Why is nobody talking about the absolute HIT JOB on this burrito food truck Shelby & Co putting out there. Absolutely destroying their reputation. I think they should sue shelby for slandering them w/ saying they gave her a pork burrito despite ordering carne asada. This food truck is the real loser in all of this
rojo wrote:
As a track fan, you basically have two option. you can believe.
1) Either Houlihan is lying, and today is a victory for clean sport.
2)She's innocent her case exposes fissures in an anti-doping system in need of overhaul.
Or it could be:
- she's lying about/embellishing at least some items (whether innocent or not) in order to make the appeal stick (and Jerry is too btw),
- it makes no difference at all in the grand scheme of things to the sport being clean or otherwise,
- the system needs overhaul but less in terms of the recommended procedures and more so in terms of the people implementing them and the use of reliable witnesses
Every time (or almost) an American is found to be doping there are excuses and explanations. This is depressingly common. Let’s look at the AR in the 5k, she didn’t wear super spikes, and without a crowd to create an atmosphere she could run that?
The warning flags have been going off for a while. I doubt many athletic fans will be surprised at this news
Barry Badrinath wrote:
The answer is #1, Bob. Rojo, you're buying this Nike PR crap hook, line, and sinker. Multiple people would have reviewed the test results. If there was any reasonable doubt, Nike has more than enough influence to get the test thrown out.
Exactly. LRC are just fools. Jonathan Gault's argument rests on ad hominem attacks not reviews of many experts siding on side of caution. Even CAS, a bleeding heart liberal outfit has said that she's dirty.
Jerry should be banned. His entire outfit is likely dirty.
trackgirlnut wrote:
I believe if we had life time bans, there would be more incentive not to cheat.
Good post. I would extend the bans to the athlete's coaches and managers as well and the entire training group should be thoroughly investigated if one of them is caught doping. The doping athlete's sponsors should be also made to pay a huge damaging fine.
If multiple athletes from a nation are caught doping then that nation should be banned from all international competition for 2 Olympic cycles. How on earth Kenya, with its increasing pile of doping positives, is still allowed to compete in a sport which claims to be serious about tackling doping is completely beyond me.
The system at the moment is simply stacked way in favour of the dopers, there is basically no punishment for doping and antidoping is practically toothless to fight against it. Every time antidoping busts an athlete they have to wade through an entire barrage of excuses and lawyer suits before any sanction can be even made. Armstrong fully admitted to years of high level doping and lying and he is still a free and very wealthy guy. He would never have so much money if he never doped and the way he was treated is basically an advert saying that doping pays big time in professional sports. Rampant doping in professional sports will always continue under such a system.
Thank you Gault and Lets Run for providing an informative article and the means for anonymous discussion. So many with knowledge do not want to get involved if it is linked to them. This has been a good discussion.
The article informed me:
Shelby didn't order a pork burrito
Her levels were 8 times Lawson's
Her lawyer was talking about how quickly oral steroid should clear.
What I learned from discussion:
Large quantities of Boar's meat need to be ingested for a positive test
Boar's meat (uncastrated pig) is rarely served in the US and has a distinctive/unpleasant taste.
Nike with all their resources didn't follow the Lawson case and identify possible suppliers.
I don't agree with a whole nation being banned, but one very positive step would be to retrospectively strip athletes of their medals and records. A convicted doper should not hold two American records after being caught.
Dude, I know this is a field day for clickbait chasers like your outfit but she's banned. It's over. Appeal denied. The cow is out of the barn. Same as with the shoes being allowed for competition, regardless of effect. Time to move on.
rojo wrote:
So you only listen to media that you 100% agree with. I think that's a big problem. I purposely subscribe to the NY Times and Rush Limbaugh at the same time so I can get both sides. I don't want to be siloes.
Nice. Reading a left wing newspaper and a right wing, say, commentator gives you "both sides".
At least read NY Times and Foxnews.
But that explains why you (and Gault for that matter) think there is about an equal chance of the convicted drug cheat who lost her appeal is dirty or clean. After all, it's just the lab + AIU + CAS + the experts vs. the cheat + her lawyer + her coaches with her crazy story about a 10 oz. uncastrated pork contamination of her beef in Oregon.
*that she didn't even order.
Its not one stretch we have to make to believe her, its about 5 huge stretches as opposed to the actual science of a limit double the amount allowed. BTC calling it "trace" is entirely misleading.
rojo wrote:
Yes, I would act differently on the NOP. That's true.But it wouldn't be unbridled speculation.
Why? There's at least 12 different facts associated with Salazar that I I don't have with Schumacher.
1) Salazar was part of Atheltics west where there was known steroid use.
2)Salazar admitted he used steroids himself.
3) I had guys calling me unsolicited when Rupp was in college saying weird [removed] was going down, with Rupp getting shots in hotel rooms.
4) I had his massage therapist calling me saying they saw weird [removed] in the apartment.
5) I've got a picture of a nike lab report saying Rupp was on testerone in HS.
6) I know for a fact his coach has steroids in his bag and gives Rupp massages even though they have a masseuse on staff.
7) Also Slaney was popped.
8) I know Salazar violated the rules on Lcarinitine.
9) I know Salazar repeatedly violated US prescription med rules.
10) I know Salazar sent drugs across the world in hallowed out books.
11) I know Salazar loved Dr. Brown. Jerry - who initially was a co-coach with Salazar -on the other hand thought it was weird and stopped sending his guys there.
12) And last but not least I have the assistant coach in the group calling me up saying he's got grave concerns.
So stop the [removed] about unbridled speculation.
