50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

That tidy article speaks volumes. Hats off to Mr. Tulloh for a concise yet informative piece on training.

The Lions, ah yes..... this keeps it interesting.

Hope the Brewers can keep their wheels on.

Thanks, lucKY2b, it was a lonely birthday, though. I get to race my daughter tomorrow over 5k xc. I hope we both have good days -- a PR for her and a solid time for me would make me very happy. ;-)

Tulloh’s article is excellent, I appreciate it. I’m fortunate to have a nice soft clay track available to me that is mostly abandoned. It’s an old Imperial track, so 4 laps is a mile. I like that.

In Portland for Concordia Classic. We have the full varsity boys team here; they're young but excited to have the opportunity to compete in a big race. The girls team has made a splash here in the past, but not fielding a full team this time. I'm planning to do the open race Saturday morning. The course is kind of funky, 3X 1 mile loop through a relatively small community park.

Last week was 5 week out from the ING. Sniffling nose from all the volume and feeling generally run down. Ahh the joys of marathon training. Started to feel much stronger later in the week as I backed off the intensity some till Sunday's fartlek session. Going for a longish tempo effort this following week Sunday 16th or Monday. Can't decide if I want to go faster shorter 15K speed for 10 miles or so, or.... 16 @ MP. Down to rolling again in the Nike Lunar Racer+ as in past marathons, looked at the Zoom Streak III and decided I need more cushioning for the streets of NY. Got my Sub-Seed number and after next week, pretty much the hay is in the barn.

Not as if you need an endorsement, but... The Lunar racer's served me well at chicago and 2 other marathon's.

Best wishes with the taper.

Long may you run, Bushman.

Have fun AK! Two weeks ago, on a slightly different course at the same small park, they had the kids going through the unleashed dog areas and the poor kids got chased by several dogs!

I ran a collegiate meet today - and ran a whole 10 seconds faster than I did all year (I kept running the same stupid time over and over), despite having to fight traffic the whole way there, losing all my race adrenaline on the traffic and getting there a mere 30 minutes before the start. ugh - I'm too old to start running fast(er) without a warmup. The nice thing is....it's over! ;-)

Thanks Bushman! Yep, that Nike Lunar Racer+ is tough to beat for Long Racing. I am a forefoot/midfoot striker, it's hard to find a shoe that meets my requirements as most shoes put all the $$ in the heel section. My shoes show zero wear at the heel. Any other midfoot strikers suggestions on trainers and racers? We need mucho forefoot cushioning and good distance wear.

Hey good luck with your Goodlife Fitness Victoria Marathon, man sounds like an absolutely gorgeous race course.

My experience with orthotics: Had both hard and soft orthotics, ultimately they gave me a stress fracture in my left tibia, must have been ill fitting. I got out the electric sander and did my own customization. After a long battle, I tossed them aside and decided to strengthen my feet and I never looked back. It's been 30 years since I used them. I also like to run in flats quite a bit, I feel it keeps the lower legs stronger. My 2 cents..... Sorry Bushman I wish it was more positive.

Oops, it's early here, I meant B.C. Victoria runner... sorry

Desert Rat:

How did you strengthen your feet?

I am a midfoot striker and minimalist shoe convert who ditched orthotics and motion control shoes 3 years ago. (Part of my success story with chronic insertional achilles issues) Distance training in Brooks Green Silence now; plan to race NYCM in them in 3 weeks. I find them similar to the more popular Saucony Kinvara with a little less cushion and control. They do have about 7 mm heel to toe drop. I am looking for a another minimalist distance trainer to try after NYCM that is similar but with less drop - any suggestions? I am in my first pair of Green Silence and find the wear to be about average for a running shoe. There is a mesh liner in the upper that has worn through at my second toe in both shoes prematurely; outer layer of upper is fine and this hasn't affect performance or comfort of the shoe. I always wear socks.Using New Balance Minimus Trail for trail running and shorter runs. Really like them for these purposes; I go about 6 miles max on them on roads.

Desert Rat wrote:

Thanks Bushman! Yep, that Nike Lunar Racer+ is tough to beat for Long Racing. I am a forefoot/midfoot striker, it's hard to find a shoe that meets my requirements as most shoes put all the $$ in the heel section. My shoes show zero wear at the heel. Any other midfoot strikers suggestions on trainers and racers? We need mucho forefoot cushioning and good distance wear.

I had some minor setbacks in the 5-9 week before race phase - too much work, too little sleep, too ambitous a training program this over 50 body couldn't keep up with. Fortunately, I recognized the overtraining signs early so backing off mileage/intensity and more road bike cross training has me feeling fresh again ("fresh" being realtive for being in the heart of a marathon training program). Great workouts last two weeks - 20 mile LR with 10 @ MP + 10 secs last Sunday went well and I was well recovered for a mid week hard run. Last big LR tomorrow which is start of my tried and true 3 week taper.Best of luck to Rat and frets and any other fellow ING NYCM runners from this thread! Yup, all the hay is almost in the barn.

Desert Rat wrote:

Last week was 5 week out from the ING. Sniffling nose from all the volume and feeling generally run down. Ahh the joys of marathon training. Started to feel much stronger later in the week as I backed off the intensity some till Sunday's fartlek session. Going for a longish tempo effort this following week Sunday 16th or Monday. Can't decide if I want to go faster shorter 15K speed for 10 miles or so, or.... 16 @ MP. Down to rolling again in the Nike Lunar Racer+ as in past marathons, looked at the Zoom Streak III and decided I need more cushioning for the streets of NY. Got my Sub-Seed number and after next week, pretty much the hay is in the barn.

