Didn’t Lebron make a 3 Pointer before Irving? Didn’t Lebron block a shot by Iguodala to prevent the tie? Didn’t Lebron get fouled and make a free throw shot? Didn’t LeBron make the most points on his team in Game 7? Cringe takes lol.
LeBron missed 4 shots in a row before Kyrie. The block preserved the tie (and was a great block). LeBron shot only 9 for 24 in the game. When the team needed a bucket the most to win the championship, the ball was in Kyrie's hands. He made the championship-winning shot unassisted while LeBron stood in the corner.
Jordan shot 15-35 which is a worse percentage 🤣. Thanks for moving the goalposts though.
edit: My bad, it’s NOT a worse percentage. Jordan really is that good.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
In the final 24 seconds of one-possession NBA Finals games (the most clutch situation there is), Jordan made 4 shots to tie the game or take the lead. LeBron never made any.
The most iconic shot of Jordan's career was him making the game-winner to clinch his 6th championship.
The most iconic shot of LeBron's career was Kyrie Irving making the game-winner to beat Golden State for the championship while LeBron stood still in the corner.
Didn’t Lebron make a 3 Pointer before Irving? Didn’t Lebron block a shot by Iguodala to prevent the tie? Didn’t Lebron get fouled and make a free throw shot? Didn’t LeBron make the most points on his team in Game 7? Cringe takes lol.
Didn’t Lebron make a 3 Pointer before Irving? Didn’t Lebron block a shot by Iguodala to prevent the tie? Didn’t Lebron get fouled and make a free throw shot? Didn’t LeBron make the most points on his team in Game 7? Cringe takes lol.
Who is NBA’s all time leader in clutch points?
Stats weren’t as robust when Jordan played, but this notion that LeBron is not clutch is incompatible with reality. Jordan was also clutch fwiw.
Michael Jordan was a... Better scorer Better clutch player Better offensive rebounder Better perimeter defender Better ball handler and protector More valuable player More durable player (played 80+games in a season more times than LeBron) More ruthless competitor Played in a 10x more physical league ... Jordan had a higher peak Jordan has more championships Jordan has more regular season MVP awards Jordan has more Finals MVP awards Jordan has more Defensive Player of the Year recognition Jordan has more All-Defensive Team selections Jordan has more scoring titles Jordan has more steals titles Jordan has more points/game Jordan has more steals/game Jordan has more blocks/game Jordan has more offensive rebounds/game Jordan has a higher free throw % Jordan has a higher Player Efficiency Rating Jordan has more Win Shares per 48 Minutes Jordan has a higher Offensive Box Plus/Minus Jordan has a higher Defensive Box Plus/Minus Jordan has a higher Box Plus/Minus
Jordan is the most valuable player. The MVP trophy is literally named after him. Jordan destroyed his competitors. LeBron joined his competitors' teams.
Calling Jordan “more valuable” because the MVP trophy got renamed after him is not an argument, it’s branding. Bill Russell has the Finals MVP named after him — does that make him greater than Jordan? You say Jordan “destroyed competitors” while LeBron “joined them,” but Jordan literally retired twice, came back to a stacked Bulls dynasty with Pippen, Rodman, Phil Jackson, elite role players, and expansion-era talent dilution. LeBron dragged multiple rosters to Finals that had no business being there. Also, “more durable” is hilarious. LeBron is in year 23 still averaging elite numbers at 40 years old. Jordan played 15 seasons total and took multiple retirements. Longevity matters. Sustaining greatness for two decades matters. As for “better scorer,” LeBron has more total points on better efficiency while being one of the greatest passers ever. Scoring 35 a game on tougher shot selection doesn’t automatically make you the better offensive player when the other guy gives you 27-7-7 with elite efficiency and controls every aspect of the game. Jordan fans love using per-game stats because they hide longevity totals and cumulative impact. LeBron leads in playoff points, assists, rebounds, steals, games, minutes, and basically every all-around playoff category because he stayed dominant for 20+ years against deeper, more athletic competition. And the “physical era” point is exaggerated constantly. Illegal defense rules in Jordan’s era literally made isolations easier because teams couldn’t load up the way modern defenses do. LeBron deals with complex zone schemes, switching defenses, help-heavy rotations, and athletes at every position. Jordan had the higher peak scoring image. LeBron has the more complete basketball résumé: More total production Better playmaking Better longevity More versatility More adaptability Elite in every era and system If your GOAT argument depends on “6-0” while ignoring context, longevity, efficiency, playmaking, and total impact, then it’s more nostalgia than analysis.
