bigmig19 wrote:
You dont see cyclists crash to the ground after every finish. Not sure why XC skiers have to.
Maybe because they know it's on the snow and not pavement.
bigmig19 wrote:
You dont see cyclists crash to the ground after every finish. Not sure why XC skiers have to.
Maybe because they know it's on the snow and not pavement.
Cross-country skiing. Even more so on days when it is 10 F or lower. Marathoners may have to deal sometimes with heat, but most races don't have to add in the factor of breathing in such cold air while competing.
100 meter dash.
Runningart2004 wrote:
Also Vo2max is not static. Your Vo2max while cycling will not be your Vo2max while running nor will it be your Vo2max while nordic skiing. Obviously if an activity used more muscle mass then more O2 is required.
Hence all the top numbers are always XC skiiers.
Runningart2004 wrote:
Olympic Triathletes probably burn more calories.
If a particular aerobic activity is using more oxygen it's probably also burning more oxygen, so it's at least unclear that triathletes would be burning calories at a higher rate, particularly in the draft-legal Olympic format.
Anecdotally, my most epic bonks have been in Nordic ski marathons (50 km), but I'm kind of a poorly trained hack when it comes to Nordic ski racing.
Just Another Hobby Jogger wrote:
bigmig19 wrote:
I will say however, I see more dudes and gals on the "floor" face down after XC final than in marathoning. Maybe that's just the culture. Lactic acid is lactic acid. Cycling can sometimes come down to cat and mouse with one burst at the finish. Sometimes not. You dont see cyclists crash to the ground after every finish. Not sure why XC skiers have to.
It's easier on your body to fall down on snow than on asphalt. I once fell down to the ground right after crossing the line in a marathon which ended inside a football field. I am not sure if I had done the same if the surface had been asphalt instead of grass. In case of cycling, you also have to consider the danger of incoming cyclists colliding into bodies on the ground.
Thats my point, if cyclist can stay upright at the top of uphill finish, then maybe XC skiers can too. They seem a bit more dramatic. But I dont think its harder than cycling or running.
Decathlon
GettingFasterDude wrote:
bigmig19 wrote:
You dont see cyclists crash to the ground after every finish. Not sure why XC skiers have to.
Maybe because they know it's on the snow and not pavement.
Exactly. So the XC people crash to the soft ground and it looks like a more grueling sport (the orignal ?). Thats all im trying to say. I dont know that they have more of a need to fall right down vs a pro cyclist. No cyclist saves energy so they dont fall. They just dont fall. Laurent Fignon aside.
The world's best cross country skiers have higher VO2 readings than the world's best marathoners.
And guys like Vegard Ulvang have skied across Greenland. He didn't even find the need to put it on Instagram, either.
Cyclists, at their most fit, break bones when the fall two feet. They're that frail. Marathoners can't do anything but run in a straight line. XC skiers kill bears, eat them for lunch, then ski another 100K before sleeping in an ice cave.
Avid, post-competitive D1 runner here. I took up xc skiing seven years ago.
The classic style of xc skiing has a very similar locomotion to distance running but there is a need to develop lower back, lower stomach and upper arm strength different than what you obtain through distance running. The technique takes time to master and feel natural. During the first season I was focused on building balance and strength, getting technique down and, plainly, getting out there to gain experience. I can currently classic ski upwards of 4 hours per day but any time we do that and I burn greater than 4000 calories, I can eat everything in sight afterward.
I think where the real hard, full body workout comes from is the other style of xc skiiing - skate skiing. You have a basic lower body motion that mimics a roller skating/ice skating motion but it is also quite different from that too. Skate skiing the right way requires a level of upper body power and strength that is very unique. Most people when they start can't make it 50 yards. It is a very unnatural and heavily coordinated sequence of events each stride.
Garmin too wrote:
Rowing.
From experience in many sports I did...
Stop it.
Its 6 minutes in the olympics.
You aren't Captain Bligh, rowing back to England
Coyote Montane wrote:
I run more now but have done both for many years, and ski raced competitively from my mid 20s to mid 50s, racing at US nationals a few times and medaling at masters nationals. Likewise, have run forever and completed 15 or 20 marathons. It is hard to say which is tougher, a running marathon and ski marathon are different. In skiing you can push yourself to the brink on hill climbs, thinking you're going to die but the downhills, while sometimes fast and furious, offer enough of a break so that you can keep going. The pounding on your legs while running hurts more toward the end of marathon, but with skiing you also bonk. The last 5K or 10K of a 42-50K ski race can be just as much of a slog as the end of a marathon. Your legs might not feel as sore during and immediately after, but they just won't move well, and your breathing/heart rate can be off the charts. I'd say one of the toughest races is the 30K skiathlon, especially on a hilly course. The classic part just puts you under, and then switching to skate can be real tough. Sometimes after a few Ks of skating you can get your legs and lungs back and can finish strong. Here are my three toughest finishes over the past 12-15 years (hard to pick an order) but Boston 2018, Pikes Peak Ascent (not a marathon of course but timewise, yes like a very tough marathon), and 30K skiathlon that had maximum vertical allowed (all hills).