Despite those 12 facts, I have REPEATEDLY said on the podcast that the Salazar ban wasn't satisfying for me.
Just saw this now - firstly, very pleased rojo responded to me (granted i don't post frequently but an honor nonetheless :joy:)
As for the crux of your response, I get your point(s). Certainly suspicion against NOP is warranted, to say the least. But none of those athletes were caught and or sanctioned for what you want to insinuate. OTOH, here's a case where a BTC athlete is officially "popped" and you're treating this with the kid gloves...
FWIW, I really like LetsRun, the Brojos, AND the message board. Despite vocal opinions of some that keep calling this place a "cesspool," I think LR and everything that comes with it does a lot of general good for keeping fans of professional running/T&F/athletics connected. To be clear, the "journalism" jab on my part was 100% directed towards the extremely clear bias against NOP when everything else seems to be reasonably objective.
PS ironically i couldn't post this the first time around because you (Rojo) chose to type the s-word in your post, which I'm quoting in response...
Most top athletes are doping is a fact, but they can get away with it for multiple reasons.
Here and there someone will pay the price of this corrupt system.
Legalize doping period.
I mean we even have XY competing against XX.
We must accept that dopers will always win, not just because you can test negative but because you can buy the system. Remember a guy named Armstrong?
rojo wrote:
Rainy Day wrote:
With that said, LRC is not claiming #2 as fact, but as their opinion. Posters jumping all over the creators of this site that nobody is forcing them to visit. They are allowed their opinion like all of us, and you can take it or leave it. Yes, maybe a little biased, but aren’t we all? I appreciate the opposing points of view, but I’m sticking with guilty until there is more evidence to clear Houlihan.
This is Jonathan's piece. It's not an LRC piece.
Hands down, this is the single most ignorant comment ever written on these boards.
He works for you. It was on your site.
god damn, that's dumb.
it's kind of funny that some of the camp goes with 'never even heard of this steroid' then shelby and the lawyer go with 'well, even if you did take this drug, it's not performance enhancing because X, Y, Z'
I wonder what the actual arguments for this claim were by SH's side:
"The Athlete asserted that the laboratory’s A-Sample AAF was wrongly confirmed by an improper B-Sample confirmation process that failed to follow the mandates of the Technical Documents governing the analysis and reporting of the 19NA as she had alleged an ingestion of pig offal and thus by her assertion, the laboratory should have carried out additional testing. Therefore, the AIU had no basis to bring a Notice of Charge against her"
With the discussion around Shelby and nandrolone, it is worth noting David Kiptoo Kirui was banned for nandrolone during in competition testing while competing in Mexico, the home of authentic Mexican food. Anyone have the details on his levels? Hopefully we can get a full write up on this tragedy as well.
hehehehe wrote:
rojo wrote:
This is Jonathan's piece. It's not an LRC piece.
Hands down, this is the single most ignorant comment ever written on these boards.
He works for you. It was on your site.
god damn, that's dumb.
It is correctly labelled as a "JG Column" on the site instead of the usual "LRC". Not blindingly obvious but it is there. I don't think I would have noticed if I hadn't read the threads.
Agreed. This was absolutely atrocious! And why would you lead by comparing Houlihan’s case to Ajee Wilson’s and Jarrion Lawson’s case. Their cases involved altogether different substances and they provided evidence that completely vindicated them? Has Houlihan done the same?
If not, why did “Lets Run” feel compelled to bring their names into this? Shameful!!!
Interesting take from Victor Conte after a baseball player got busted for nandrolone:
According to Gordon, Conte said nandrolone "has the unfortunate combination of staying in a person's system for an excessively long time and being detectable at what's called 'ultratrace' rates." According to Conte, just a single use will remain in a person's system for at least six months and as long as 18 months.
In other words, if an athlete is going to cheat in a sport with banned drug, nandrolone is a terrible one to do so with because it will almost certainly lead to a failed drug test.
Conte went on to say athletes often test positive for nandrolone even if they aren't knowingly taking it because they are using other tainted performance-enhancing drugs.
"Conte said nandrolone is often detected when an athlete is taking another banned substance — likely testosterone — that was manufactured in an illicit laboratory that doesn't adhere to strict quality standards and also makes drugs for bodybuilders, who, of course, aren't subject to drug testing (the specifics of Marte's positive test are unknown). Because nandrolone can be detected in such low quantities, cross contamination from using the same equipment to manufacture other substances can happen."
Conte said glassware used to manufacture testosterone had a strict cleaning protocol requiring nitric and perchloric acids and "illicit labs that manufacture testosterone often don't adhere to such rigid standards." Because of this, Conte said, any athlete using drugs from "an underground lab" was running the risk of testing positive for nandrolone.
As Gordon noted, we don't know the details behind Marte's failed drug test, and it is possible we will never know. But nandrolone is a drug that even cheating athletes typically try to avoid.
CTC blue wrote:
hehehehe wrote:
Hands down, this is the single most ignorant comment ever written on these boards.
He works for you. It was on your site.
god damn, that's dumb.
It is correctly labelled as a "JG Column" on the site instead of the usual "LRC". Not blindingly obvious but it is there. I don't think I would have noticed if I hadn't read the threads.
Sorry, he's an LRC employee, it's on this site. Case closed.
Barry Badrinath wrote:
The answer is #1, Bob. Rojo, you're buying this Nike PR crap hook, line, and sinker. Multiple people would have reviewed the test results. If there was any reasonable doubt, Nike has more than enough influence to get the test thrown out.
This.....
I cannot believe the naivete of so many.