why does David Roche keep banging on about being in sub-4 at altitude shape?

He can race whatever he wants to race and attempt a world record if he wants to. There's nothing wrong with that... Clearly there's a lot of jealousy of his success happening alongside the speculation that he can't run certain times.

This is kind of cool though. People CARE about what David Roche is doing. A legend.

he can run good to great times in ultra and trail races. No one is disputing that (some people might, I suppose).

What people are disputing is his recent turn in claiming that he can run a sub 4 mile/sub 14 5k/ 2:10 marathon. He cannot run these times. That's not speculation. That's just the truth. There's no shame in not being able to run those time. There is shame however in claiming time and time again that you can run those times and that you are running workouts that would make you as good or better than those times

Lots of athletes are arrogant. But what makes David different in this regard, and more worthy of contempt, because he claims to be so humble and inclusive and tolerant and loving. Everything he does is to show—or tell—you how amazing HE is and then follows it up by saying how amazing or inspiring you are for having said he’s amazing/inspiring.

He’s not just arrogant and bold. He’s an insecure narcissist. It’s yucky. It’s the kind of personality that makes you want to stay away and let others know not to trust him.

He is deserving of the criticism. You who defend him call it “hate,” but it’s really just calling him out. When he ignores it or doubles down, or says we are jealous, it demonstrates he has no ability to actually be humble or honest or engage in good faith with others. This leads me to believe he is an attention-seeking egomaniac.

His writing is legitimately terrible. He is as good as a 7th grader, but not as funny.

Calling him annoying (subjective, but it seems like most of us agree) and dishonest about how fast he can run (almost definitely true) is calling him out. Since he's a pubic figure I think it's fair. Following him on social media and listening to his podcast so that you can find more ways to say that you don't like him and studying the details of his treadmill runs to find additional proof that he's not as fast as he claims is 100% hater behavior. The same complaints have been restated for 14 straight pages

I can't speak to listening to his podcast because I don't and I haven't

studying details of his treadmill runs? He goes out of his way to publicly post workouts that he is physically incapable of. And "studying" these results involves one click which I did in order to see whether he tracked the workout with his treadmill (which would make the workout accurate) or with his garmin (which are notoriously terrible for tracking treadmill runs)

The amount of hate following of Roche on this thread is hilarious. If he signed up for a 5k it might be the most followed event in LRC history.

There's been plenty of analysis of his podcasts, his paid patreon content, and other podcasts about him. People were bringing up the specific treadmill model he used to have and the one he has now. There were also people looking at his heartrate and pace for specific strava segments and video clips.

I'm starting to come around on the people who are just hating him for the fun of it and owning it. That's part of the fun of sports. But pretending that you're not going out of your way, like he's sending the strava files to your phone without you asking is a little ridiculous. Or being the 100th commenter to pretend you're doing a public service by saying he can't run sub-4. Like yea, we know.

Okay, David

He’s a coward until he races a mile or 5k on the track at altitude. Plenty of opportunities to do so. There was a race at CU last weekend where guys broke 4.

I don’t listen to the podcast anymore. None of my running group does either except for one. Apparently he was barking like a dog on an episode and saying he was alpha and his competitors were beta. Wtf. That is not humility at all.

So what’s wrong with his schedule for the year?

and you're going out of your way to defend him. So what? If you have something to say about the actual content of the critcisms, but all means, go right ahead. But if you all you got is personal attacks, then you've lost the debate already

To be a successful athlete in the modern era you have to a) run fast and win stuff b) generate attention and monetise it. Seems like David has been quite successful on both counts this last year. Everyone here engaging with his content to prove some point to strangers on the internet about how terrible he is just helps juice his numbers and his bank account.

I'm concerned about the facts, not whether or not I juice internet stats

Defend him? You guys are weird, I'm agreeing that he's annoying and not as fast as he says he is. I'm saying it's strange you guys keep acting like he's making you follow him on strava or listen to his podcast or watch his youtube videos? Strava and IG are "public" but you still have to go seek him out. I'm just trying to figure out why the hivemind is piling on? we settled the case in the first couple pages.

Only thing I can think of is bunch of you must have been tricked by his coaching thing and are salty about it? A bunch of scorned ex-lovers?

so you agree that he's a liar

Yeah, I guess so. Or at least just blowing smoke, until he actually tries to run those times.

We gotta get a link and a timestamp on this podcast episode where this "barking like a dog" and "alpha talk" happened...