The Politicization of Letsrun

rojo wrote:

It used to be because that pop culture was designed to bring us together. There were only a few tv networks, etc so people designed something that would broadly appeal. Same thing with the news networks.

The era of monoculture is over, and it has been since around the time that social media really took off. I really do blame this one the internet being more easily accessible to people. When things are accessible they get watered down.

Everything and Everyone is part of a 'subculture' now, so at this point there really is no subculture. Take a look at running, for example. Letsrun used to be a place of a genuine subculture, it still somewhat is but not in the same way. but, Everyone and their grandmother knows about letsrun, the journos complain about it, and people come here from all sorts of places not intending to stay (ie they are Tourists). I think in part it's due to the fact that many cool runners who know what they are talking about (ie - me) go on Letsrun, so when they tell other people they come here hoping to be cool and to learn how to talk about running. But they never get cool, though they might learn what they are talking about, they end up watering down the boards. This board is now full of people imitating people who would go on LR (except for Jamin, Malmo, Wejo, etc...)

Citius Magazine stands on the other end of the shore - they want to have a running subculture but these people wouldn't know a subculture if it hit them in the back of the head, their idea of punk is subculture is a list of things to wear and bands to listen to. Their idea of internet culture is 'memes' and and buzzfeed list-icles. Their idea of anything is more imitation than it is being or doing. The thing is they are good at what they do, and they already have changed what running is, what being a runner is, for a lot of people. As I said a while ago, these people have a very specific idea of what running is and they want you to conform to it. They aren't evil, but the aren't our friends either, they are our enemies - we don't want to destroy them, but Letsrun would be a better place if they didn't exist. Heck, if Citius closed down tomorrow we'd probably want some of them producing podcasts or articles for LR.

Part of the reason that 4chan has become much more 'cool' or 'fashionable' over the past year or so is because it was one of the last bastions of a real underground/subculture. You couldn't just play the part, you actually had to be a part of it to be accepted. If you said something dumb or 'reddit' you'd be called out almost immediately. It has become a victim of itself and being a part of /mu/ is now no more than listening to a list of albums complied by autistic 14 year olds in 2015 - again, it's people imitating people who used to actually be a part of the culture.

It's said that imitation is the highest form of flattery - that's boldfaced lie. That is the way that a stereotype of a middle school girl think the world works - if I like things that this boy likes he will like me. The highest form of flattery is to recognize the value, skill, or artistry/artisanship in something that you know you cannot fully appreciate. I wouldn't try to flatter a punk musician by dressing like one, but I might say that they are an excellent musician, but I might not find myself listening to their music very often.

rojo wrote:

But now that the idiot Trump is gone, I'm hoping they are going to have a harder time shutting down all dissenting views or at least I hope but I'm not positive that will be the case.

[quote]rojo wrote:

People nowadays aren't even used to see the 'other side' of the argument. So when they read an argument here they aren't used to, they are triggered.

/quote]

LOLOLOLOL.....this is rich coming from the guy who just banned me ...twice....for simply posting a NY Times article that he disagreed with.

I mean .....seriously.

Letsrun deletes the other side of the argument so compulsively that it comes across as a conservative-leaning Trump site when in fact barely 20% of the users support Trump.

rojo wrote:

But now that the idiot Trump is gone, I'm hoping they are going to have a harder time shutting down all dissenting views or at least I hope but I'm not positive that will be the case.

rojo wrote:

People nowadays aren't even used to see the 'other side' of the argument. So when they read an argument here they aren't used to, they are triggered.

LOLOLOLOL.....this is rich coming from the guy who just banned me ...twice....for simply posting a NY Times article that he disagreed with.

I mean .....seriously.

Letsrun deletes the other side of the argument so compulsively that it comes across as a conservative-leaning Trump site when in fact barely 20% of the users support Trump.

*fixed quoting

King Gizzard wrote:

I am sure this has been said before, but this website is utterly exhausting. Every thread is a political take (see Strava and Saucony threads). Is it just a handful of people that spend there day spamming this website with political threads or is there that many people that feel the need to use this website as their political outlet? Is this just a pandemic thing or is this the new normal here?

New normal? It's been like this for 20 years. The Johnson family has political ties to the upper end of the GOP. An un-named former world class steeple runner/half marathoner that posts here is incredibly knowledgeable and generous with advice but, how would I say this... I wouldn't be surprised if this person was the Q of Q-Anon.

Like the rest of us that were here daily in 2000 and now come a couple of times/year you're probably just aging out of the BS.

