I also think it’s odd that the right keeps bringing up the lefts “takeover” of our cultural and educational institutions. What did the left do… storm the museums, opera houses and school? No.
Yes they did actually they rioted in the streets and looted business and police stations until they got their way. "DEI" was never popular in democracy but it was forced on us thru violence
You must have been out of the workforce for the last 20 years or so. Or you just like to exaggerate. DEI has been around for many decades in one form or another, and has gained in popularity over the same time. Companies and the media were promoting that stuff long before the BLM riots of 2020. DEI/Woke reached its zenith around the time of the BLM riots and the nutjob moral hysteria "racial reckoning" we had to deal with, but to say the BLM riots were causal on DEI/Woke/etc. is putting the cart before the horse. It's the opposite. The BLM riots/looting were condoned (or even encouraged) by the media and many liberals precisely because DEI/Woke had reached such hysterical levels that people couldn't distinguish right from wrong.
I also think it’s odd that the right keeps bringing up the lefts “takeover” of our cultural and educational institutions. What did the left do… storm the museums, opera houses and school? No.
Yes they did actually they rioted in the streets and looted business and police stations until they got their way. "DEI" was never popular in democracy but it was forced on us thru violence
Can you name a few incidents and their effect that back up this statement? Something like "Liberals massed over 1M people in Wasington DC, so the government was forced to create the woke Smithsonian Museums", but with dates, news articles, etc. Thanks in advance.
Yes they did actually they rioted in the streets and looted business and police stations until they got their way. "DEI" was never popular in democracy but it was forced on us thru violence
The BLM riots/looting were condoned (or even encouraged) by the media and many liberals precisely because DEI/Woke had reached such hysterical levels that people couldn't distinguish right from wrong.
just have to point out a myth of the BLM summer.
The damage was mostly caused by opportunistic rioters and looters. They weren't political - they took advantage of a situation and stole a lot of stuff.
The actual protests were virtually all peaceful and non-crimey.
Sure, there are exceptions and I don't want to trade links.
But the fact is, almost all of the rioting and looting was not really BLM (although it only took place because of the protests, but that is indirect) The rioting and looting were almost all just shoplifters and thieves taking advantage. They were not there for the racial justice. They wanted a free pair of Jordans.
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Agree with so much of what agip's saying, but I agree that the real threat is on the left. The January 6 thing was like a joke, so I have a hard time talking with anyone who clutches their pearls over it. Most of the people who went were exceedingly non-threatening. Had it been a real coup attempt, it would have been squashed like a bug (even faster than it was) because the left controls all the power, imo. I must give the left media it's due, though. for convincing so many that it was an "insurrection" and a real threat.
Agree with so much of what agip's saying, but I agree that the real threat is on the left. The January 6 thing was like a joke, so I have a hard time talking with anyone who clutches their pearls over it. Most of the people who went were exceedingly non-threatening. Had it been a real coup attempt, it would have been squashed like a bug (even faster than it was) because the left controls all the power, imo. I must give the left media it's due, though. for convincing so many that it was an "insurrection" and a real threat.
there was a multi-pronged effort by the republican party to overthrow the election. it wasn't just J6, it was through the courts, DOJ, military, media, states, etc. Just citing J6 as a bonehead protest that got out of hand is disingenous. There was so much more.
The J6 commission spent months showing you the multi-pronged effort but you probably chose to ignore it. Read the wikipedia page. How the coup attempt was wide ranging and multi-pronged should curl your hair and bring you back to this page apologizing.
Agree with so much of what agip's saying, but I agree that the real threat is on the left. The January 6 thing was like a joke, so I have a hard time talking with anyone who clutches their pearls over it. Most of the people who went were exceedingly non-threatening. Had it been a real coup attempt, it would have been squashed like a bug (even faster than it was) because the left controls all the power, imo. I must give the left media it's due, though. for convincing so many that it was an "insurrection" and a real threat.
