Should I hire a coach for my son? Input please

this decision should be entirely up to him. if he feels like he has issues or gets frustrated with the coaching and or training, suggest the private coach option. if he never has an issue w the hs coach stick w her. Also, remember just bc someone is a private coach doesnt necessarily mean theyre better than a hs coach. do your research

Whatever you do, would suggest staying out of it and let him decide his fate.

Don't listen to the crap Flagpole posted, good god, what crap.

Take one day off a week, it is OK, just ask BYU. There is no magic formula or required mileage to hit, only a fool thinks that is the case.

No to the private coach.

This is an opportunity for the school's coach to raise her game by reading books on training, going to coaches' clinics, and looking at coaching resources online. This will help transform her team's entire future for the rest of her coaching career. Suggest this to her with your support for her program.

I must admit I was trolling a bit with this post. Killing some time and curious about what advice I would've gotten. The truth of the matter is this is the situation I was in 4 years ago with my son and me not having any knowledge about the sport. All times I gave for his middle school years are off give or take a couple seconds. He ended up not getting a private coach and taught himself good training through books and online resources. He started out reading Jack Daniels and went from there. He stayed fairly low mileage through high school. Freshman and sophomore year 30 mpw. Junior and senior year 40 with pushing toward 50 occasionally. He qualified for Footlocker nationals his junior year in 2019 right before covid hit, lost his junior year track season. I'll back up and say he was a sub 4:20, sub 9:15 kid his sophomore year outdoor. By his junior year his track coach let him take over coaching duties for the boys side on track and cross. She was more than happy to at the time. He was recruited heavily from many power 5 schools, since he had no junior year times they were going off of his sophomore outdoor times and footlocker nationals his junior year. His senior year on cross he was top 5 at one of the national championship meets that happened in the absence of Nike and Footlocker. His senior year outdoor this past spring he went sub 1:53, sub 4:07, sub 9. He signed with with a power 5 school that has very strong academics and seems to be top 15 on ncaa cross yearly. Very good scholarship(not a full ride though). He was offered a full from only one school(small d1 distance oriented). He has basically coached himself through high school with help from many resources(Lets Run included). I've wondered what could he have done with some high end coach like Schwartz and higher mileage during his high school years but he did pretty good on his own. Also stayed injury free for the most part.

If you want to be a good high school runner, 70+ the summer before your senior year is required for most. It's not outrageous either as top D1 programs will have you running 100 MPW+.

calling all idiots wrote:

Whatever you do, would suggest staying out of it and let him decide his fate.

Don't listen to the crap Flagpole posted, good god, what crap.

Take one day off a week, it is OK, just ask BYU. There is no magic formula or required mileage to hit, only a fool thinks that is the case.

Nope! It is EXCELLENT advice for a high school runner who isn't injury prone and wants to be good. I didn't say it was a magic formula, but you have to make plans. PLANNING to run less than 70 MPW as a senior in high school is planning to not be as good as you could be. To get good at running, you need to spend time RUNNING.

Manbearpig15 wrote:

Who is this kid????

My kid just turned 14 and has gone 2:11 800m/4:19 1500m/9:18 3000m.

I usually know who the top kids in the country are but I can't seem to find anyone on milesplit with his combo of times.

Very strong times!

Never, EVER met a kid with a private coach that wasn't a complete douche in high school. If you're offended by what I'm saying, you probably were the parent who hired one for your child. Let the kid have a normal life. The beautiful thing about running is you can pretty much google anything you need to know to help the kid and your coach can handle the rest.

Flagpole wrote:

calling all idiots wrote:

Whatever you do, would suggest staying out of it and let him decide his fate.

Don't listen to the crap Flagpole posted, good god, what crap.

Take one day off a week, it is OK, just ask BYU. There is no magic formula or required mileage to hit, only a fool thinks that is the case.

Nope! It is EXCELLENT advice for a high school runner who isn't injury prone and wants to be good. I didn't say it was a magic formula, but you have to make plans. PLANNING to run less than 70 MPW as a senior in high school is planning to not be as good as you could be. To get good at running, you need to spend time RUNNING.

I disagree with you. It is not good advice. You can't give out a number and expect it to work for anyone, especially someone you never met or have never seen run, poor advice.

You don't know who is injury prone until you push the limits, with your advice you are rolling the dice and could end a career before it ever starts.

If someone wants to be good, first of all they need the talent to be good, secondly they need to enjoy what they want to be good at or it ain't gonna go well for long, and third they need to develop consistency which is hard to do once you enter the injury cycle by over doing it early on.

Then, don't go to a school with a coach who does a one size fits all coaching plan. If you are on the lower end of things, say like Hocker, go where you will be allowed to build up and develop at a pace you can handle.

I do agree to run better you need to run more, it certainly worked for me, but not until i was midway through college.

