12:37 and 26:17 are insane, as is 2:01:41, but I think Kipchoge's career may have surpassed Bekele's at this point. What, 4 marathon efforts under 2:02 now, two under 2:01? The sub 2:00 effort alone still almost seems hard to believe it's so beyond the realm of what should be possible. The guy also won the WC 5000m in Paris back in 2003 at age 18 against two WR holders (Bekele and El G)... Truly incredible career.
Kipchoge has NOT run 2 marathons sub 2:01. Bekele has 3 gold medals from olympics on the track. The track is and has historically been the more prestigous (above marathon). 5 double cross world championships, that is DOUBLE (two golds: short+long)! 17 total world championships! Please do not try and say that Kipchoge winning some big road races are similar to that. His only track achievement is winning the 5000m in the WC. Come on.
It's like comparing Armstrong to Eddy Merckx... One is great, the other is the goat.
Five-thousand meters & 10000m have NOT been more prestigious than Marathon. Five-thousand meters was added in 1912 to allow 1500m guys who cannot kick with 1500m guys an opportunity to win; 10000m was added in 1912 to allow almost Marathoners an opportunity to win. Marathon is one of original events, modern Olympics. Historically, 5000m & 10000m are a joke.
you can't compare 5000m on a track to 26 miles on a road. you can't compare 10,000m on a road to 12k on grass and dirt. They're different events just like spints and hurdles are.
It's a category, sure, but it's no different than comparing Rudisha to sprinters. The sprinters get 60m indoors and 100m outdoors and 200s and all kinds of events to rack up individual honors; but Rudisha dominated at his event.
Kipchoge is the greatest marathoner ever, and marathons are historically the hardest event to dominate.
Bekele still. Remember Bekele ran 2:01:41 battling injuries. Bekele’s peak on the track and XC was miles ahead of Kipchoge.
Bekele, unfortunately, could never be healthy enough to run a great marathon by his standards. But no doubt in my mind he would be faster than Kipchoge.
"Bekele could never reach his physical potential because of his physical limitations."
I’ve been frequenting the LRC boards for a couple of years now and this is like the 20th thread on the same topic. Every time Kipchoge does something astonishing in the marathon (so just about every race he runs) here comes a new version of the thread. Every time the consensus is overwhelmingly the same. EK is the marathon goat, but KB is the distance goat. It would not matter if EK breaks 2 in a legit marathon, or wins all six wmms or wins Olympic gold again in Paris. The only way EK is going to be considered greater than KB is if he returns to the track and does something like win the 5000/10000 in Paris and sets a wr in the process. Time to just create an auto reply to these threads….”EK will never beat out KB as the distance goat….next thread.”
BS post. Eliud would not lose to Kenenisa in the marathon. No way.
A lot of down arrows for my 5000m & 10000m comments. The truth hurts. Even though I am anti-5000m & 10000m as international events, I feel I need to clarify: I have nothing against college 5000m & 10000m athletes. If 5000m & 10000m are not a joke internationally, think about this: If 5000m & 10000m were dropped and 3000m were added, how many gold medals would your favorite 5000m & 10000m athletes possess? Only opportunities: 1500m, 3000m, 3000mSC & Marathon.
I would probably give it to Bekele for being more well-rounded than Kipchoge but I agree his resume is a little bit padded since you can run many 5000m/10000m/XC events in a season for multiple medals while you can only run one or two marathons a year, of course Bekele is going to have more individual honours than a man who has solely focused on the marathon for a decade.
Bekele was undoubtedly the king from 2002 to 2009 and was still very strong after that, but if he could only run two races a year in that time period would he have as many gold medals as Kipchoge racked up in the marathon from 2013 to 2022? I'm not so sure. With that said the track is a much harder event to dominate since you will always be going up against the strongest runners in the world in any major final whereas the best marathoners often avoid eachother or enter different races.
