Pre didn’t have to contend with the onslaught of East Africans as is the case over the past 3 decades, nor middle eastern runners.
The competitive landscape now or since the 90’s is completely different then in the 1970’s.
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apples and pears wrote:
Not really a Pre fan but he was as fast as Grant in HS and in his early 20s.
2 mile HS school time:
Pre – 8:41.5 (national record)
Grant – 8:43.575000M PRs age 22
Pre – 13:22.4
Grant – 13:293000M PRs age 22
Pre – 7:44.2
Grant – 7:46.10Don't these times indicate that Pre had just as much talent, especially considering all the advantages Grant had with training, equipment, pacers, etc. Does anyone really think that if Grant ran in Pre's time and without a pro contract his times would be anywhere close to what he ran this year? I'm not convinced he would have even have been as fast as Pre if he was transported back in time and did the same training.
Guaranteed, Steve Prefontain trained harder in HS them Grant Fisher.
Pres era trained either lots of miles, lots of speed or both. Call it the Lingren effect.
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MO Strong wrote:
Pre didn’t have to contend with the onslaught of East Africans as is the case over the past 3 decades, nor middle eastern runners.
Umm... you might want to check who was 2nd in that race in Munich.
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MO Strong wrote:
apples and pears wrote:
Not really a Pre fan but he was as fast as Grant in HS and in his early 20s.
2 mile HS school time:
Pre – 8:41.5 (national record)
Grant – 8:43.575000M PRs age 22
Pre – 13:22.4
Grant – 13:293000M PRs age 22
Pre – 7:44.2
Grant – 7:46.10Don't these times indicate that Pre had just as much talent, especially considering all the advantages Grant had with training, equipment, pacers, etc. Does anyone really think that if Grant ran in Pre's time and without a pro contract his times would be anywhere close to what he ran this year? I'm not convinced he would have even have been as fast as Pre if he was transported back in time and did the same training.
Guaranteed, Steve Prefontain trained harder in HS them Grant Fisher.
Pres era trained either lots of miles, lots of speed or both. Call it the Lingren effect.
Please do NOT guarantee things over which you logically cannot.
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.consider.this. wrote:
In the '70s, Prefontaine was within 5 seconds of the WR in the 1500, 3.5 sec of the mile, 5 sec of the 3000, 6.2 sec in the 5000 and 12.8sec for the 10,000 m.
Fisher is much further away from the current WRs.
In the 70’s Lasse Viren blood doped through transfusion, most others did not.
The world record you now compare is highly suspicious of being EPO advanced.
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MO Strong wrote:
.consider.this. wrote:
In the '70s, Prefontaine was within 5 seconds of the WR in the 1500, 3.5 sec of the mile, 5 sec of the 3000, 6.2 sec in the 5000 and 12.8sec for the 10,000 m.
Fisher is much further away from the current WRs.
In the 70’s Lasse Viren blood doped through transfusion, most others did not.
The world record you now compare is highly suspicious of being EPO advanced.
As is the US 10000m record likely “aided.” Not sure why you had to go there.
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Kennie wrote:
MO Strong wrote:
Guaranteed, Steve Prefontain trained harder in HS them Grant Fisher.
Pres era trained either lots of miles, lots of speed or both. Call it the Lingren effect.
Please do NOT guarantee things over which you logically cannot.
Read about Pre’s training in HS and Fishers.
Safe to say “guaranteed”
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Comparing guys 50 YEARS APART? Yeah right. Take Grant Fisher and put him back in 1972 with those training methods, shoes, etc....Fisher is like Paul Geis or Gerry Lindgren, good but an also ran.
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Just Another Hobby Jogger wrote:
MO Strong wrote:
Pre didn’t have to contend with the onslaught of East Africans as is the case over the past 3 decades, nor middle eastern runners.
Umm... you might want to check who was 2nd in that race in Munich.
Onslaught implies great numbers.
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Gammoudi was from Tunisia, a long way from E Africa.
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Just Another Hobby Jogger wrote:
MO Strong wrote:
Pre didn’t have to contend with the onslaught of East Africans as is the case over the past 3 decades, nor middle eastern runners.
Umm... you might want to check who was 2nd in that race in Munich.
1 guy from Tunisia is neither an "East African" nor an "onslaught." Try again.
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Prefontaine might not have won the NCAA 5000 with a 13:22 this year, and would have been 16 seconds behind the fastest collegian over the course of the season. I don't think saying "4th fastest in history" in 1972 gets you very far, considering who was making up that history.
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Makes Paper wrote:
Just Another Hobby Jogger wrote:
Umm... you might want to check who was 2nd in that race in Munich.
1 guy from Tunisia is neither an "East African" nor an "onslaught." Try again.
Tunisia is not "middle eastern"?
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Gammoudi is the first African to win a track medal (silver) in Olympic Games (Tokyo 1964)
(not counting marathon as a track distance)
Then a gold medal 5000m in 1968.
His personality is completely hijacked in the movie "Without limits":
To answer OP:
Fisher (for several reasons)
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Fisher with 0 doubt in my mind. Pre placed 4th once in the Olympics. Fisher placed 5th in the Olympics and 4th and 6th in WCs, and his times are way more impressive than Pre's. Plus, it looks like Fisher is gonna have plenty more years to get medals. Pre had better times in college but Fisher was never time trialing in college. Besides, plenty of guys run fast in college and never run faster as a pro. Running faster in college doesn't show that you're better.
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Pre's winning % was far higher than Fisher's.
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Prefontaine was undefeated at 6M/10,000m on the track.
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Pre was obsessed with winning. If he lived today he would have loved to be trained by Salazar. I doubt Pre would be concerned about carnitine drips as long as he was winning. In fact, Salazar probably would be one of the few people who could take Pre to his absolute best.
I still think Fisher lives at a time where the competition is 3x greater in both quality and depth. Fisher will easily become the best American of all time unless he sustains some major injury.
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You can't compare runners 50 YEARS APART. Put Fisher in context of 1972...no $$$ involved, have to work to make ends meet, no supplements, no super shoes, simplified training compared to today....doesn't compare at all.
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Is fixing careless typos in headlines — “Pre of Grant Fisher” — too much to ask?
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