I also don't agree with you saying don't take days off at all, rest is your friend, you don't benefit from hard running until you rest and recover. Don't be so insecure. I had a lot of success with HS kids while I was coaching and the secret was not the hard work, it was "easy days easy". Several went on to become very successful Div. 1 athletes, all-americans etc. a pro or two.

1) You are incorrect to disagree. 70 MPW is pretty standard (and actually even low) for elite high school distance runners.

2) Yes, the plan I set out will work for high school BOYS who are not injury prone...or don't have some sort of other medical issue.

3) Some may need to take a light week every 3 weeks, but 70 MPW is not really that much for a senior who has already been running since they were a freshman. If they just started running, then no, 70 MPW is not what they should do.

4) 70 MPW is not pushing limits. You don't coddle elite athletes. You TRAIN them. This amount of running is not playing with fire...it is a reasonable amount for an elite high school senior to be running, assuming he has been at it since he was a freshman. It works out to about an hour and 15 minutes (and LESS) of running per day. That is nothing for someone who has been training for 4 years.

5) My advice has them run 45 MPW by the end of the summer before their freshman year of CC. Then they race. They will know well before their senior year if they have talent or not. I was giving advice to an 8th grade kid who has already run 9:55 for 3200 meters. The talent is already evident.

6) There are exceptions to the amount of training required to make an elite high school runner. Cole Hocker is a HUGE exception. He could quite possibly be the best middle distance runner ever (time will tell, but it's possible). Can't pull out an example like that and expect that to be seen as the norm. I counter with Dathan Ritzenhein (who ran 90 MPW in HS) and just about every elite high school runner in the last 20 years who ran 70 MPW and more as a senior.

7) Rest doesn't mean no running. Fridays before meets are rest days...easy 3-4 mile run. 3 days off after each season, preferably in a run, day off, run, day off, run, day off format.

8) You are also misrepresenting what I've said. Nowhere did I say all this running was hard...in fact, I said NOT that...one workout midweek in-season, and then the race on Saturday. All other runs are done at easy to moderate pace.

Had you run more in high school, you would have been doing well with higher mileage in college earlier than you did.

Ok Flagpole, I'll counter Ritz with Lagat, who ran less than 70 mpw while running at a pretty high level i think, rumored to be around 40 mpw and he also took an entire month off at the end of his season. (as most Kenyans do)

You should have used Rudy Chapa as your example, Ritz was slacking compared to him in HS.

I also don't have a huge issue with 70 mpw, where I disagree with you is that you throw that number at someone you have never seen run. Trying to hit some random number that works for some does not mean it is THE number to hit and to insure success. For every guy who hit's 70 and runs well there are ten who don't, there is more to the equation than that.

Running is probably the only sport where people are cheap enough to vehemently protest coaching. If anyone reading this wants to reach their potential, get a personal coach.

I'm guessing this is Ethan Strand. Times and Footlocker results line up.

helper coach wrote:

What area of the US are you in? Maybe I can steer you in the right direction.

To the person that touted the level 1 certification. It’s a good overview but only a few hours of instruction of the endurance events. Level 2 a little better as it is specialized. Level 3 is great not only because of the instructors but also the top level students.

Level 3 or 4 greatly improves odds of competence, but isn't required or necessarily available.

For many online coaches, I expect you'd be lucky if they had Level 2... or any certification at all...

Can attest Level 2 is a huge spectrum.

Some very experienced and effective high-level coaches have (only) Level 2.

But there also Level 2s who are clueless. I took my Level 2 Distance with aerobics instructors who knew/know nothing about running. Most of what they thought they knew was useless, dangerous, or wrong. They passed.

calling all idiots wrote:

Ok Flagpole, I'll counter Ritz with Lagat, who ran less than 70 mpw while running at a pretty high level i think, rumored to be around 40 mpw and he also took an entire month off at the end of his season. (as most Kenyans do)

You should have used Rudy Chapa as your example, Ritz was slacking compared to him in HS.

Chapa, Ritz, the vast majority of any high school kid who ran even faster than 9:20 over the last 20 years...

I've tired of this topic. You're advice is bad. Mine is great.

Flagpole wrote:

calling all idiots wrote:

Ok Flagpole, I'll counter Ritz with Lagat, who ran less than 70 mpw while running at a pretty high level i think, rumored to be around 40 mpw and he also took an entire month off at the end of his season. (as most Kenyans do)

You should have used Rudy Chapa as your example, Ritz was slacking compared to him in HS.

Chapa, Ritz, the vast majority of any high school kid who ran even faster than 9:20 over the last 20 years...

I've tired of this topic. You're advice is bad. Mine is great.

*your*

Honestly, I respect your honesty, but how did he become the assistant coach in track/field/XC despite being a minor? I know you have student assistants in football (they help with trainers and water, etc.) but even the lowliest asst. XC/track coach was 18 or older (adult age, and usually past HS, although we had college kids come back and help).