The difference is that it has gone from like 10% of the posts to 90%. Rojo blames society and that is partially true. But a good chunk of it is the culture they have chosen to foster here over the years. Get rid of the garbage and the number of ads they serve would plummet. Short term supporting these is stuff is great. Long term it is likely to kill the board as this stuff squeeze out the running content.

And Trump & Covid has definitely brought out the crazies. Maybe it is some mass hysteria that will pass. Maybe people are just this nuts.

As a tourist I gotta say this place looks like a total craphole. How the hell does a running forum have 50% of its front page threads be about American politics and Trump? Embarrassing.

I can only assume at some point it was good since it got famous.

Another poster mentioned 4chan, ironically another website that used to be great and has gone to crap. Though to be fair that happend way back before it got politicised (at least since moot sold it).

seattle prattle wrote:

rojo wrote:

I find politics interesting. I have no problem starting an occasional thread on an important topic of the day as to me it's fun to debate. I 've always thought of the forum as a place where people posts things they would talk about on a long run with their teammates.

But what I think is absurd is I can't even use an app like Strava any more without making some sort of political statement.

I hope you see that by starting a discussion on this on YOUR website, you are doing exactly the same thing.

Quoted for emphasis

I was a bit disturbed by how quickly any discussion of third parties was deleted leading up to the last election. That's okay tho, their site, their rules, their hypocrisy.

Amazing post. Please email me. I'd love to know who you are. Isaw where you are postin g from and wonder if we know each other -

Shurk JAmp! wrote:

rojo wrote:

But now that the idiot Trump is gone, I'm hoping they are going to have a harder time shutting down all dissenting views or at least I hope but I'm not positive that will be the case.

rojo wrote:

People nowadays aren't even used to see the 'other side' of the argument. So when they read an argument here they aren't used to, they are triggered.

LOLOLOLOL.....this is rich coming from the guy who just banned me ...twice....for simply posting a NY Times article that he disagreed with.

I mean .....seriously.

Letsrun deletes the other side of the argument so compulsively that it comes across as a conservative-leaning Trump site when in fact barely 20% of the users support Trump.

*fixed quoting

I did no such thing. Please email and I'll look into it.

They're a private company, and they can do what they want. For all those complaining about the moderation in this thread, you can go create your own forum if you'd like.

1000 times yes. And Rojo will deny it of course. I was banned for a few days for the first time ever for I can't even imagine what. I also posted a long and I thought fairly thoughtful "open letter" on why I wouldn't pay to join the monthly letsrun club (whatever it's called) because, though I can stomach indirectly supporting the site through traffic and occasionally useful (I hope) comments on running-related threads, I can't stomach supporting such a blatantly-biased site in terms of how it's moderated. And, yes, the blatant bias is right wing to those nuts who think it isn't true. More specifically, including in my open letter that was deleted, I have called on Rojo repeatedly to go dig into the data on how the site is moderated with several specific suggestions on how that could be done. It would answer his weak denials, or maybe it would actually prove him right that there's no such bias (which is laughably unlikely but I'll keep an open mind). And, literally the first time I mentioned it, Rojo responded with "I would love to see that data!" Yet crickets since then, and my every further mention has been deleted. I can only surmise that Rojo is like every Trump supporter who he claims to loathe: lazy and not interested in facts. Sorry, Rojo, but what you have you done that suggests otherwise? You run this site in a haphazard, unprofessional fashion and despite that, and good for you guys, it has done well enough for it to provide a living. But you could do so much better, sigh!

rojo wrote:

Shurk JAmp! wrote:

LOLOLOLOL.....this is rich coming from the guy who just banned me ...twice....for simply posting a NY Times article that he disagreed with.

I mean .....seriously.

Letsrun deletes the other side of the argument so compulsively that it comes across as a conservative-leaning Trump site when in fact barely 20% of the users support Trump.

*fixed quoting

I did no such thing. Please email and I'll look into it.

robert@letsrun.com

This site shows the same acute division and polarization that has occurred in the US over the last 4 years - and the last year in particular. It has been driven by Trump and the right, and a number from their midst have come here to make their last stand. The Confederacy has had a leader in the White House over the last 4 years, and while he has gone his supporters remain, clinging to their 2021 version of "the lost cause" . That grievance - which is mostly white grievance - has also embraced every kind of conspiracy theory, so this board has seen a similar attack on fact, science and reason as we saw with the hordes at the Capitol. It may quieten with the head of their mob being removed 'Twitterless' to Mar-a-Lago but it won't be going away any time soon.