Overall I'd say Kipchoge in the marathon and Kenny on the track were equally dominant. Kipchoge's performances on the track is about the same as Bekele in the marathon but Bekele takes it with his utterly dominant XC record.
There is a clear distinction between the time trials that he ran and actual races.
World Athletics will never ever ratify the time trials and no one is bothered by that. Nike knew both times that there was zero chance that those time trials in Italy and Austria are nothing more than time trials. He would never claim either TT as a personal best.
In an actual race? 2:01:09.
We can go as far as to say Dennis Kimetto or Haile Gebrselassie are just as fast as Kipchoge considering super shoes.
Heck 2:01:41 by Bekele vs 2:01:39 by Kipchoge in my books the "41" was better due to less than ideal weather conditions.
I am more marvelled at Kipchoge's ability to win almost every single time over his time trials and his Berlin performances.
Go a step further. One of the most popular marathon races to watch was won in 2:08:59 by Rod Dixon over Geoff Smith in New York, rolling course, mano-a-mano race, a timely pick off with Dixon suffering cramps.
But, now I am getting off topic.
If we take Kipchoge's career and Bekele's career, Bekele was to cross-country and the 5000/10,000m as to what Kipchoge is to the marathon....
Track: Bekele. World Records. yes, I have to mention that he didn't wear supershoes..(sorry)
Road: Kipchoge-He certainly won the battle against father time (vs bekele) and has proven that even while approaching 40, he is an artist on the roads.
Olympics: Bekele- Gold/Silver 2004, Gold/Gold 2008 vs Kipchoge Bronze 2004, Silver 2008 and 2016/2021 marathon Gold
Kipchoge was behind Bekele for both of his track medals. Yes, his two marathon golds are impressive, but given the head-to-head battles, I have to go with Bekele.
XC: Bekele
Just a couple things:
Olympics: Bekele 3G/1S/0B | Kipchoge 2G/1S/1B
XC : Bekele with 11 golds
Roads: Bekele 2G/1S/2B in 13 marathons | Kipchoge 15G/1S/0B in 17 marathons
I'm willing to concede that Kipchoge benefits from recency bias, but I think people have forgotten how unpredictable the marathon was before Kipchoge, and a big part of why I consider him the GOAT is how he's redefined what's possible in the marathon. Geb redefined what's possible on the track and roads far more than Bekele did.
I also think people downplay how good Kipchoge was on the track. Obviously, Bekele was way better, but I think Kipchoge on the track was better than Bekele on the roads. He ran what was the #4 5k time ever, a silver and bronze Oly medal, and a gold and a silver at WCs. He ran between 1st and 4th at every global championship from '03-'08. Bekele is basically the Alan Webb of the marathon. He's a monster when in shape, but is so inconsistently in shape. He can throw down fast times but he's never healthy/fit enough when it matters.
Pro Bekele: Insane track career, XC and insane Marathon PR.
Pro Kipchoge: Longvity and neverseen domination in the marathon for 10 freakin' years.
I'd still go with Bekele. Yes, he flamed out quicker, but this has to be expected and the "best" doesn't mean very good for a couple years, it means the best, the quickest.
Medals/titles: Bekele wins.
PRs: Bekele wins, too. 12:37/26:17/2:01:41 in total looks better than 12:46/26:53/2:01:09.
When Kipchoge threepeats it might change.
Until he does that, it just shows how absurd good Bekele was, as he ran close to Kipchoge's marathon WR although he wasn't at 100 % anymore and barely able to string together healthy training for a long period.
My thesis: If Bekele started running marathons in 2009, he for sure could have run at least 2:00:xx.
So in short: Better overall runner at peak: Bekele.
Better longvity and road racer: Kipchoge.
I mean, I think Bekele AND Gebresalassie are better runners than Kipchoge.
Both certainly better on the track.
let’s remember Kipchoge isn’t that far ahead of Kenny in the marathon time-wise in more attempts.
