Best All-Time HS All-Star XC Team by State

Steve Taylor is a slam dunk for WV.

Mike Connelly over Gottesfeld in Pennsylvania...and how about some love for Tom Donnelly from 50 years ago?

Not a Florida expert, but it's hard to leave a 3x Kinney Finalist (Teddy Mitchell) off of a list of all-time great HS XC runners.

I'm from the Northeast, but excluding Tim Moore from the Michigan list seems highly questionable to me.

Tim Moore is the Footlocker National champion in 2001. He beat Chris Solinsky at Footlocker Nationals and at Footlocker Midwest in 2001. Moore finished 2nd to Ritz at Footlocker Midwest in 2000 and then 8th at Nationals.

Performance at the National level is the ultimate proving ground in high school XC, and Tim Moore did it very well. I can't agree with any Michigan list that excludes him.

But looking at other States I'm more familiar with, I see lots of subjective opinions trumping proven performance at XC. Still, this is an interesting thread.

Considering Footlocker, you make a good argument for Tim Moore. I had just been looking at in Michigan XC performance. Not every one of these kids at the top of lists bothered to go to these national competitions, even if they could've competed well, but they all competed in state. Still, you've convinced me about Tim Moore - his resume was being held back by the Ritzenhein factor, who is arguably the greatest US XC runner ever.

Put Tim Moore on the Michigan list, maybe even in the Top 5.

Carl Hatfield from the '60s for Wva

Carl Hatfield from the '60s for Wva

Here's my best evaluation for the state of Vermont:

Boys:

1. Mint Henk

2. Ken Bunnell

3. Kyle Powers

4. Marc Brandmeyer

5. Jeremy Grosvenor

6. Brendan Copley

7. Malcolm Plunkett

Alternates: Sam Nishi, Dage Minors, Dan Ramsey

Girls:

1. Erin Sullivan

2. Tara Chaplin

3. Elle Purrier

4. Hannah Rowe

5. Susan Dunklee

6. Rayna Deniord

7. Autumn Eastman

Alternates: Taylor Spillane, Lauren Bertollini

Disclaimer: As I am human, my views are subjective here. If I made a mistake or you disagree with one of my placements, reply and we shall take it to the boards...

Ohio XC wrote:

It's a hard call sorting out Ohio - if you are looking for the All-Star Team though, I don't see how you leave off Andrew Jordan (14:44 -fastest xc time in Ohio - Fry went 14:49 and Kennedy was 15:19 on the same course. Ran in the 14's 4 times his senior year including 14:59 in Kenosha).

Very tough and I loved to watch him run. I was at Galion when he ran the 14:44 but he only had one outstanding year. You could probably do a separate list for FASTEST ever if you could quantify it. Zishka's younger teammate Clark Haley ran 11:53 over 2.5 miles which was 3rd fastest behind Scharsu and Nicholas. A handful of others have run a blazing fast time one year but didn't dominate over multiple years.

I put my track emphasis on time and xc emphasis on winning. Nicholas is an example of probably the best xc runner who wouldn't be close to making the track top 7.

Comparing times is difficult at best due to wet courses, wind, and other variables. That is why so many people are pointing out track times in this thread, to quantify XC times and efforts. Haley was an outstanding runner and 1600 champ (4:11) in the spring as well, but he ran on the OSU agricultural fields course. I think it was only used once or twice, but was not the OSU golf course the old timers used, the Scioto Downs or National Trails courses used since. Haley's time is an apples to oranges discussion.

I'm revising my list based on my attention being called to Footlocker results. Man, Michigan competed well at the national stage in HS... 4 champs in our Top 5:

1. Dathan Ritzenhein (2 time state champ big school division, XC PR on Michigan course of 14:10, 2x Footlocker champ, head and shoulders above anyone else on this list)

2. Grant Fisher (2 time state champ big school division, 2 time Footlocker champ, Michigan XC PR 14:52)

3. Jason Hartmann (2 time state champ big school division, Footlocker 4th place, PR 14:51)

4. Tim Moore (1 time state champ, 15:06 PR, Footlocker champ)

5. Brian Grosso (1 time state champ, 15:03 PR, Footlocker champ)

6. Maverick Darling (3 time state champ smallish school division, 10th at Footlocker, but big PR 14:53)

7. Mark Smith (3 time state champ medium school division, PR 15:25, ran in late 70s before big national meets were super popular and the state champs were at the fast speedway, in the 1980s and local legend)

What about Dan Wilson? He dominated distance running in CT (cross and track) for 3 years and won an impressive cross state meet followed by second at new England's as a junior. Don't remember why but he didn't ever run FL regionals and he was injured senior year of cross so no result.