Armstronglivs wrote:

This site shows the same acute division and polarization that has occurred in the US over the last 4 years - and the last year in particular. It has been driven by Trump and the right, and a number from their midst have come here to make their last stand. The Confederacy has had a leader in the White House over the last 4 years, and while he has gone his supporters remain, clinging to their 2021 version of "the lost cause" . That grievance - which is mostly white grievance - has also embraced every kind of conspiracy theory, so this board has seen a similar attack on fact, science and reason as we saw with the hordes at the Capitol. It may quieten with the head of their mob being removed 'Twitterless' to Mar-a-Lago but it won't be going away any time soon.

Why you even come to this site is a mystery to many, who have voiced it already.

You come in here insulting people left and right, you hardly talk about running, and yet you have chosen a running website to voice your dislike of people with a certain political view.

But like Uncle Pervy said, it's people like him, people like myself, who miss the old days of the forum.

Despite all the trolling, this was a real running forum.

Now the brojos have chosen to give it a different direction and welcome contributors like this one I have quoted, who don't run, don't coach, never ran, never coached, don't talk about running.

Rojo, you have said many times that you want this forum to be a place where people could talk about stuff they would talk about during a long run.

Fair enough. I had to swallow my complaints a couple of times because, fair enough, one talks about politics, current events, etc. with team mates during a long run.

The problem here is how disproportionate things are.

We don't spend more than half of our long runs, week in, week out, talking about politics, covid, racial issues, etc.

These are all valid subjects but at the end of the day it is running that brings us together for the long run and in these message boards.

I offer no solution because it is your website and you do with it what you want.

And it still has some great threads on running.

I just wish things would be different.

I just wish I would be happy to wear a Letsrun singlet today like I definitely would have, 19 years ago, when I found this place.

King Gizzard wrote:

I am sure this has been said before, but this website is utterly exhausting. Every thread is a political take (see Strava and Saucony threads). Is it just a handful of people that spend there day spamming this website with political threads or is there that many people that feel the need to use this website as their political outlet? Is this just a pandemic thing or is this the new normal here?

I mean, I'm definitely not one of those let's leave politics out of sports people because that take is steeped in privilege & there is a lot of intersection between the two.

I think the bigger issue is that LRC enables, facilitates, fosters, breeds, etc., these kinds of posts & posters. The brojos won't admit it or take any responsibility but this place is a safe space for running's alt right. Those two threads are both insecurities from conservatives about common sense stances in the 21st century. Those companies are light years ahead of LRC. Instead of pointing that out, the founders of the website go to those posts & stoke the fire. Rojo found his one mixed race friend on the Strava thread who wanted to both sides largely peaceful protests and a domestic terrorist attack on our Capitol. I think this also represents a huge shift in the conservative party. The devil has tricked them to care more about black folks protesting than an attack on our Capitol building, something real conservatives should be up in arms about -- but they were the ones who took arms & stormed it in the first place.

I have said it time & time again, LRC needs some real bias training. They need staff members who are equipped to shut down racism & sexism so that behavior is made clear that it has no place on here. But they're fine with the clicks & claim ignorance & we have to deal with it ourselves.

I know this wasn't your point, OP, but I'm sick of the brojos claiming ignorance but chiming in on controversial threads in the worst ways, thus forcing the issue & keeping the chaos going.

rojo wrote:

I think it's sad that society has become that way. Everything now is political.

YOU think it's sad?

You are the biggest proponent on this site pushing political views and looking for reactions posting under one name or another.

And one of your main moderators does the same thing.

You are attacking Armstrong ... for not discussing running while you type not using your registered handle. It is possible Armstrong ... has another handle for his 5K/10K/1/2/Marathon performances.

I am not attacking him. I am pointing out facts that support my view that the message boards are even frequented by people who somehow gravitated towards a running forum but do not talk about running.

As for the handle thing, he has said more than once that he only uses that registered handle. If that is true or not, only he knows.

I have been banned a couple of times while using my registered handle so I don't want to use it here in case that triggers the "banner". ;)

King Gizzard wrote:

I am sure this has been said before, but this website is utterly exhausting. Every thread is a political take (see Strava and Saucony threads). Is it just a handful of people that spend there day spamming this website with political threads or is there that many people that feel the need to use this website as their political outlet? Is this just a pandemic thing or is this the new normal here?

I don't see it as a bad thing. If you don't like a political thread, don't read it.