Well, you need to read the January 6th Report, including the deposition and other testimony transcripts and exhibits. Your perceptions of what occurred are way off. Read that stuff and think more carefully about what happened, who did it, why they did it, what their goals were, and how close they came to succeeding. Coups and insurrections don't have to involve tanks.
A fascinating response by GD. It is filled with vague ideas and fears. It is a series of nonsensical phrases that I assume are intended to sound academic. The only specific thing mentioned is Evergreen State College. I thought it was going to be some compound type takeover story by armed militant liberals, or evil government squashing of military conservatives. I googled it and found nothing. Was this a Tucker Carlson talking point?
This is what happened at Evergreen State College in 2017. Very different from what Tucker told. (For that matter, most of MSM. )
I don't begrudge you at all for believing the things you do. We all have to make determinations - right or wrong. Our experiences, the news we consume, the people we hang with, etc. all affect our biases. So, if I have offended, I apologize. It is not my intent. Exceptionally bright and talented people get things wrong. Could be me. Could be you.
Regarding the Jan6 Commission is a perfect example. You give it at least the benefit of the doubt, if not more. As you correctly assumed, I gave it none. It seemed easy to me to see that it was uber-political. And then you suggested wikipedia for me to learn up on it - that's ironically quite humorous. My stance on most news these days, for better or worse, is that it is better to be uninformed than misinformed, and there is a lot of misinformation out there no matter where you look. We are living in a "post-truth" world.
Regardless, the attempt (if we go with your version) went nowhere because there was not nearly enough power to get it done. Not close. From where I stand, it looks like the left has all the power (which is great in some regards). In terms of where the real threat lies (like you are attempting to ascribe to ascribe to the right), it is actually the left that has so much more power and control (at least federally) that is not being checked in any significant degree by the citizenry, imo.
The BLM riots/looting were condoned (or even encouraged) by the media and many liberals precisely because DEI/Woke had reached such hysterical levels that people couldn't distinguish right from wrong.
just have to point out a myth of the BLM summer.
The damage was mostly caused by opportunistic rioters and looters. They weren't political - they took advantage of a situation and stole a lot of stuff.
Then how come politicians like Kamala Harris raised money to bail them out. These were overtly political riots and groups like Antifa support "direct action"
Agree with so much of what agip's saying, but I agree that the real threat is on the left. The January 6 thing was like a joke, so I have a hard time talking with anyone who clutches their pearls over it. Most of the people who went were exceedingly non-threatening. Had it been a real coup attempt, it would have been squashed like a bug (even faster than it was) because the left controls all the power, imo. I must give the left media it's due, though. for convincing so many that it was an "insurrection" and a real threat.
Well, you need to read the January 6th Report, including the deposition and other testimony transcripts and exhibits. Your perceptions of what occurred are way off. Read that stuff and think more carefully about what happened, who did it, why they did it, what their goals were, and how close they came to succeeding. Coups and insurrections don't have to involve tanks.
My guess is that reading is not a strong point for people who would claim Jan 6 was a joke. So try watching this. Even if it was 99% peaceful, this was a serious and violent event. It was premeditated and condoned by many "news" sources, politicians, and President Trump. Tucker Carlson finding some footage of aimless wanderers in the Capitol does not change that.
Warning: This clip contains footage of violence.Rep. Bennie Thompson, D-Miss., presented new footage of the Capitol insurrection June 9 during the first day ...
Can I just applaud almost everyone on this thread? It’s honestly a great one. One of the most divisive figures in msm is ousted, creating potentially heated back and forth among left and right, and it’s actually been really cordial and respectful. I lean left but love hearing the other side. Thanks for keeping it civil.
Regarding the Jan6 Commission is a perfect example. You give it at least the benefit of the doubt, if not more. As you correctly assumed, I gave it none.