Michael Jordan was a... Better scorer Better clutch player Better offensive rebounder Better perimeter defender Better ball handler and protector More valuable player More durable player (played 80+games in a season more times than LeBron) More ruthless competitor Played in a 10x more physical league ... Jordan had a higher peak Jordan has more championships Jordan has more regular season MVP awards Jordan has more Finals MVP awards Jordan has more Defensive Player of the Year recognition Jordan has more All-Defensive Team selections Jordan has more scoring titles Jordan has more steals titles Jordan has more points/game Jordan has more steals/game Jordan has more blocks/game Jordan has more offensive rebounds/game Jordan has a higher free throw % Jordan has a higher Player Efficiency Rating Jordan has more Win Shares per 48 Minutes Jordan has a higher Offensive Box Plus/Minus Jordan has a higher Defensive Box Plus/Minus Jordan has a higher Box Plus/Minus
Jordan is the most valuable player. The MVP trophy is literally named after him. Jordan destroyed his competitors. LeBron joined his competitors' teams.
Calling Jordan “more valuable” because the MVP trophy got renamed after him is not an argument, it’s branding. Bill Russell has the Finals MVP named after him — does that make him greater than Jordan? You say Jordan “destroyed competitors” while LeBron “joined them,” but Jordan literally retired twice, came back to a stacked Bulls dynasty with Pippen, Rodman, Phil Jackson, elite role players, and expansion-era talent dilution. LeBron dragged multiple rosters to Finals that had no business being there. Also, “more durable” is hilarious. LeBron is in year 23 still averaging elite numbers at 40 years old. Jordan played 15 seasons total and took multiple retirements. Longevity matters. Sustaining greatness for two decades matters. As for “better scorer,” LeBron has more total points on better efficiency while being one of the greatest passers ever. Scoring 35 a game on tougher shot selection doesn’t automatically make you the better offensive player when the other guy gives you 27-7-7 with elite efficiency and controls every aspect of the game. Jordan fans love using per-game stats because they hide longevity totals and cumulative impact. LeBron leads in playoff points, assists, rebounds, steals, games, minutes, and basically every all-around playoff category because he stayed dominant for 20+ years against deeper, more athletic competition. And the “physical era” point is exaggerated constantly. Illegal defense rules in Jordan’s era literally made isolations easier because teams couldn’t load up the way modern defenses do. LeBron deals with complex zone schemes, switching defenses, help-heavy rotations, and athletes at every position. Jordan had the higher peak scoring image. LeBron has the more complete basketball résumé: More total production Better playmaking Better longevity More versatility More adaptability Elite in every era and system If your GOAT argument depends on “6-0” while ignoring context, longevity, efficiency, playmaking, and total impact, then it’s more nostalgia than analysis.
Wow… the LeBronnies still haven’t come up with anything meaningful?? LOL
Everyone needs to watch this video. Confirms everything we already knew. Despite being in a deliberate no-defense era his entire career, LeBron is an inferior scorer, inferior shooter (his shooting from “outside 3 feet” is hilariously bad- the stats provided toward the end of the video are wild- he’s even WORSE in the clutch mind you), is an inferior defender, pathetically flops all the time (funny how his 6’9” / 265 lbs stature evaporates sometimes LOL), and has a 4-6 Finals record (including 4 of the most lopsided losses in NBA history!).
The 80s/90s were such a better era of basketball… looks at the defense, the physicality, the interior passing,… why did they turn such a beautiful game into all 3-pointers and dunks?? Sad.
These videos end the debate, you stupid douchebaggs. WATCH THE FIRST VIDEO. All stats. All facts. MJ better in EVERYTHING.
Jordan shoots the same or a touch better than his normal FG% in the clutch. LeBron shoots WELL BELOW his avg FG% in clutch situations, and even worse in “final shots.” He’s HORRIBLE IN THE CLUTCH. (Which is a big part of why he lost SIX (6) NBA FINALS, and only won 4 despite playing 40 seasons.)
His FG% ”outside 3 feet” is a disgusting 35%. PATHETIC. Clownish in the context of a GOAT debate. Especially in a no-defense era, which encompassed his entire career.
Michael Jordan was a... Better scorer Better clutch player Better offensive rebounder Better perimeter defender Better ball handler and protector More valuable player More durable player (played 80+games in a season more times than LeBron) More ruthless competitor Played in a 10x more physical league ... Jordan had a higher peak Jordan has more championships Jordan has more regular season MVP awards Jordan has more Finals MVP awards Jordan has more Defensive Player of the Year recognition Jordan has more All-Defensive Team selections Jordan has more scoring titles Jordan has more steals titles Jordan has more points/game Jordan has more steals/game Jordan has more blocks/game Jordan has more offensive rebounds/game Jordan has a higher free throw % Jordan has a higher Player Efficiency Rating Jordan has more Win Shares per 48 Minutes Jordan has a higher Offensive Box Plus/Minus Jordan has a higher Defensive Box Plus/Minus Jordan has a higher Box Plus/Minus
Jordan is the most valuable player. The MVP trophy is literally named after him. Jordan destroyed his competitors. LeBron joined his competitors' teams.
