Rewatched it to try to figure it out because it didn’t make any sense. He seemed to run the majority of the race in lane 2 or beyond which could be 30+ meters extra distance. He’s also not used to mixing it up with that many bodies which may have played a role. If I’m Dathan, I’m having him run a bunch of races from the back and middle next year to hone those prelim tactics
That's just not true. He races well on the circuit so he knows how to compete in these races.
Looks to me like he made mistakes. First, he didn't hold on to second/third place which is where he needs to be - even front running would have been preferable to drifting into the pack for a guy like him. Then he made moves around the outside which required a big surge before the final 100. Contrast with Kerr who stayed patient, stayed on the inside, and waited for the gaps to open up in the final 100. Hoare was broken with around 30m to go. He ran a race that he wasn't used to running and it's cost him. A guy who runs a 3:47 mile should be beating people like Fontes but it's not like he's the only casualty, Tefera was a lot of people's outside bet for a medal and he's gone as well
He totally panicked when he lost is second position and used that surge to get back up to the front. When he did that just to get himself up to running in almost lane 3 with it still so bunched up, I knew he was in trouble. Too bad, he was clearly in good form. Go Badgers!
You make some good points, maybe just a bad day, maybe he's sick or carrying a niggle.
Maybe bragging about his garbage diet and trash talking opponents is childish insecurity. I'd start by addressing this before Commonwealth Games. What are you afraid of? complete dedication doesn't give you anywhere to hide.
They're making a lot of noise and haven't backed up the talk, peaking definitely needs to be questioned.
I'm sure Hoare can handle the blow back. He gives it, he knows he's got to be able to take it.
Carlos gone. Falland and McDonald missing. Hurta and Beamish race like lost little sheep. Hoare horrible today. The 2x 10,000m runners get a pass, championship 25 laps are hard to judge, you're either a contender or carnage.
It's a new group with some exciting talent mixed with some absolute work horses. I'm cheering for them, hence the frustration, but they've achieved nothing apart from a good budget and terrific recruiting. It's going to take many years for the coach to fully develop.
OAC and particularly Ollie Hoare are 100% good for the sport
Why does it always have to be they didn't peak at the right time or their training was incorrect after one bad performance? He had a really poor race tactically - he was impatient and fighting for position the whole time. He should've just stuck in lane 1 behind Jakob and rode behind him until the end. Hopefully he learns and salvages something from the rest of the season because he is good for athletics. If he doesn't then go to town on his training all you want....
You make some good points, maybe just a bad day, maybe he's sick or carrying a niggle.
Maybe bragging about his garbage diet and trash talking opponents is childish insecurity. I'd start by addressing this before Commonwealth Games. What are you afraid of? complete dedication doesn't give you anywhere to hide.
They're making a lot of noise and haven't backed up the talk, peaking definitely needs to be questioned.
I'm sure Hoare can handle the blow back. He gives it, he knows he's got to be able to take it.
Carlos gone. Falland and McDonald missing. Hurta and Beamish race like lost little sheep. Hoare horrible today. The 2x 10,000m runners get a pass, championship 25 laps are hard to judge, you're either a contender or carnage.
It's a new group with some exciting talent mixed with some absolute work horses. I'm cheering for them, hence the frustration, but they've achieved nothing apart from a good budget and terrific recruiting. It's going to take many years for the coach to fully develop.
OAC and particularly Ollie Hoare are 100% good for the sport
Disagree about Hurta. She has been racing aggressively this year and has had strong results.
That's just not true. He races well on the circuit so he knows how to compete in these races.
Looks to me like he made mistakes. First, he didn't hold on to second/third place which is where he needs to be - even front running would have been preferable to drifting into the pack for a guy like him. Then he made moves around the outside which required a big surge before the final 100. Contrast with Kerr who stayed patient, stayed on the inside, and waited for the gaps to open up in the final 100. Hoare was broken with around 30m to go. He ran a race that he wasn't used to running and it's cost him. A guy who runs a 3:47 mile should be beating people like Fontes but it's not like he's the only casualty, Tefera was a lot of people's outside bet for a medal and he's gone as well
The bolded sentence is exactly the problem. He races in the circuit a lot. Diamond leagues. Races that are fast and with pacers. This year, he’s run 3:50 at Pre, 3:47 in Oslo and 3:35 or 6 in Birmingham. All pretty fast races. The semi was a 3:37 race with more top talent. There is a reason the Mario Garcia Romo, who was racing tactical races in the NCAA was ahead of Hoare and made the final.
