Discussion has focussed in only two options; either Keely was impeded or she wasn't - at least not to the extent a DQ could be argued.
There is a third possibility; was Mu trying to impede Hodgkinson, by cutting in, even if it didn't result in blocking Hodgkinson? If what she attempted wasn't a technical infraction, was it nonetheless sporting?
In the Olympics she literally was on the outside of 1 with 110m to go and in the middle of the lane coming out of the bend into the straight, just like this. It's almost as if people's positions with in a lane vary when they come off a turn. But you'd have to actually run track to know that.
Don't be silly. If that was a direct reply to me, I ran track for many, many years. I still think she intentionally cut in.
In the Olympics she literally was on the outside of 1 with 110m to go and in the middle of the lane coming out of the bend into the straight, just like this. It's almost as if people's positions with in a lane vary when they come off a turn. But you'd have to actually run track to know that.
Don't be silly. If that was a direct reply to me, I ran track for many, many years. I still think she intentionally cut in.
If you ran track for several years you’d know that you often come off the bend in a way that changes where you are within your lane. Are you familiar with that? Did you watch last year’s Olympic final where she did the same without anyone around her?
Don't be silly. If that was a direct reply to me, I ran track for many, many years. I still think she intentionally cut in.
If you ran track for several years you’d know that you often come off the bend in a way that changes where you are within your lane. Are you familiar with that? Did you watch last year’s Olympic final where she did the same without anyone around her?
Oh dear, have you heard the expression "shooting yourself in the foot"? Well, this is what you wrote: "Did you watch last year’s Olympic final where she did the same without anyone around her?" That's the whole point! This time there was someone around her! Keely! Indeed, as soon as she realised Keely was on her inside, she should have given her space because she ( Athing) had indeed moved into another athlete's space. Or is Athing entitled to the space that Keely held, in the inside of the lane, and the space that she ( Athing ) had moved from, on the outside of the lane?
OK, all conventional wisdom states that on a bend, an athlete leading a race, should run the shortest distance by staying close to the kerb, and also to prevent a competitor “sneaking through” on the inside. Now, for some reason, Athing has decided to reject that “conventional wisdom” and, in doing so, created the “situation” being discussed here. Now, had she run near the kerb, around the bend, Keely would have had to try to overtake her on her ( Athing’s ) outside. Athing fans can claim that she can run anywhere she likes. True, but by leaving a space on her inside, she is “inviting” a competitor to fill that space. And, it is noticeable that Athing fans think that the space that she gave up, on her inside, still belongs to her. Now, if Athing was approaching the straight with one leg in lane 1 and one leg in lane 2, would that alter Athing’s fans belief that Keely was trying to “sneak” through a space that didn’t belong to her? Now, if some of those fans waiver in their beliefs at this point - as they should - it proves that they are thinking “in lanes”. Again, lanes, as such, don’t exist in longer events. To make this point clearer, let’s imagine that the lane markings didn't exist as Athing and Keely approached the straight. Now, all we have to consider, is whether there was enough space on Athing’s inside for an athlete to comfortably come through. And, of course, there is, as the photo on the bend proves. Now, how did that situation change? Well, it changed because Athing realised that Keely was coming through on her inside, panicked and decided to block her forward movement. BTW, surely nobody can believe - with the photo evidence - that Athing didn’t know that Keely was inches away from drawing level ( indeed, in the photo it looks like Keely is level) Oh, and if Athing was surprised that a competitor was on her inside, she only has herself to blame as EVERYONE had mentioned that it was likely to happen. And, why oh why does Athing run on the outside of her lane, in spite of all the advice that she shouldn’t. Why, in spite of all the advice, did she let the “squeezing" of Keely situation occur. Why? Arrogance that nobody would be capable of doing it? Or, is it simply a case of her choosing to ignore an avalanche of sensible advice? Either way, it reflects poorly on Athing. And finally, “that squeezing” continued all the way down the home straight. Indeed, down the straight, with another athlete inside her, Athing was running closer to the kerb than when she had the lane to herself! So, why didn’t Athing play fair by not squeezing Keely, after all at that point the two athletes were taking up not much more than half a lane. Now, Keely could have got “physical”, in an attempt to create some space, but, in spite of Athings “crowding” tactics. you can bet the honest and noble IAAF would have penalised Keely if any “damaging” contact had happened. Again, not Athing finest moment, and a rather tainted gold medal. Was it simply an example of winning at all costs. It certainly looks that way.
In response to your comments and the thread question, "did Mu cut off Hodgkinson?" the answer might be "no - but she tried to". But as Hodgkinson wasn't impeded there can be no DQ.
How has this got to 15 pages? If there was any hint of obstruction, one of Hodgkinson's coaches would have mentioned it or the British team would have protested. She was side-by-side with Mu at one point, if she could have taken the lead, she would.
Without the head-on video footage as proof of impeding, Keely and her team would not have raised the subject because it would have simply been a case of " he said, she said".
You're an idiot. You have no idea whether or not there is head-on footage. There is always more footage taken of a race than is shown on TV, and the review officials have access to that additional footage.
