Official 2022 UTMB Discussion Thread

LAZARUS LAKE'S ASHTRAY wrote:

The guy spent way too much time 'dominating' WS and a bunch of other flat non-relevant US races, he should've pivoted to Hardrock years ago and likely would've had a much better base for UTMB. Fortunately he probably still has time.

I mean FFS Kilian just dominated Hardrock a month ago and had COVID last week. Walmsley spent months training for UTMB and entered with fresh legs, and still came in 80+ minutes behind Kilian. As long as Kilian is running Walmsley has almost zero chance of being an ultra GOAT.

Regarding his personality, I think some of it is stress. He did an interview earlier this year where he said that contract renewal is incredibly stressful, even for runners of his caliber. His got renewed, and I think there's just a ton of pressure for him to perform. I doubt he has much if any social media income (compared to guys like Canaday) and he doesn't exactly have an influencer-like personality (no offense). So he's gotta rely on his performances to keep his sponsors happy.

When you're 25 and living with 4 roommates in a dumpy apartment, it's hard to feel stressed. As he's getting into his mid 30s, issues like career longevity, retirement savings, kids, health insurance etc. are a much bigger deal.

I'm sure he's pretty f*cking unhappy about his UTMB performance this year.

Deepthinker wrote:

Not a troll wrote:

Check out the wahoo/hoka produced short film released this week.

Jim has pretty much the ultimate mountain runners dream lifestyle. I personally don’t think he’s trying to win utmb to pay health insurance. He’s likely going to realise his goal of being the first American to win utmb, I think that’s what is important to him.

When he flunked western states the first couple of times people were quick to write him off as cocky, inexperienced, running bad tactics etc, but he knuckled down and mastered the race. I think it’s a safe bet he will repeat the process at utmb within 2 years.

I think he will be disappointed of course, but it’s his game plan to crack it next year.

Video:youtu.be/MjqmclAg1l8

Americans have won the UMTB many times:

Kristin Moehl 2003,2009

Nikki Kimball 2007

Roy Bosio 2013, 2014

Courtney Dauwalter 2019, 2021

Link:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-Trail_du_M...

TDF-like wrote:

rojo wrote:

Is this a joke?

Have you heard of someone named Eliud Kipchoge? You think he's better than Kipchoge?

You think he's better than this?

2003 World title in the 5000 over El G and Bekele. Ran 12:52 that year.
2018- 2:01:39 marathon WR. That's 15 years apart .
2022 - 4 years later. Runs 2:02:40.
Get back to me when Jornet does anything like 12:52 and then 2:02:49 19 years later.

Plus don't a lot of people think he's on drugs? I was stunned when i did the deep dive into running the ultra scene and I heard those rumors. I figured trails world was pure as snow.

Is this a joke?

Kipchoge runs well between 5000-42000 meters. Thats 37000 meters. Killian runs well between 40000-200000 meters. Thats 160000 meters. Kipchoge only runs well on artificial flat surfaces. Killian runs well on the most important surfaces, which cover most of walkable/runnable terrain on Earth and those are natural surface walking & hiking hiking paths.

You really think Kipchoge is better than that??

Also, unlike Killian, there is absolutely no doubt Kipchoge is on drugs. Compared to mountain/ultra running, track (and esp. road racing) is worse than the Tour de France. Its a joke.

Deepthinker wrote:

Not a troll wrote:

Check out the wahoo/hoka produced short film released this week.

Jim has pretty much the ultimate mountain runners dream lifestyle. I personally don’t think he’s trying to win utmb to pay health insurance. He’s likely going to realise his goal of being the first American to win utmb, I think that’s what is important to him.

When he flunked western states the first couple of times people were quick to write him off as cocky, inexperienced, running bad tactics etc, but he knuckled down and mastered the race. I think it’s a safe bet he will repeat the process at utmb within 2 years.

I think he will be disappointed of course, but it’s his game plan to crack it next year.

Video:youtu.be/MjqmclAg1l8

Americans have won the UMTB many times:

Kristin Moehl 2003,2009

Nikki Kimball 2007

Roy Bosio 2013, 2014

Courtney Dauwalter 2019, 2021

Link:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-Trail_du_M...

Deepthinker wrote:

LAZARUS LAKE'S ASHTRAY wrote:

The guy spent way too much time 'dominating' WS and a bunch of other flat non-relevant US races, he should've pivoted to Hardrock years ago and likely would've had a much better base for UTMB. Fortunately he probably still has time.

I mean FFS Kilian just dominated Hardrock a month ago and had COVID last week. Walmsley spent months training for UTMB and entered with fresh legs, and still came in 80+ minutes behind Kilian. As long as Kilian is running Walmsley has almost zero chance of being an ultra GOAT.