How is racing in the DL a problem? Yes, there's rabbits but most still end up tactical unless Jakob is in there. Birmingham was tactical and he ran pretty well. He simply made mistakes by surging to regain position rather than waiting for the gaps to open. Probably a result of panicking because he wasn't in his usual position close to the front. One thing I'm sure of is he won't getter better by beating up on US domestic elites at the American Track League. He's a global talent, finished third in the DL final. He should be racing on that stage.
Why does it always have to be they didn't peak at the right time or their training was incorrect after one bad performance? He had a really poor race tactically - he was impatient and fighting for position the whole time. He should've just stuck in lane 1 behind Jakob and rode behind him until the end. Hopefully he learns and salvages something from the rest of the season because he is good for athletics. If he doesn't then go to town on his training all you want....
You make some good points, maybe just a bad day, maybe he's sick or carrying a niggle.
Maybe bragging about his garbage diet and trash talking opponents is childish insecurity. I'd start by addressing this before Commonwealth Games. What are you afraid of? complete dedication doesn't give you anywhere to hide.
They're making a lot of noise and haven't backed up the talk, peaking definitely needs to be questioned.
I'm sure Hoare can handle the blow back. He gives it, he knows he's got to be able to take it.
Carlos gone. Falland and McDonald missing. Hurta and Beamish race like lost little sheep. Hoare horrible today. The 2x 10,000m runners get a pass, championship 25 laps are hard to judge, you're either a contender or carnage.
It's a new group with some exciting talent mixed with some absolute work horses. I'm cheering for them, hence the frustration, but they've achieved nothing apart from a good budget and terrific recruiting. It's going to take many years for the coach to fully develop.
OAC and particularly Ollie Hoare are 100% good for the sport
Hurta seems to be having a good year. Klecker did as well as he could in the 10k. I kind of agree on Beamish. It always looks like he's scared to hurt himself which he'll need to do if he ever wants to make the 1500 standard. A flying last 400 will only take him so far
Why does it always have to be they didn't peak at the right time or their training was incorrect after one bad performance? He had a really poor race tactically - he was impatient and fighting for position the whole time. He should've just stuck in lane 1 behind Jakob and rode behind him until the end. Hopefully he learns and salvages something from the rest of the season because he is good for athletics. If he doesn't then go to town on his training all you want....
Really good point! Which is why if Tefera wasn’t in the race Olli would’ve made it. Tefera was on Jakob’s shoulder (trying to push him off the track) which is where Olli planned/likes to be. He had no idea what to do when that spot wasn’t available to him.
Really good point! Which is why if Tefera wasn’t in the race Olli would’ve made it. Tefera was on Jakob’s shoulder (trying to push him off the track) which is where Olli planned/likes to be. He had no idea what to do when that spot wasn’t available to him.
I mean to some degree this is a thing you could say. But Tim was dealing with the exact same stuff and made his moves more intelligently and purposefully. He was able to look around and cruise the last 100. Truth be told, Olli had several chances to take the lead and control it or drop back and be content to conserve energy. Instead he seemed obsessed with being in second place, which is only something to worry about in the last 400 meters (and that's only if you don't believe in your kick).
Agreed. The issue with wanting to be positioned in second is everyone wants to be positioned in second so it's the most competitive spot to hold. Much easier to hold second in a DL where there's 2-3 other class athletes compared to a major where there's 6
Or in a speedy race like Heat 2. Abel really only had Wightman and Katir to worry about. Jakob knew what he was doing and he also had some fortune that Tefera had no idea how to close off the inside.
You make some good points, maybe just a bad day, maybe he's sick or carrying a niggle.
Maybe bragging about his garbage diet and trash talking opponents is childish insecurity. I'd start by addressing this before Commonwealth Games. What are you afraid of? complete dedication doesn't give you anywhere to hide.
They're making a lot of noise and haven't backed up the talk, peaking definitely needs to be questioned.