Geb in super shoes in a half or full marathon…. He ran 58:55 and 2:03:59 (which was mind-blowing at the time, 2008). I think he’d certainly be near 2:02 with the alpha-moonboot shoes.
Track: Bekele. World Records. yes, I have to mention that he didn't wear supershoes..(sorry)
Road: Kipchoge-He certainly won the battle against father time (vs bekele) and has proven that even while approaching 40, he is an artist on the roads.
Olympics: Bekele- Gold/Silver 2004, Gold/Gold 2008 vs Kipchoge Bronze 2004, Silver 2008 and 2016/2021 marathon Gold
Kipchoge was behind Bekele for both of his track medals. Yes, his two marathon golds are impressive, but given the head-to-head battles, I have to go with Bekele.
XC: Bekele
Just a couple things:
Olympics: Bekele 3G/1S/0B | Kipchoge 2G/1S/1B
XC : Bekele with 11 golds
Roads: Bekele 2G/1S/2B in 13 marathons | Kipchoge 15G/1S/0B in 17 marathons
I'm willing to concede that Kipchoge benefits from recency bias, but I think people have forgotten how unpredictable the marathon was before Kipchoge, and a big part of why I consider him the GOAT is how he's redefined what's possible in the marathon. Geb redefined what's possible on the track and roads far more than Bekele did.
I also think people downplay how good Kipchoge was on the track. Obviously, Bekele was way better, but I think Kipchoge on the track was better than Bekele on the roads. He ran what was the #4 5k time ever, a silver and bronze Oly medal, and a gold and a silver at WCs. He ran between 1st and 4th at every global championship from '03-'08. Bekele is basically the Alan Webb of the marathon. He's a monster when in shape, but is so inconsistently in shape. He can throw down fast times but he's never healthy/fit enough when it matters.
Did you just give kipchoge golds for the breaking 2 and ineos challenge lol
I think Kipchoge on the track was better than Bekele on the roads. He ran what was the #4 5k time ever,
Relevant to note that in the new shoe era, Kipchoge is now 9th all time and Bekele only dropped one place to 2nd all time for 5000.
I can see your point about Kipchoge being better on track than Bekele on roads when it comes to medals, but for me at least, being the 2nd fastest marathoner ever certainly sounds better than 9th fastest ever over 5000m.
i think bekele is more talented, but kipchoge had the superior endgame. even if kipchoge could see his own future 20 years ago, not much about his running would have changed. perhaps he would have moved up to the marathon sooner and made a little more money. if bekele could see his own future 20 years ago, he'd probably avoid injuries and stop hammering so many miles on the track with middle distance spikes.
kipchoge ultimately gets the win because he is more known to the casuals and even gets advertised by nike. kipchoge made more money and that is why he is the better distance runner.
kipchoge ultimately gets the win because he is more known to the casuals and even gets advertised by nike. kipchoge made more money and that is why he is the better distance runner.
The OP asked who is the better runner, not who is wealthier or more famous. This is not a popularity contest.
Bekele won more world golds but I think Kipchoge's WMM victories are equivalent to a world gold. Kipchoge was able to win gold both on the track and on the road in the marathon where as Bekele was only the main force on the track.
Two questions:
1. Can you explain how winning the Berlin, Tokyo, and Chicago marathons is equivalent to a world track championship?
Kipchoge's consistency is what edges him imo. Bekele is great, but when has Kipchoge not shown up? Has he ever hinted at DNFs or DNSs?
While Bekele has the track credentials to surpass Kipchoge, let's not pretend Bekele was never threatened by Kipchoge. Let's not forget that Kipchoge left for the roads early; who's to say he didn't leave behind years of handing Bekele his lunch?
I would be surprised if Kipchoge couldn't run sub 13 and sub 26:40 today.
Ultimately, this is the LeBron/Jordan debate. One of those two are number one all time- that much is undisputed.