But he won a whole bunch of track titles and competed very well nationally too.[/quote]

Dan Wilson was very good. He won State Open and was second at New Englands in 1995. The problem is he didn't run the Footlocker Regional, and so far our list is five Footlocker qualifiers plus two standouts who ran prior to Footlocker/Kinney.

Here is the top 10 at New Englands in 95, and where they then finished at Footlocker NE that year:

1 Vanderhoof (Timberlane, NH) - 6th

2 Wilson (Notre Dame, CT) - DNS

3 Regan (Brookfield, CT) - 44th

4 Nickerson (Bishop Guertin, NH) - 19th

5 John (Rutland, VT) - 10th

6 Letourneau (Londonderry, NH) - 9th

7 Maheu (Xavier, CT) - 17th

8 Eckel (Simsbury, CT) - 73rd

9 Smith (Ponaganset, RI) - DNS

10 Schneck (Concord, NH) - 48th

From:

http://footlockercc.com/northeast/results/Northeast%201995%20results-1.pdf

And:

http://www.green-mountains.com/NewEnglands/Stats_for_2001.pdf

Back then I believe top 8 at FL regionals made the finals, rather than top 10 as it is now. So, Wilson is looking at a best of 7th if you think Vanderhoof would beat him again. Pretty slim qualification margin. But, who knows, Wilson might have gotten Vanderhoof on that day if he ran.

All the guys on the CT list so far were state champions and ran awesome track times, so I don't think Wilson trumps then there. Without him attempting Footlocker, I don't think it would be fair to bump the guys who did run and qualify, unless you want to bump Cotton and O'Keefe since they also didn't run at FL/Kinney.

I'm leaning toward no but honestly don't know Cotton & O'Keefe's careers well enough.

Exactly why you have to put more emphasis on winning.

Old PA list

Pennsylvania

1. Craig Miller

2. Dan Coval

3. Ian Gottesfeld

4. Tony Russell

5. Paul Springer

6. Paul Vandegrift

7. Mike McWilliams

New PA list (in no particular order but this should be the top 7)

1. Craig Miller

2. Dan Coval

3. Ian Gottesfeld

4. Jake Brophy

5. Paul Springer

6. Paul Vandergrift

7. Mike McWilliams

so just put in Brophy for Russell

As I mentioned before Brophy is a 2 time, back to back state XC champ his junior and Senior year, finished 8th as a sophomore and around 30th as a Freshman, holds the course record on the state course which is about 10-15 seconds faster than anyone has ever run on that course, was 8th at Foot Locker Nationals as a Senior and 25th as a Junior. He also placed in the top 5 at foot locker northeast regionals both his Junior and Senior year. He is graduating this spring but definitely deserves to be on this list over Russell, who did well at NXN one year, poorly another year and ran over 20 seconds slower than Brophy's course record when he won his state titles. Russell also won NXN Northeast his junior and senior year (or whatever region PA is in), which is generally a weaker individual field than Foot Locker.

Steve Lacy

John Easker

Keith Hanson

I really like Mike Connelly over Gottesfeld.

Connelly was 3rd at Kinney NE Regionals in both '81 and '82 with very fast times of 15:23.9 and 15:21.5. He then finished in the top 5 at Kinney Nationals both of those years (both times held in Orlando) - 5th in '81 (15:01.2) and 4th in '82 (14:54). Also three times in the top 6 at Penn XC States (AA/AAA).

My mistake...Connelly placed 2nd at Kinney Nationals in '82.

Wisconsin

1. Chris Solinsky

2. Tim Hacker

3. Olin Hacker

4. Keith Hanson

5. Steve Lacy

6. Glenn Herold

7. Scott Jenkins

8. John Easker

This is a tough list to make. You really can't split Jenkins and Easker apart and Herold ran 9:53 for 2.2 miles on grass. Rombough and Jennings are definitely on the second team.

Regarding Virginia's list, Hunter would have destroyed Webb. Move Hunter to #1 !!

Regarding Virginia's list, Hunter would have destroyed Webb. Move Hunter to #1 !!

Kalaby wrote:

Kalaby wrote:

I really like Mike Connelly over Gottesfeld.

Connelly was 3rd at Kinney NE Regionals in both '81 and '82 with very fast times of 15:23.9 and 15:21.5. He then finished in the top 5 at Kinney Nationals both of those years (both times held in Orlando) - 5th in '81 (15:01.2) and 4th in '82 (14:54). Also three times in the top 6 at Penn XC States (AA/AAA).

My mistake...Connelly placed 2nd at Kinney Nationals in '82.

Yes I would say that Connelly would be better, I don't have too much knowledge about anything before around 2000-2005. But you agree that Brophy is better than Russell, correct?