I have a similar profile. In terms of effort applied during a race, all these endurance sports completely max you out, can cause muscle cramping, and exhaustion to the limit equally. Running is the hardest sport for me because after a marathon, my legs are destroyed. There is no other sport, XC Ski, cycling, swimming that I cannot be mostly recovered from in a couple of days. A running marathon tears me apart, and thus the pros only do a few per year. Brutal.
Skier VO2max is higher than runner VO2 max because skiers are exercising their arm muscles as well. This means more oxygen uptake which means higher VO2max.
Having done running, cycling, and skiing at a high level, there is no question that marathon running is the hardest of the three in terms of how much it trashes your body. Obviously all three are difficult to perform well, and I think trying to say one is harder than the other is foolish. But if you're having a bad day skiing or biking you can sort of coast in, sort of. Not true in the marathon. When your legs go, you are screwed. It is agony to move at all. The eccentric muscle contractions and accumulated microtears take a huge toll.
Curling. But only if you're married to your mixed double partner.
800 meters. Horrible. The toughest.
I ran the mile relay, the half, two-mile relay, the mile and 1500 in college. I run marathons now. Nothing is as demanding as the 800.
professional male jogger wrote:
Garmin too wrote:
Rowing.
From experience in many sports I did...
Stop it.
Its 6 minutes in the olympics.
You aren't Captain Bligh, rowing back to England
I've done everything discussed on this thread. Was a D1 runner in college, Nordic ski team in high school and ended up being a pro cyclist.
Let me tell ya, the 2k erg test is the mother of all suffering. I've only done two of them but I fear them. lol
It's only about 5.5 to 7min depending on your level but it HURTS. Skate skiing is a close second.
I think it's using more muscles or something. When you go deep into the red it's something else. The 20min after a race is much more painful for me.
xcskier66 wrote:
Training: XC skiing is way harder. Skiers can train 25+ hours a week which is impossible in running. Plus you have to master the multiple techniques and lifting matters much more. Running training is hard but you could be world class and work a part time job...not so in XC skiing.
Isn't running just much more competitive as a sport though? Like by several orders of magnitude. It's a very simple sport to do and you don't need much in the way of environment or equipment to train. Skiing looks like you need snow, special skis, boots, clothing etc etc to the degree that only a tiny proportion of the world's population will have the means to access and try out the sport seriously. I would say that running as a sport is just far harder because the depth of competition is so much higher.
That said, cross country skiing looks like a cool sport on TV, and the ambiance amongst the competitors looks much better than in running. I would love to be able to try it out but I don't live in place with mountains or regular snow etc etc ...
This is Jim Kiler wrote:
XC skiers kill bears, eat them for lunch, then ski another 100K before sleeping in an ice cave.
Are bears on the Olympic XC course? I must have missed it - it sounds like a helluvan event....
LennyZ wrote:
I have a similar profile. In terms of effort applied during a race, all these endurance sports completely max you out, can cause muscle cramping, and exhaustion to the limit equally. Running is the hardest sport for me because after a marathon, my legs are destroyed. There is no other sport, XC Ski, cycling, swimming that I cannot be mostly recovered from in a couple of days. A running marathon tears me apart, and thus the pros only do a few per year. Brutal.
When I think "grueling", I don't consider recovery, just how difficult it is during the race. For me the skiing 50K is more grueling, more of a full body exertion and exhaustion. I've only raced two marathons (not my event, I'm a shorter distance guy) and even cramping up at 20 miles and pushing on, it was not grueling like skiing 50Ks is for me. It's just the legs, and I guess I dissociate well, maybe why I'm a good racer.
Marathon running races are brutal on the legs. There is no weight bearing sport like it in that aspect. Skiing is more like cycling where you max out well above a sustainable pace on hills then recover some on downhills.
If you are doing them right, both are brutally hard when trained and raced to your potential. It is a bit like saying the marathon is harder than the 800. The reality is if raced to your potential both hurt a lot, just in different ways. If you jog an 800, sure that is easy.
As far as technique, classic and skate are different motions but equally demanding when racing if properly trained.
If you bonk in a 50 mile run you just walk. Moving uphill in a 50k ski when bonked is a nightmare. I would much rather bonk in a running race.