No O'Keeffe in marathon?

Correct. Yared was still in college and had no professional contract or NIL money. A sub couldn't be made at that date because of Japan's pandemic visa rules.

The story about Carlson was just chatter. Nuguse wasn't even one of his top XC runners for the upcoming season and Carlson's resume probably would be better with the line that he coached a college kid to the Olympics than whatever points Yared might get him in the XC season.

Nuguse tore his quad in his final sharpener workout in Tokyo. Team USA would have sent Engels at that point had Engels been able to clear COVID protocol quickly enough, but he wouldn't have been able to, so the decision was made for Nuguse to try to do everything he could to give it a go, and he ultimately couldn't.

Yea, they tried to figure out if they could get Engels there, and they ultimately didn't think he would clear protocols in time.

100%

Not an easy decision, but a decision that has to be made. She and her coach made a selfish and unprofessional decision which disrespected the spirit of competition. The Olympic Games is a sporting event in which athlete's "COMPETE" to the best of their abilities. There's a big difference in being slightly injured or nicked up and "Unable" to compete. She knew she couldn't run before the Olympics, and still decided to take the spot from a healthy competitor.

Selfish, Shameful, and Disgraceful!!!

Tell me, WHERE does it say that you must actually start your race at the Olympics to be an Olympian? Who decided this "rule"? Is it in the USATF bylaws? The USOC charter? Or is it some dumb idea that sports commentators made up?

The only -- the ONLY -- two things that matter are MAKING the team, and your RESULTS in the event. Did you make the team but pull your hamstring practicing starts a week out from the meet and can't run? Congrats, you are still an Olympian. Go to the opening ceremony, get your cool gear, hang out at the Team USA House, high five the alternate after their race. Compete at the games, but pull your hamstring 10m into the 100m and can't finish? Still an Olympian.

Neither athlete records a result, which is too bad, but that's part of the sport: people will get hurt, people will DNF / no-height / get DQ'd for a variety of reasons, but the idea that we are going to lord this made-up status over athletes, when it clearly incentivizes them to make terrible decisions, is stupid beyond belief.

This should be in all caps, bold font at the top of the athlete agreement: "USATF and USOC considers an athlete to be an OLYMPIAN, with all the associated rights and privileges, upon qualifying for the US Olympic Team."

Agreed, and while I don't know if/how this could be done practically since the bonuses are part of a private contract, it should be mandated that any financial incentives tied to being an Olympian are considered to have been earned, and thus must be paid to, anyone who would have run if healthy (i.e., whoever the original three are) plus anyone who does run (i.e., a substitute who gets added and competes). You can write in some obvious carveouts, like anyone who gets DQ'd for doping at the Trials or otherwise removed from the roster for rules violations still forfeits their bonus, but anyone who is named to the team and gets hurt should not be forced into the O'Keeffe situation.

Though it does make me wonder, about this whole "are you or are you not an Olympian" question, if you're there in a team sport but don't get in a game, are you an Olympian? Doesn't this whole issue get to the point of absurdity when you consider various scenarios, like a backup goalie on the winning soccer team who never plays but does get handed a gold medal at the end -- is he an Olympian or not? If not, how did a non-Olympian get a gold medal?!

This 100%. There's a wild illogic to the disease that becomes really hard to escape when you're deep in it. If you're stuck in an ED mindset, you end up doing things that are plainly self-destructive to onlookers, but they won't seem that way to you––you're just doing what you feel you need to do. Lining up for a marathon if you're that badly injured is a prime example of that kind of illogical, disordered thinking. The disease hinges on following rules and compulsions at all costs, and it can drive people to terrible, harmful extremes.

With all that in mind, though I understand peoples' frustration re: the cost of Fiona's decision, I am primarily worried for her, especially since it's possible she's being pushed by coaches who are acting in bad faith. I really hope she takes a break, recovers, and gets to a place where she can make the decisions that are best for her. I have been in this place and I know how lonely and difficult it is, so I would encourage everyone to try to have some empathy and compassion for her!

I don't disagree with this, but a counterpoint: Staying injury free is part of making the team. Staying injury free to make it to the start line of the Olympics is part of becoming an Olympian.