Calling Jordan “more valuable” because the MVP trophy got renamed after him is not an argument, it’s branding. Bill Russell has the Finals MVP named after him — does that make him greater than Jordan? You say Jordan “destroyed competitors” while LeBron “joined them,” but Jordan literally retired twice, came back to a stacked Bulls dynasty with Pippen, Rodman, Phil Jackson, elite role players, and expansion-era talent dilution. LeBron dragged multiple rosters to Finals that had no business being there. Also, “more durable” is hilarious. LeBron is in year 23 still averaging elite numbers at 40 years old. Jordan played 15 seasons total and took multiple retirements. Longevity matters. Sustaining greatness for two decades matters. As for “better scorer,” LeBron has more total points on better efficiency while being one of the greatest passers ever. Scoring 35 a game on tougher shot selection doesn’t automatically make you the better offensive player when the other guy gives you 27-7-7 with elite efficiency and controls every aspect of the game. Jordan fans love using per-game stats because they hide longevity totals and cumulative impact. LeBron leads in playoff points, assists, rebounds, steals, games, minutes, and basically every all-around playoff category because he stayed dominant for 20+ years against deeper, more athletic competition. And the “physical era” point is exaggerated constantly. Illegal defense rules in Jordan’s era literally made isolations easier because teams couldn’t load up the way modern defenses do. LeBron deals with complex zone schemes, switching defenses, help-heavy rotations, and athletes at every position. Jordan had the higher peak scoring image. LeBron has the more complete basketball résumé: More total production Better playmaking Better longevity More versatility More adaptability Elite in every era and system If your GOAT argument depends on “6-0” while ignoring context, longevity, efficiency, playmaking, and total impact, then it’s more nostalgia than analysis.
LOL- trying to compare lifetime stats to per game avg stats in GOAT debates. Random subjective statements (“more versatility” (LOL)) vs STATS (MJ shooting 50% in the clutch vs LBJ shooting 35% in the clutch). “Elite in every era and system”- LMAO- uhhh, what?? He flops like pvssy biitch when he’s barely touched… you think he’d be able to handle getting bodied all game?? GTFOH
LeBron “dragging teams to the finals” only shows how watered-down the league has been in the no-defense era. To go 4-6 is… not good.
Nice try clowns. MJ has 2x 3-peats in the Finals, averages 30 PPG lifetime and shoots 50% from the floor in the most physical era in NBA history.
In the pressure-filled world of the NBA playoffs, few debates spark more intensity than the question of who rises higher in clutch moments. Michael Jordan
Calling Jordan “more valuable” because the MVP trophy got renamed after him is not an argument, it’s branding. Bill Russell has the Finals MVP named after him — does that make him greater than Jordan? You say Jordan “destroyed competitors” while LeBron “joined them,” but Jordan literally retired twice, came back to a stacked Bulls dynasty with Pippen, Rodman, Phil Jackson, elite role players, and expansion-era talent dilution. LeBron dragged multiple rosters to Finals that had no business being there. Also, “more durable” is hilarious. LeBron is in year 23 still averaging elite numbers at 40 years old. Jordan played 15 seasons total and took multiple retirements. Longevity matters. Sustaining greatness for two decades matters. As for “better scorer,” LeBron has more total points on better efficiency while being one of the greatest passers ever. Scoring 35 a game on tougher shot selection doesn’t automatically make you the better offensive player when the other guy gives you 27-7-7 with elite efficiency and controls every aspect of the game. Jordan fans love using per-game stats because they hide longevity totals and cumulative impact. LeBron leads in playoff points, assists, rebounds, steals, games, minutes, and basically every all-around playoff category because he stayed dominant for 20+ years against deeper, more athletic competition. And the “physical era” point is exaggerated constantly. Illegal defense rules in Jordan’s era literally made isolations easier because teams couldn’t load up the way modern defenses do. LeBron deals with complex zone schemes, switching defenses, help-heavy rotations, and athletes at every position. Jordan had the higher peak scoring image. LeBron has the more complete basketball résumé: More total production Better playmaking Better longevity More versatility More adaptability Elite in every era and system If your GOAT argument depends on “6-0” while ignoring context, longevity, efficiency, playmaking, and total impact, then it’s more nostalgia than analysis.
