JIM RYUNS STORY!!!! 5:30 MILE TO 4:10 MILE

It is a great thread when looking at the accomplishments and competitive spirit of the "greats".

What we also see is that even the "greats" are human and subject to down performances. For example, Keino was spectacular at Mexico, but on other occasions was readily handled. Snell was fabulous at Tokyo - untouchable really - yet, one year later, he was vulnerable. Ryun was sailing in 1966 and 1967, but in 1968 he was not in prime shape.

These are the ups and downs that all athletes are subject to. The difference is, when these guys were up, they were on the very top of the mountain. Best in the world - that's a spot that only the rarest breed of man can reach even for a moment.

Great Words!

Once81 wrote:

Keino was truly an all-time great runner, who ran one of the greatest efforts ever at Mexico, but he was not the miler that Ryun was.

Kip Keino was a 4 time Olympic Medalist, twice in the 1500 meters, and smashed Herb Elliott's record at the 7500 foot altitude of Mexico City.

Ryun could not hold a candle to Kip Keino.

He was fast, but he was not a good competitor when the competition was tough. He has zero championship medals. He could run well in obscure meets in Bakersfield, Modesto, or Kansas, or when the pace started out slowly, but he was afraid of the pace being fast from the start.

His best race might have been the one against Snell where he ran 3:55 in San Diego, but even that one was a relatively slow pace from the start. The 3/4 time was only 3 minutes and 2 seconds.

But put Ryun in with someone who ran fast all the way, i.e. as Kip Keino did in Mexico City and, whether physically or mentally, he couldn't keep up.

wrong

Perry, what planet do you live on? Zero championship medals?!? I believe he won the AAU Nationals 4 years in a row. That was a pretty big deal back in the 1960's. Plus he has a silver medal from Mexico City. You've got to remember back in the 1960's there were no World Championships.

One other note to Living, in 1965 Jim Ryun was coached by J.D. Edmiston, not Bob Timmons.

Perry Mason wrote:He has zero championship medals.

Gosh it must be hard to go through life and be so stupid.

Trolls need food. You guys are feeding one.

Note to Jayhawk:

On the first page of this thread, I posted that Timmons "didn't even coach Ryun in Ryun's senior year. The assistant coach, J.D. Edmiston, was Ryun's coach."

But you're right that Timmons wasn't coaching Ryun during Ryun's matchup with Snell. The matchup doesn't say anything about whether Timmons was better than Lydiard.

Bob Timmons was a better coach than Lydiard, because he trained Ryun to run much faster than Snell ever did.

Snell was a better runner than Ryun, because of his 3 Olympic Gold Medals, and Ryun doesn't have any.

It's important to remember that Lydiard got his runners from all of New Zealand.

Bob Timmons' runners came from one high school in Kansas.

Perry Mason wrote:

It's important to remember that Lydiard got his runners from all of New Zealand.

Bob Timmons' runners came from one high school in Kansas.

Give it up Squires ; )

Once81 wrote:

The only runners I've see approaching his talent level are El-G and Steve Cram--who I think was the best miler of the great Brits. What is interesting is that all three were actually very similar. They were very fast at the end of races, but they weren't burst runners. As Drew pointed out about his Dad, they all were wind it up long, fast kickers.

One other observation on Ryun. I actually think the most incredible race he ran was the win at the AAU meet versus Snell as an High Schooler.

Good points. Cram was similar to Ryun as a quick developer, fast times at a young age, but went farther in terms of times/records. El G is similar, but I don't have an idea of his true 800 potential, I'm sorry he didn't really run that distance at the international level. I wouldn't be surprised if El G were a 1:42 man like Cram - and I think Ryun had potential to run that fast 40 years ago (negative splits in his 880 record, an hour after a 1:50 heat - 53.3/51.6,yikes!). Of course, none of these three could run the mile like Keino, ask Squires-er, Perry Mason. Yeah, all three had that wind-up speed, but Ryun seemed to be able to instantly change from a fast pace to a sprint, which he doesn't get credit for. That's different from being a 'from the line' sprinter. You can watch Ryun race Keino in London in 1967 at Youtube:

I hear Perry Mason-Squires tried to have it pulled : 0

Perry Mason wrote:

It's important to remember that Lydiard got his runners from all of New Zealand.

Bob Timmons' runners came from one high school in Kansas.

Arthur's guys were all from his neighborhood in Auckland. They weren't from all over New Zealand.

Living... I will share a story about J.D. with you that happened when I was making my documentary about Jim. We were in the middle of putting the thing together when I realised that without J.D. the documentary (We had Timmie, Grelle, Snell etc;) especially his race in San Diego against Snell would be incomplete. So one of my photographers and I made the trip to Wichita to talk to J.D. He was a great guy. We do the interview and finish and J.D. breaks down and starts to cry. He told me no one had ever come to him to ask him about his role in Jim's successful senior year. It almost made me cry. Here was this old man, retired and not in the best of health. The trip to Wichita was worth making this man happy.

J.D. was a very successful high school coach in his own right. He coached a great hurdler, Marcus Walker, a great distance runner Randy Smith and a couple of great vaulters, Steve and Tim Riley.

Thanks for posting the vid. I can see why Squires would hate it - hah! Ryun was built for middle distance running. Short trunk, long legs, etc. He's actually built like a tall... Kenyan. But with more leg speed.

Just to reinforce HRE. Arthur's guys were from one neibourhood. Halbergs home was literally metres from Arthur's.

At one time most of "Arthurs Boys" ran for one club. Lynndale. Later when Arthur went to Owairaka the majority ran for those 2 clubs. Both clubs serve the same neighbourhood.

How do I know : I ran for Lynndale !!

Kim Stevenson wrote:

Just to reinforce HRE. Arthur's guys were from one neibourhood. Halbergs home was literally metres from Arthur's.

At one time most of "Arthurs Boys" ran for one club. Lynndale. Later when Arthur went to Owairaka the majority ran for those 2 clubs. Both clubs serve the same neighbourhood.

How do I know : I ran for Lynndale !!

Think about this. It shows you how lazy and unconfident Westerners are today. Think about it. How much talent is really out there?

That is a great story, Jayhawk. I'm glad to know that you gave J.D. some of the recognition that he deserved. From reading the Jim Ryun biography back in 1969, I recall the photo of a gentle man who was already in middle age. The author, Cordner Nelson, didn't really do him justice. It was as if J.D. was regarded as a substitute for Timmons until Ryun could be reunited with Timmons in college. But it appears that J.D. was a first-rate coach, and only his gentle demeanor kept him from advancing to the big leagues.