That's why it is suggested that you read the deposition transcripts and documentary exhibits, the majority of which are from Trump advisor's or employees, and even hard-core Trump supporters. Many other transcripts are of testimony of eyeball (percipient) witnesses, including law enforcement, protestors, planners and people at the White House observing the events in the days and hours prior to the Capitol riots.
If you read those materials, you can reach your own conclusions as to what happened on January 6th, why it happened, what it's goals were, and how close it came to achieving those goals. You don't have to rely on (or deliberately ignore) the summary by the January 6th Committee.
Thank you for the slight dig on my intellect. I am sure you are very smart person who can read very well. Congrats.
I am willing to read or watch something from an objective non-biased (or as close as possible) source. PBS (Public Broadcasting Station), imo, is very left of center.
The BLM riots/looting were condoned (or even encouraged) by the media and many liberals precisely because DEI/Woke had reached such hysterical levels that people couldn't distinguish right from wrong.
just have to point out a myth of the BLM summer.
The damage was mostly caused by opportunistic rioters and looters. They weren't political - they took advantage of a situation and stole a lot of stuff.
The actual protests were virtually all peaceful and non-crimey.
Sure, there are exceptions and I don't want to trade links.
But the fact is, the rioting and looting was not really BLM (although it only took place because of the protests, but that is indirect) The rioting and looting were almost all just shoplifters and thieves taking advantage. They were not there for the racial justice. They wanted a free pair of Jordans.
You're setting it up as a tautology, right? "It was all peaceful, except that stuff that wasn't peaceful." "There were no criminals, except the criminals." You could say the exact same thing about the January 6th insurrection. In fact, that's what Trump fans do say about the January 6th insurrection.
Anyway, the point was that the widespread looting and rioting that went on for months was condoned (and even encouraged) by the media, many Democratic politicians and tens of millions of others precisely because it was associated with the BLM movement (which was itself an exaggerated moral panic/hysteria). So while the riots and looting are terrible, and created many thousands of deeply and permanently harmed victims, it's society's reaction to them that was (and still is) even more dangerous.
That's why it is suggested that you read the deposition transcripts and documentary exhibits, the majority of which are from Trump advisor's or employees, and even hard-core Trump supporters. Many other transcripts are of testimony of eyeball (percipient) witnesses, including law enforcement, protestors, planners and people at the White House observing the events in the days and hours prior to the Capitol riots.
If you read those materials, you can reach your own conclusions as to what happened on January 6th, why it happened, what it's goals were, and how close it came to achieving those goals. You don't have to rely on (or deliberately ignore) the summary by the January 6th Committee.
This is a good suggestion. Thanks (seriously). I do admit to being turned off by it all which very likely leads to my own blindspots (but I also think we all are susceptible to them).
Agree with so much of what agip's saying, but I agree that the real threat is on the left. The January 6 thing was like a joke, so I have a hard time talking with anyone who clutches their pearls over it. Most of the people who went were exceedingly non-threatening. Had it been a real coup attempt, it would have been squashed like a bug (even faster than it was) because the left controls all the power, imo. I must give the left media it's due, though. for convincing so many that it was an "insurrection" and a real threat.
Well, you need to read the January 6th Report, including the deposition and other testimony transcripts and exhibits. Your perceptions of what occurred are way off. Read that stuff and think more carefully about what happened, who did it, why they did it, what their goals were, and how close they came to succeeding. Coups and insurrections don't have to involve tanks.
Lol. Complete BlueAnon. They were not close to succeeding, they tried to interrupt a purely symbolic vote. The country has more important things to deal with than January 6, hate all you want but the majority of people have moved on.
I don't begrudge you at all for believing the things you do. We all have to make determinations - right or wrong. Our experiences, the news we consume, the people we hang with, etc. all affect our biases. So, if I have offended, I apologize. It is not my intent. Exceptionally bright and talented people get things wrong. Could be me. Could be you.