Well, when it comes to DNF, Fiona O'keefe has the best coach in the business.

Oh, for chrissake, you know what I mean.

She supposedly ran the People's Race. anyone look up how she did?

On the other hand, for residents of the United States, it IS our team, so we have a stake and say in who represents us on the international field of competition.

Ok wow, didn't know the additional context about how severe/late the injury was and about the covid protocol making it basically impossible for Craig to sub in. Appreciate people providing the extra info. Unfortunately it looks like that's not the case at all for Fiona, since her injury was known about enough to get Jess out to Paris. I do wonder how much she/her coach would have been telling themselves that she could still run or give it a shot before but the final result seems like something that wouldve been pretty hard to ignore, out the back immediately and barely moving at any kind of relevant pace for a professional. Really sad all around.

So apparently at the Oympics, the gymnastics alternate does not get a medal, though they do at the World Championships. But I would assume the bench players on the basketball team get one, even if they don't play, because they practice and scrimmage together, and so can be considered as contributing to the team effort, etc.

But it seems dumb to pay runners a bonus for making the Olympic Team and then pay them a bonus again for being present at the start line with shoes and a kit on, like they didn't get a free flight, accommodations, and gear as a part of the deal...?

I think we have to re-look at the definition of what it means to be "an Olympian" and strongly disincentivize putting on a kit when you aren't prepared to compete at a high level. I think things will sort themselves out if you negate the financial issue or the "I'm an OLYMPIAN" nonsense.

100%. Even without an MRI showing a stress fracture, Team USA's physios surely could diagnose it with 95% certainty just by moving her leg around to evoke pain.

Fiona O'Keeffe does not look like someone on her first stress fracture, and anyone who has had a stress fracture knows that you can't run a marathon with a stress fracture.

Also, the way she moving looked like it's a pretty advanced stress fracture, meaning she's tried to run on it several times since first noticing pain. I had a pelvic stress fracture once. The progression went like this:

Tuesday: Noticed nagging pain in a cooldown after a hard track workout.

Wednesday: Did a 14 mile medium-long run at my normal easy run pace; pain was present and nagging but did not affect my pace or gait

Thursday: 8 mile morning easy run, still with normal gait and pace. The pain was slightly worse than Wednesday. Evening threshold workout. The pain was very bad in the warmup but I noticed it less while running faster. The cooldown was also very painful.

Friday: Another 14 mile medium long run. The pain was very bad, but my gait felt nearly normal. My pace was affected only slightly.

Saturday: 16 mile easy long run. I felt like I was forcing my gait to be normal and the pain was intense. My long run pace is 30-45 seconds slower per mile than usual.

Sunday: 8 mile 'easy' run. I was noticeably limping and and running much more slowly than usual.

Monday: Made it 5 miles before I had to limp home. I was still less injured than Fiona looked Sunday.

My point is that by Sunday she was clearly nursing an injury that had been worsening progressively and had plenty of time to withdraw. I have no doubt that she has a stress fracture and has been aware of it for a while.

She was trying to get a bib. I'm going to guess that would take a miracle last minute.

Enough is enough!

Our energy needs to be put into Fiona O'Keeffe‘s health (mental, emotional and physical); this is over.

LetsRun needs to lock down this thread and file it away, no more comments; this is over, it’s not at all healthy.

I’ve contributed to this thread and I didn’t agree with her decision to start the race. It’s over and done ✔️. We’ve all had our fair chance to voice our opinions of her decision along with her team in regards to the matter, it’s done and over.

This thread is a negative black hole, where no good is ever going to come of it. Forgiveness and better decisions are needed, not more negativity.

Aside from whatever one thinks of her decision to start the race… I am genuinely concerned about her health. Both her and Natosha have gotten sickly thin. And Amy Cragg herself got super tiny towards the end of her career. Is this something they prize in their training group? It clearly doesn’t work to their advantage if that’s the case. It’s sad to see.

I wanted to see her run but if she k ew she was injured she should have informed team USA to replace her. That was very selfish of her.

We’re allowed to be upset with her for letting down Team USA. The Olympics ain’t time for participation trophies, but apparently Fiona thought it was.