Regarding his personality, I think some of it is stress. He did an interview earlier this year where he said that contract renewal is incredibly stressful, even for runners of his caliber. His got renewed, and I think there's just a ton of pressure for him to perform. I doubt he has much if any social media income (compared to guys like Canaday) and he doesn't exactly have an influencer-like personality (no offense). So he's gotta rely on his performances to keep his sponsors happy.

When you're 25 and living with 4 roommates in a dumpy apartment, it's hard to feel stressed. As he's getting into his mid 30s, issues like career longevity, retirement savings, kids, health insurance etc. are a much bigger deal.

I'm sure he's pretty f*cking unhappy about his UTMB performance this year.

Great point.
What I see as an huge obstacle for US runners is the fact that they have to be Pros. Almost nobody else (except Kilian) is that. Almost all have normal jobs with good health insurance they all run for fun.
François D'Haene for example has a winery.
Jim Walmsley doesn't have that, he is at the mercy of some soulless corporations.

Primate1 wrote:

TDF-like wrote:

Is this a joke?

Kipchoge runs well between 5000-42000 meters. Thats 37000 meters. Killian runs well between 40000-200000 meters. Thats 160000 meters. Kipchoge only runs well on artificial flat surfaces. Killian runs well on the most important surfaces, which cover most of walkable/runnable terrain on Earth and those are natural surface walking & hiking hiking paths.

You really think Kipchoge is better than that??

Also, unlike Killian, there is absolutely no doubt Kipchoge is on drugs. Compared to mountain/ultra running, track (and esp. road racing) is worse than the Tour de France. Its a joke.

Is this a joke? Putting drugs aside, because neither has tested positive so who knows, Killian cannot compare to Kipchoge, or Bekele, or any top track / road racer. The competition is just too weak. Not enough top runners do ultra /trail; not enough parts of the world do it. So it is much easier to win major championships. It’s like comparing the athleticism of a D1 lacrosse player to a D1 football player, or the stats of someone playing in the US soccer league vs Europe.

Also, your distance comparison makes no sense. Kipchoge has a factor of 8x; Killian 4x. Plus Kipchoge won a world championship at the low end of his range, and Killian has most certainly not.

Primate1 wrote:

TDF-like wrote:

Is this a joke?

Kipchoge runs well between 5000-42000 meters. Thats 37000 meters. Killian runs well between 40000-200000 meters. Thats 160000 meters. Kipchoge only runs well on artificial flat surfaces. Killian runs well on the most important surfaces, which cover most of walkable/runnable terrain on Earth and those are natural surface walking & hiking hiking paths.

You really think Kipchoge is better than that??

Also, unlike Killian, there is absolutely no doubt Kipchoge is on drugs. Compared to mountain/ultra running, track (and esp. road racing) is worse than the Tour de France. Its a joke.

Is this a joke? Putting drugs aside, because neither has tested positive so who knows, Killian cannot compare to Kipchoge, or Bekele, or any top track / road racer. The competition is just too weak. Not enough top runners do ultra /trail; not enough parts of the world do it. So it is much easier to win major championships. It’s like comparing the athleticism of a D1 lacrosse player to a D1 football player, or the stats of someone playing in the US soccer league vs Europe.

Also, your distance comparison makes no sense. Kipchoge has a factor of 8x; Killian 4x. Plus Kipchoge won a world championship at the low end of his range, and Killian has most certainly not.

No Cococino fanboy wrote:

jonathon wrote:

I've read it somewhere on LRC and I have to agree. Jim just seems to only have about 14 hours of running in his legs before he fades dramatically. In a flat/runnable 100 miler, that's enough - which is why he has put together great road performances, and runs at WS100. But when it comes to hard rock, or UTMB, he seems to just fade and do horribly after around that time mark.

If he really wants to win this thing, I think he needs more experience with longer ultras. Today he got some.

I also don't know if he's in a great spot mentally / socially as compared to when he was in Flagstaff and the Coconino cowboys were all good buds. Since Jim left/got pushed out of that group, I've noticed a change in his personality. If you watch his pre race interviews from irunfar for WS100 in the early years, the dude is happy, psyched, and clearly in the zone for the race. Since that era, now he seems like he is more calculated but passionless. Maybe this is what the new Jim is like.

Yes indeed. It's somewhere around 17 hours. Anton Krupicka had the same problem. They never figured out how to take care of themselves in longer races, eat enough and have the right clothes at the right time. The longer the ultra the more complex it gets.
And then there is the mental aspect of things. Jim is really bad at that.