LOL- trying to compare lifetime stats to per game avg stats in GOAT debates. Random subjective statements (“more versatility” (LOL)) vs STATS (MJ shooting 50% in the clutch vs LBJ shooting 35% in the clutch). “Elite in every era and system”- LMAO- uhhh, what?? He flops like pvssy biitch when he’s barely touched… you think he’d be able to handle getting bodied all game?? GTFOH
LeBron “dragging teams to the finals” only shows how watered-down the league has been in the no-defense era. To go 4-6 is… not good.
Nice try clowns. MJ has 2x 3-peats in the Finals, averages 30 PPG lifetime and shoots 50% from the floor in the most physical era in NBA history.
You keep saying “per game stats” because MJ fans know longevity destroys the argument. Staying elite for 20+ years absolutely matters in GOAT debates. LeBron is the all-time leading scorer while also being top-tier in assists. Jordan was never close to that level of all-around impact. And that “50% in the clutch vs 35%” stat gets thrown around with zero context every time. Define clutch. What sample size? What years? Meanwhile LeBron literally has more playoff game-winners than Jordan and has hit clutch shots in more playoff series across more eras.
Also, calling the modern NBA “no defense” is just exposing nostalgia bias. Modern defenses are infinitely more complex. Jordan played in an era with illegal defense rules that made isolation easier and prevented teams from fully loading up. LeBron deals with zones, switches, double teams, weak-side rotations, and elite athletes at every position. And the “physical era” point is overstated too. Hand-checking existed, sure, but spacing was worse, skill depth was lower, and plenty of players in the 90s had second jobs-level athleticism compared to today. The average NBA athlete now is bigger, faster, more skilled, and more versatile.
Also funny how “dragging teams to the Finals” suddenly becomes a negative when it’s LeBron. Jordan lost in the first round repeatedly before Pippen became elite and the Bulls built a dynasty around him. LeBron carried weak rosters to the Finals in both conferences. And saying 4-6 is bad ignores the fact that MAKING 10 Finals is insane in itself. You’re basically punishing LeBron for surviving longer in the playoffs than everyone else. Jordan fans act like losing before the Finals is somehow better than losing in the Finals. Jordan absolutely has arguments: Higher peak scoring Better midrange game More aesthetically dominant Perfect Finals record But LeBron’s argument is about total basketball value: Longevity Versatility Playmaking Adaptability Consistency across eras Overall production
One guy mastered one system with one franchise core. The other succeeded with multiple franchises, coaches, teammates, playstyles, and eras while remaining elite for over two decades.
Your entire argument boils down to “6-0” and nostalgia for the 90s. Mine is based on overall basketball impact, versatility, longevity, and actual production. That’s why your side keeps relying on mythology while LeBron’s résumé keeps getting stronger every season.
Jordan quits the Bulls in his prime and the Bulls come back the next year and still win 55 games - two fewer than with Jordan. You’d think a GOAT would have more of an impact.
LeBron missed 4 shots in a row before Kyrie. The block preserved the tie (and was a great block). LeBron shot only 9 for 24 in the game. When the team needed a bucket the most to win the championship, the ball was in Kyrie's hands. He made the championship-winning shot unassisted while LeBron stood in the corner.
Jordan shot 15-35 which is a worse percentage 🤣. Thanks for moving the goalposts though.
edit: My bad, it’s NOT a worse percentage. Jordan really is that good.
I didn't move any goal posts. I said my reasoning for saying Jordan was more clutch was because of the shots he made in the final 24 seconds of one-possession NBA Finals games. You pointed to a shot LeBron made with almost 5 minutes left in the game.
Returning to my goal posts. In the final 24 seconds of one-possession NBA Finals games (the most clutch situation there is), Jordan made 4 shots to tie the game or take the lead. LeBron never made any.
Jordan didn't need to jack up a bunch of 3 pointers because he had other ways he could score.
He didn’t jack them up because as a guard he shot 3s worse than 7 footers like Holmgren and Wemby and probably 10+ other 7 footers did this year. lol.
The game has passed you and Jordan by. Players are much more skilled today.
The goal on offense is to score points. Nobody in NBA history has scored more points per game in a career than Jordan did. The game hasn't "passed Jordan by" because he's still #1.
Jordan quits the Bulls in his prime and the Bulls come back the next year and still win 55 games - two fewer than with Jordan. You’d think a GOAT would have more of an impact.
Did they win the championship without Jordan? Did they even make it to the NBA Finals?
Jordan quits the Bulls in his prime and the Bulls come back the next year and still win 55 games - two fewer than with Jordan. You’d think a GOAT would have more of an impact.
Did they win the championship without Jordan? Did they even make it to the NBA Finals?
Did they win without Pippen?
Focusing on team titles is so simple. No wonder you said 3 point shooting isn’t a skill.