Regarding the Jan6 Commission is a perfect example. You give it at least the benefit of the doubt, if not more. As you correctly assumed, I gave it none. It seemed easy to me to see that it was uber-political. And then you suggested wikipedia for me to learn up on it - that's ironically quite humorous. My stance on most news these days, for better or worse, is that it is better to be uninformed than misinformed, and there is a lot of misinformation out there no matter where you look. We are living in a "post-truth" world.
Regardless, the attempt (if we go with your version) went nowhere because there was not nearly enough power to get it done. Not close. From where I stand, it looks like the left has all the power (which is great in some regards). In terms of where the real threat lies (like you are attempting to ascribe to ascribe to the right), it is actually the left that has so much more power and control (at least federally) that is not being checked in any significant degree by the citizenry, imo.
This is how the right wing stays in La La Land. They don't ready anything. They don't read the Mueller report. They don't read the Jan 6th commission report. The right wing and Trump tell them that it is a political witch hunt so they tune out. They ignore it completely. Or worse, they turn to right wing talkers to have everything discredited.
Much of the testimony and evidence in Mueller report came from some of the hardest right wingers. Confessions under oath! They were on Team Trump! Same with Jan 6th. The people that testified actually worked deep inside the Administration! Throughout Trump's 4 years most all the the evidence of wrongdoing came from Trump's own damn people. His Chief of Staff. His DOD. Hell, Trump even confesses some of his crimes on social media. Yet, you talk to a right winger and they both sides it. Or just say it is all false. "Agree to disagree". "the truth is not to be known". "It was all blown out of proportion".
Has there ever been a political leader that has had so many of his own chosen people publicly turn on him after they leave the administration. Are they all liars, deep stated, Soros converted, grooming pedo, Rhinos?
I don't begrudge you at all for believing the things you do. We all have to make determinations - right or wrong. Our experiences, the news we consume, the people we hang with, etc. all affect our biases. So, if I have offended, I apologize. It is not my intent. Exceptionally bright and talented people get things wrong. Could be me. Could be you.
Regarding the Jan6 Commission is a perfect example. You give it at least the benefit of the doubt, if not more. As you correctly assumed, I gave it none. It seemed easy to me to see that it was uber-political. And then you suggested wikipedia for me to learn up on it - that's ironically quite humorous. My stance on most news these days, for better or worse, is that it is better to be uninformed than misinformed, and there is a lot of misinformation out there no matter where you look. We are living in a "post-truth" world.
Regardless, the attempt (if we go with your version) went nowhere because there was not nearly enough power to get it done. Not close. From where I stand, it looks like the left has all the power (which is great in some regards). In terms of where the real threat lies (like you are attempting to ascribe to ascribe to the right), it is actually the left that has so much more power and control (at least federally) that is not being checked in any significant degree by the citizenry, imo.
You openly admit ignorance. You say no big deal because the the insurrection was not close to working. This was a violent volley that weakened the walls of American democracy. The next time will do more damage and eventually it could crumble. Everyone should take it seriously because moving to authoritarianism, whether left or right, will severely restrict ALL our freedoms.
Power move back and forth in DC. Republicans have held Congress & Senate about 2/3 of the time since 2000. That is not the left holding all the power.
Getting news from multiple sources makes bias and lies much more obvious. It is ok to be willfully ignorant, but knowing that, it is best to not offer uninformed opinions. And please don't vote when you know you don't understand the issues at stake.
I was with a friend recently who claims to be a libertarian but is far right. Anyway, he spent 2 hours of a car ride trying to convince me that the left will soon decriminalize pedophelia, and actually encourage it. His arguments in general were very similar to many of the right wing theories stated so far too. Complete parroting of it all. From Jan 6 to education and cultural institutions. When it’s this common of a story, it’s clear there is no independent thought. It’s parroting what you’re hearing somewhere.
Please don’t take offense to that, it’s just very obvious to me. I work in an industry where the people who work for me are not paid to come up with their own ideas. They parrot what I say at meetings. I’m sure the left does it too. It’s not what I do, thought, and I would encourage others not to do it.
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