Desert Rat wrote:

Any other midfoot strikers suggestions on trainers and racers? We need mucho forefoot cushioning and good distance wear.

Like you, am a total forefoot striker with no heel wear...one shoe that I've liked as a fast trainer and possibly good all the way up to the marathon distance is the Spira Stinger at 7.5 oz in a size 9...durability not so great but forefoot protection quite good

Surpassed 97,600 lifetime miles this week (1,709 for 2011 to date) with several hard sessions...hope to "race" a half marathon in 4 weeks time and then get fat and lazy for the remainder of the year

MF

I run doubles at least 4 times a week, it's an evening run done fairly easy 3-4 miles. I run Nike Free's for that run. Not the 3.0 Free's as they don't have enough cushioning for this old body, but just the normal Free Plus or whatever they call em. They help with the pawing action in your feet. Also, place a towel on the floor and curl it up with your toes. Pick up pencils with your toes. Plantar Facial and Morton's Neuroma "take a hike". This all helps keep your lower leg injury's down to nile. Of course what I've found is: If the foundation to your gait is strong, you'll run injury free as most unbalances I've had can travel all the way up from your feet your neck. Hope this helps.

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Week 21

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Greetings from Appalachia (OK, just west of it.)

We're deep into the fall racing season. The Chicago Marathon was last Sunday: not a lot of *really* noteworthy times in the 50+ bunch other than the predictably excellent time of Kathryn Martin: 3:10:27, which age-grades to a 97%. Best male 50+ (both time and age-grade), I believe was 56 yo Dave Walters, who ran a respectable 2:47:52 in warm conditions. In other racing, kudos to MG for her race Friday. How'd your boys do in Portland, AK-53?

For me, I managed 50 miles again this week. Nice to hit over 50 miles two weeks in a row. It has made me a little tired, but I know that I will adapt soon (I better!) My daily mileage was:

Sun: 7.5 (easy)

Mon: 6.5 (easy, legs felt pretty dead)

Tues: 8 (with a bit of Fartlek during the middle 5)

Wed: 7.5 (with 5k tempo run @6:15 pace)

Thurs: 8 (easy, legs felt dead for last 3)

Fri: 5 (easy with strides, legs still felt a little tired)

Sat: 5k (race, very windy, cool, legs had no pop) + 4.5 (easy).

For me, "easy" is anything higher than 7:30 pace and is typically 7:45-7:50 pace (from what I have been reading, I should slow it down more....I'm trying.) The Wednesday tempo was happenstance. I wasn't planning to run hard that day, after the Fartlek Tuesday, but I was just feeling really good, so I ramped it up halfway through the run, and just rolled for 5k. It felt hard but controlled, so I was happy with the effort. The race on Sat. was impromptu and was not my best effort. I hadn't planned on racing, but when our Aunt passed away on Thursday due to cancer related issues, I felt compelled to honor her by racing in the "Race for the Cure" race held here. I wouldn't have tempo'ed so hard on Wednesday had I known I was racing Saturday....so it goes. I knew things weren't going to be fast when I came through the mile slower than I had in several years (5:57) and I never could pick it up from there, finishing in 18:46. I may have had some bug, too; after my cool-down run, I spent the rest of the day with an upset stomach and feeling pretty listless. I'll chalk it down as another hard tempo run...didn't really feel like a race. Hopefully, within a few more weeks, I'll have raced my way back into shape. Next weekend there won't be any racing, though, as we head to Chicago for her funeral.

I think we've got enough topics on the table right now, that I don't feel compelled to start another for the moment, so that's all I got.

Hope you guys running in the NYCM have a good taper now that the hard training is essentially complete. Stay healthy and heal up from all those miles. It'll be an adventure, for sure.

Anyone else have some races or goals to talk about?

I don't have much to share , other than the fact that I started barefoot running today. I've done short striders before , but am going to shed the shoes at least twice a week.

I read " Born To Run " and remained skeptical , but a recent chat with Keith Bateman convinced me that it is worth it.

Another 15 mile week and it seems I have exorcized the demon from my knee. Amazingly, I still have a bit of pes anserine bursitis underlying the knee issue. I had two hard hill climbs and pressed the pace the other 3 days. To avoid night runs I changed my work hours and will be running for lunch. I guess that’s one of the benefits of only running 3 or 4 miles. I’m feeling really good cutting the miles and upping the tempo. Since I’m now a low mileage guy I may as well train for short stuff like the 1500 or 3K. Except for a few races the knee injury has made this year a bust so I’m trying something new. 1979 was the last time I had a true Indoor Track season and I hope to tune up for some indoor races in Arlington Va in Jan. I think that will be exciting.

Greetings to all the veteranos out there. I just want to put in a plug for long uphill runs for those of us who suffer from chronic calf/achilles issues. My "go to" run this summer/fall features a 3-mile uphill section of steady uphill, which I fartlek on the return to work on turnover. I find this solidifies my middle-twitch biomechanics in a fundamental way.

With two months to go on Milepost 55, yesterday I ran a series of 10x400 repeats, a fairly "gutbuster" assessment of my miler/800 base fitness, and came away from a great workout without residual soreness or infirmity. For reps 7-10 I felt relaxed and in full power off both legs in a way I haven't felt for years. In full flight on the slight downhill section I felt invincible and invisible. Henry's "Da Heel" is indeed The Secret!

I know Charlie S has a thing or two to say about this.

Anyway, great fall to all and savor every good mile in those ole legs.