out there by Citrus mag. Kincaid just can’t speak in complete sentence and finish thoughts. Good luck to him but nobody should ever forget that BTC gave him an opportunity and put him on the map. Double threshold may be the short term icing on top.

Let's see what any of these coaches listed produce at that level. What a stupid thing to say! Jerry didn't coach in D3, or Salazar or Mike Smith either. Lots of people getting the types of athletes they are allowed to coach could do reasonably as well, perhaps better. Most coaches do not get to coach these types of athletes, but coach anyway.

Frankly, I have more respect for what Gjert Ingebrigtsen has done with his 3 boys (average of 3.29.9 for 1500m btwn the 3 of them). At this point, the only American who has run faster than they average is Lagat. He developed them from little kids, not NCAA stars (for the most part) as the above are given.

Mike Smith has also won more NCAA XC titles as a head coach than Jerry did at Wisconsin (5-1) and did so in a shorter time span (6 years to 10) with the resources of a D1-AA (below P5/G5) school. Give Mike Smith the Nike treatment Jerry has and who knows what he could do.