Modifying the Norwegian approach to lower mileage

I do 6 days a week and have still seen lots of success with it. Don't overthink it. Three sub-T workouts, one long run. Replace a recovery jog day with day off. If you are nervous that your CTL will tank because of this, then feel free to tack on 15-20 min to your cool down on those workout days and your long run day. Many people run 6 days a week and do just fine. Again, just shuffle the extra miles around your 6 day window.

KI would smoke sirpoopy in a race. The clue is in KIs surname and the fact he has Henrik to guide him. next question please.

I see we're down to 6 days a week. How many pages before you lazy bums decide that 5 days a week is enough? Laziest thread on this forum. I expect nothing else from the disciples of Sir "too lazy to do strides" Poopy.

He is faster than you, isn't he? :)

Absolutely, it makes a difference if you log in 90min (3x30min) at LT2/Sub CV or 'only' 60min (2x30min)/week. It maximises the amount of time someone can handle at LT2/Sub CV in a microcycle (by having 6-8h of training per week).

I'm sorry, in this thread we're only interested in maximizing our days off.

Wtf is this garbage, imagine thinking that jogging will get you to a 13 min 5k, 😂😂😂. Go do 5x1k repeats rather than be lazy.

Looking for some guidance here on my HR sub treshold controlled programme. Sorry for the wall of text here…

I found this thread in june and converted from a more polarized training regime to this sub threshold. Thanks a lot. Feeling stronger, healthier and have no injuries/niggles.

I now run a three double sub- threshold a week. The rest is easy. Even though it sound much I have not found it taxing at all. I control and reduce impact by running some uphill on a ski slope, use treadmill inclination and run off trail on soft surface in the Forrest.
I run approximately 9,5 hours a week. The easy runs and long run are at 60% off my Max HR.

The morning LT1 sessions is very controlled. I sit around 153-155 in HR and my LT1 maxHR is 158 max. My max HR is 198. All from a lab test one year ago.

My LT2 from the lab sits at 184 HR

And stay with me soon comes my question…. When I do my LT2 sessions. I can do 6x5’ and progress it to 165 HR. I can also do 10x3’ and progress it to 170.

I know this is quite a gap from 184 which is my max LT2HR but I’m doing three doubles a week. Sometimes I think I’m to conservative and sometimes I’m afraid I will overdo it if I speed up. So my question to you insightful people here if you think I’m spot on here or should go a bit higher on the HR in the LT2 sessions? And the easier LT2 sessions where I sit at 165 HR are they giving me anything? I mean that they are close to LT1 but also a bit far from LT2…

At the moment I train for 10k but I will do the half marathon i the future…

And yes I will probably get a lactate meter but in the meantime I need to controll it with HR.

Thanks in advance for replies and for a great thread 🙏

Double threshold doesn’t really have a place in this thread. I’d recommend going back through and reading the thread when you have time. This method focuses on singles only.

Ok my apologies. Even though I’ve read most of the thread I didn’t realize it was strict ”singels only”.

I don’t se my program differs that much from the single approach. Like many people here I do three Sub T sessions per week. The only difference is that I run a few easy runs slightly faster. Everything else is the same.

Another update and some thoughts/questions. After the 10k workout I did a month and a half ago where I finally saw a decent improvement, the humidity returned and I went back to subT work. Dewpoints are finally consistently in the 50s and sometimes 40s here and I'm seeing races pop up left and right. This weekend I did a 5kTT instead of my 3rd subT and did pretty okay I guess.

I started this method around May or so, but in February I see I ran a 5k TT (moderate course, couple of long uphill sections but not terribly steep at any given point). Ran 20:57 (mile splits - 6:35,6:51,6:48, and + 0:42), was 35F out and I was in Z5 pretty much from end of mile 1, Avg HR last mile+ was 178 (Max is a few BPM above 180 these days). Was completely gassed.

Ran the same route this weekend in 65F and ran 20:11 (k splits - 4:02, 4:05, 4:04, 4:05, 3:54). Avg HR last 2k was 168. I hardly reached Z5 during the effort. Felt pretty normal within a minute of finishing.

I think it's pretty clear that I've made some decent aerobic progress using this method. Moving from a 5k at 6:45 pace to 6:30 while dropping my avg HR 10 BPM, even on the last mile+. But comparing the 2 TT's I'm seeing that I was clearly capable of holding my HR up much higher earlier in the year (and I doubt that I've aged out of that capability since February), so it was a bit disappointing in that regard.

I don't feel like I pushed myself into what I used to consider race effort. I suspect there's a bunch of extra headroom available to me during races if I can get used to pushing into that final gear this fall. It's been talked about here that racing often may be an important part of the plan. I can now see the progress from the hot and humid summer months, but I definitely felt rusty.

I've got a 10k race coming up in a couple of weeks and now that the weather's cooler I'd like to swap in that race effort periodically to get that VO2 max stimulus and get back into the mindset of "this is a race, it's supposed to hurt, just push it."

What's the thought on how often to race and what to do in the days leading up to it? I was thinking a 5k or 10k ever 2 or 3 weeks? What's does the week leading up to the race look like? Cut the 2 preceding subTs to 2/3 and 1/2 volume? Keep the volume and reduce the pace of the workout? I imagine it'll take a month or two to figure out how my body responds to a new change in effort but I'm curious what others are doing/have tried.

Been loosely following this approach through the summer, averaging 60-70mpw over 7 days with 3 Q sessions a week as consistently as possible. One thing I've found is without racing or simulating (VO2 work?) it's really hard if not impossible to find that extra gear. That is where I think you either need to race a lot like Ciproc or hit some TTs/VO2 sessions in order to find that hole you can exist in during a race.

Just my thoughts though. Curious to hear what others think.

This is that last 1-5% of the pyramidal training model that seems to work so well; it's been downplayed a bit but I still think it's important. Obviously Jakob isn't the most relevant example to this thread but he still does the hard hill session once a week. Once a week probably isn't required for most of us here, but staying in touch with the high lactate levels without overdoing it is going to help mental focus in a race IMO.

Speaking only for myself, and having missed maybe 2 subT workouts for life stuff in that period(May to October) I can honestly say I'm thrilled with the aerobics improvements. I feel like my base is enormous (comparatively) to when I started (even on similar mileage - 50/week). From a load standpoint, I feel great, and staying in my feet was one of the more appealing points in trying this out.

I've only tried to run "hard" 2 times (including this weekend) since then. I'm already faster so no complaints there. I'm very interested to see what happens as I reacquaint myself with races. If that headroom can be tapped like I was used feeling during races.

I can't recall the last time I felt my legs burn and was sucking air. I don't know that I want to go back to experience that frequently during regular workouts as I'm clearly taking a step or two forward in terms of fitness without burning myself out(really wanted to stay on my feet). That said, after doing 5 months of subT and finally getting to cooler weather I think for me it's time to start mixing in some races again to get used to putting out that effort level.

I'm very interested in this thread, which I just stumbled upon for the first time.

I've read the first 20 pages and the last 5, and I must say I'm impressed with the amount of improvement Sirpoc84 has seen over the past year.

I do have a few questions:

- Would this approach to training also work for marathon training, with a scaled up longrun?
- Does this approach require a big aerobic engine to begin with, or does that not even matter?
- Does having hill sprints, hill repeats and other exercises to promote CV even matter?

- How to scale this up to lets say 10 hours of running per week? (Again, marathon related if possible.)

Hope to be able to pick your minds here :)

(Sorry if I missed similar questions, but this is a LOOOONG thread...)