And review officials never base their decisions on "he said, she said." That's not how reviews work. You just made that up.
Without the head-on video footage as proof of impeding, Keely and her team would not have raised the subject because it would have simply been a case of " he said, she said".
You're an idiot. You have no idea whether or not there is head-on footage. There is always more footage taken of a race than is shown on TV, and the review officials have access to that additional footage.
And review officials never base their decisions on "he said, she said." That's not how reviews work. You just made that up.
OK, here we go again. First, we have UK Athletics and they wouldn't put in a protest because, as I keep saying, they know very well that the IAAF turn a blind eye to impeding. Then there is Keely and her coaching team, and they wouldn't raise the subject because British Athletics didn't protest, and also, as I keep saying, without access to head-on footage, Keely and her coaching team, would have no hard evidence that Athing acted inappropriately. Got that?
In response to your comments and the thread question, "did Mu cut off Hodgkinson?" the answer might be "no - but she tried to". But as Hodgkinson wasn't impeded there can be no DQ.
As I keep saying, without the head-on footage, we don't know for sure how much Athing's move into Keely's space affected Keely. But, again, as I keep saying, the IAAF turn a blind eye to impeding, and so a DQ was never going to happen.
You're an idiot. You have no idea whether or not there is head-on footage. There is always more footage taken of a race than is shown on TV, and the review officials have access to that additional footage.
And review officials never base their decisions on "he said, she said." That's not how reviews work. You just made that up.
as I keep saying, without access to head-on footage, Keely and her coaching team, would have no hard evidence that Athing acted inappropriately.
You're totally clueless about how protests work. If a runner believes that they were impeded then they file a protest. Simple as that.
They don't need to PROVE anything at all in order to file a protest. The protest merely says, "Mary Smith was impeded by another runner, Cindy Jones, during such and such part of the race, and I want that other runner disqualified." And then the OFFICIALS figure it out.
The coach and runner don't turn into Sherlock Holmes and wander around the stadium trying to find some people in control of all the video cameras to see what footage they may or may not have gotten.
You really should learn more about how protests work before continously writing so much made up nonsense.
If you ran track for several years you’d know that you often come off the bend in a way that changes where you are within your lane. Are you familiar with that? Did you watch last year’s Olympic final where she did the same without anyone around her?
as soon as she realised Keely was on her inside, she should have given her space
as soon as she realised Keely was on her inside, she should have given her space
Track isn’t the sport for you.
Well, it was when I first joined by local athletic club in 1958, but it has to be said that certain aspects of the sport have gone down hill considerably since then. Fair play and good sportsmanship, for example, are nowhere near as important as they once were.
Well, it was when I first joined by local athletic club in 1958, but it has to be said that certain aspects of the sport have gone down hill considerably since then. Fair play and good sportsmanship, for example, are nowhere near as important as they once were.
There was nothing unfair or unsportsmanlike about this race. That’s why I think you are following the wrong sport. Maybe dressage is more your speed.
Well, it was when I first joined by local athletic club in 1958, but it has to be said that certain aspects of the sport have gone down hill considerably since then. Fair play and good sportsmanship, for example, are nowhere near as important as they once were.
There was nothing unfair or unsportsmanlike about this race. That’s why I think you are following the wrong sport. Maybe dressage is more your speed.
Nothing unfair and unsportsmanlike. Really? You could have fooled me. And, it's the sport that needs to take a good look at itself. None of my friends are interested in track because, according to them, it's full of drug cheats, and that is why the sport has to be squeaky clean in the way it deals with on track behaviour, and the IAAF are too fond on burying its head in the ground rather than dealing with "problem" areas...impeding, for example.
Don't be silly. If that was a direct reply to me, I ran track for many, many years. I still think she intentionally cut in.
If you ran track for several years you’d know that you often come off the bend in a way that changes where you are within your lane. Are you familiar with that? Did you watch last year’s Olympic final where she did the same without anyone around her?
Yes, I think everyone knows that your position can change within a lane. It would be odd if that didn't happen. Athing does it a lot. She runs right on the outside of lane one, instead of in the middle or on the rail. It means it's more difficult to get past her than if she ran on the rail, or in the middle of the lane. Athletes either have to run very wide or they have to try to go through on the inside, as with what happened in this race. But then, as evidenced by the second photo, things changed and there genuinely wasn't enough space to get through. It's just my thoughts on it. That's what I think. You're free to not think the same, obviously. But for me, looking at the photos, it seems fairly obvious.
If you ran track for several years you’d know that you often come off the bend in a way that changes where you are within your lane. Are you familiar with that? Did you watch last year’s Olympic final where she did the same without anyone around her?
there genuinely wasn't enough space to get through. It's just my thoughts on it.
What are you talking about? Keely herself said she had enough space to get through.
So I'm going to go with what Keely said because she was the person who was actually there vs some random person's opinion on the internet.
Oh dear, The States are really screwed up over racism. BTW, some of my all time favourite sportspeople and musicians are black! In fact I had a huge photo Abebe Bikila on my bedroom wall before most of the posters here were born. Cut out the racist nonsense.