I'm sure Hoare can handle the blow back. He gives it, he knows he's got to be able to take it.
Carlos gone. Falland and McDonald missing. Hurta and Beamish race like lost little sheep. Hoare horrible today. The 2x 10,000m runners get a pass, championship 25 laps are hard to judge, you're either a contender or carnage.
It's a new group with some exciting talent mixed with some absolute work horses. I'm cheering for them, hence the frustration, but they've achieved nothing apart from a good budget and terrific recruiting. It's going to take many years for the coach to fully develop.
OAC and particularly Ollie Hoare are 100% good for the sport
Disagree about Hurta. She has been racing aggressively this year and has had strong results.
Very fit, reasonable speed. Poorly practiced, she can't hit smooth segments which is crucial.
Hoare wasn't overraced compared to NCAA's. Jakob ran 3:49 at Pre--testing out the world's track--and 3:47 in Oslo. No major difference there. Hoare got bad luck being in the heat of death and didn't do anything to make his own luck such as making the heat fast enough to get more qualifiers. It's not as if everyone was killed by faster heats in Tokyo last year.
Slightly off topic here, but even with there being a couple surprise casualties in the semis (and Tefera didn’t surprise me, honestly), you’d have to say that the 4 medal favorites tomorrow are the same top-4 from Tokyo: Ingebrigtsen, Cheruiyot, Kerr, Kipsang.
Really good point! Which is why if Tefera wasn’t in the race Olli would’ve made it. Tefera was on Jakob’s shoulder (trying to push him off the track) which is where Olli planned/likes to be. He had no idea what to do when that spot wasn’t available to him.
I mean to some degree this is a thing you could say. But Tim was dealing with the exact same stuff and made his moves more intelligently and purposefully. He was able to look around and cruise the last 100. Truth be told, Olli had several chances to take the lead and control it or drop back and be content to conserve energy. Instead he seemed obsessed with being in second place, which is only something to worry about in the last 400 meters (and that's only if you don't believe in your kick).
Tim has a lot more experience at this level, so it's not surprising that he managed himself as well as he did.
The bolded sentence is exactly the problem. He races in the circuit a lot. Diamond leagues. Races that are fast and with pacers. This year, he’s run 3:50 at Pre, 3:47 in Oslo and 3:35 or 6 in Birmingham. All pretty fast races. The semi was a 3:37 race with more top talent. There is a reason the Mario Garcia Romo, who was racing tactical races in the NCAA was ahead of Hoare and made the final.
How is racing in the DL a problem? Yes, there's rabbits but most still end up tactical unless Jakob is in there. Birmingham was tactical and he ran pretty well. He simply made mistakes by surging to regain position rather than waiting for the gaps to open. Probably a result of panicking because he wasn't in his usual position close to the front. One thing I'm sure of is he won't getter better by beating up on US domestic elites at the American Track League. He's a global talent, finished third in the DL final. He should be racing on that stage.
It showed to be a problem in his prelim when he struggled in a tactical race. Birmingham was tactical but it was a completely different race than his prelim. He panicked because he wasn’t in his usual position. He won’t be in his usual position in a bunched-up tactical race. His usual position typically happens when the race is strung out.
One solution is to race some 800s. It’s not ideal and it’s not the same, but I remember Salazar having Rupp, Mo Farah and Centro racing shorter distances to work on their speed and tactics. He could also seek out races without rabbits. Also easier said than done. It doesn’t have to be every race, but one or two a season would be helpful.
It’ll come with more championship experience. He got some at the Olympics last year and indoors this year. Some people only need a few championship races, others need a bit more. Olli is young and has plenty more championships in his career. I’m glad he’s racing the commonwealth games in a few weeks. That’ll add more experience and give him more practice with tactics.
the guy is in the shape of his life but ruined it with his Inge obsession and this Keith McSqueezy stuff.
if he backs his own ability and takes the opportunities as they present then he qualifies. instead he tried to cue off someone else and manufacture something that simply wasn’t there.
hes raced a lot the whole time hes been under dathan and never seemed to hold him back before since he has been a consistent force for a few years. i figured his problem was his ceiling, which seems to be around the 332 range. not nearly fast enough to medal anyway.