I think the major headline in this NCState domination in the 5K is that they are the clear favorites in the fall to repeat as National Champs! Did everyone forget that Sydney Seymour was 4th in this race and she will be joining the Wolfpack in the fall? And now Starliper in one season after being injured for two years has already made Nationals…… she is not even close to the shape she will be in this fall?!?! And then if Chmiel has a good summer and comes back healthy…..lights out and give them the trophy now.
If this team stays healthy they are way better than their Championship team. I predict right now they could have the lowest Score in Women’s CC history this fall! Back to back titles are coming and the margin of victory will be greater for the second title!
NM will also have a strong team, returning runners who this year are 32:55, 33:05, 33:09, 33:10 in 10K (16:02 or faster in 5K) plus a 9:32 steeplechaser. Perhaps not quite as strong as a team with 5-6 sub 15:40 but a very strong team. CO loses most of their top runners but no doubt will reload some. BYU? Not so sure there. Their strongest returner might not crack top 5 of NC State or NM.
I think the major headline in this NCState domination in the 5K is that they are the clear favorites in the fall to repeat as National Champs! Did everyone forget that Sydney Seymour was 4th in this race and she will be joining the Wolfpack in the fall? And now Starliper in one season after being injured for two years has already made Nationals…… she is not even close to the shape she will be in this fall?!?! And then if Chmiel has a good summer and comes back healthy…..lights out and give them the trophy now.
If this team stays healthy they are way better than their Championship team. I predict right now they could have the lowest Score in Women’s CC history this fall! Back to back titles are coming and the margin of victory will be greater for the second title!
Also shaw bush and quartzo all running very well... Plus other recruits... Anyone noticed that the East was way faster than the West... In both the 1500 and the 5K... All those big names from out west were running significantly slower...
Anyone see the East regionals live? How did tuohy and valby look afterwards? All out effort? Were they pretty winded or did they look like they weren't that tired?
the battle for the sixth and seventh spot on nc state's 7-man xc squad will be close, so many of them are running and having a breakthrough this year! making the main team is prob as hard as qualifying for the nationals lol
also who's beating them in the fall??? i don't think anyone can
Anyone see the East regionals live? How did tuohy and valby look afterwards? All out effort? Were they pretty winded or did they look like they weren't that tired?
katelyn finished (kinda same state after her acc 1500m, not exhausted... just standing) and she waited for her teammates, hugged and comforted a crying hannah steelman, picked up marlee starliper who was on the ground then hugged her, shook hands with valby then called everyone for a group hug
Anyone see the East regionals live? How did tuohy and valby look afterwards? All out effort? Were they pretty winded or did they look like they weren't that tired?
katelyn finished (kinda same state after her acc 1500m, not exhausted... just standing) and she waited for her teammates, hugged and comforted a crying hannah steelman, picked up marlee starliper who was on the ground then hugged her, shook hands with valby then called everyone for a group hug
How do you know that? Where did you get video of that?... Why was steelman crying? Anyway I heard tuohy was exhausted and had to be carried off the track and she kept yelling out Adrian... Yo Adrian... But I get a lot of bad info so that's why I'd rather get my fax checked
katelyn finished (kinda same state after her acc 1500m, not exhausted... just standing) and she waited for her teammates, hugged and comforted a crying hannah steelman, picked up marlee starliper who was on the ground then hugged her, shook hands with valby then called everyone for a group hug
How do you know that? Where did you get video of that?... Why was steelman crying? Anyway I heard tuohy was exhausted and had to be carried off the track and she kept yelling out Adrian... Yo Adrian... But I get a lot of bad info so that's why I'd rather get my fax checked
no adrian spotted track, slow people aint allowed, secrucity checks PRs .. he aint fast enough to be there.. FAX DOUBLED CHECKED.
if steelman and starliper was on heat 1 they would have not advanced to finals
katelyn knew their heat had to be a faster one so that her other teammates can get the small q incase they wont get to the top 5, katelyn paced the race perfectly against the times of heat 1, you could see her always checking the board, she did so well and pulled her teammates to pbs and sb, the race wasnt insanely fast nor slow, it was just right, it gradually became faster and she did not just left everyone, she paced it until the last 2 laps
hannah cried, marlee cried, savannah PRd, sam was able to redeem herself after a bad 1500m race, katelyn won the race and got the facility record, so much was able to achieved in one race, such an amazing team and great teamwork shown!
I think the major headline in this NCState domination in the 5K is that they are the clear favorites in the fall to repeat as National Champs! Did everyone forget that Sydney Seymour was 4th in this race and she will be joining the Wolfpack in the fall? And now Starliper in one season after being injured for two years has already made Nationals…… she is not even close to the shape she will be in this fall?!?! And then if Chmiel has a good summer and comes back healthy…..lights out and give them the trophy now.
If this team stays healthy they are way better than their Championship team. I predict right now they could have the lowest Score in Women’s CC history this fall! Back to back titles are coming and the margin of victory will be greater for the second title!
Also shaw bush and quartzo all running very well... Plus other recruits... Anyone noticed that the East was way faster than the West... In both the 1500 and the 5K... All those big names from out west were running significantly slower...
West were just classic tactical qualifiers, slow pace with stars closing hard to qualify. In the East the 'field' didn't cooperate with big PRS all over the place in 1500 (and steeple) forcing fast times. In 5k heat 1 was even quick w/ chelangat running track record. Basically, entire NC st xc team was in heat 2. Touhy paced it to ensure 7 qualifiers in heat 2 to get her teammates thru. By last third of race lead pack was down to 8, with doubling Bush in 8th. Kimeli, who was doing tough steeple/5k double fell off and remaining 7 cruised in to advance, including Tuohy, Steelman, Shaw, Starliper and Bush from NC St + Valby and Seymour.
Tuohy, a Sowinski like rabbit, nipped Chelangat's new track record and dragged along a pile of PRS behind her.
Sixth in the first heat was 16:04 - the second heat was virtually guaranteed seven qualifiers. (Kimeli was 19 second back of seventh place and still beat fourth from the first heat.)
NC State didn't need someone to push the pace - they just needed a race where they had five of the last seven to stay in the lead pack. The first heat was an evenly paced 9:28-9:29 at 3k and seventh was getting dropped. The second heat was an evenly paced 9:24-9:25 at 3K and the top seven had broken away. Maybe that was Tuohy carrying everyone by masterfully setting a pace half-a-second-per-lap faster -- or maybe NC State had five people who could run under 15:40, and that's why they had five people qualify. The first heat only had six people stay at 15:45 pace through 3k, and only two held on.
Compared to Tyynismaa, who was second in the first heat, Bush (the NC State runner who dropped from the lead pack first) was faster at 3k, then faster over then next 1200, and then faster for the last 800. Given how they ran, and how the other races went, there's no plausible argument that any of the five Wolfpack runners would not have qualified from either heat in either region.
I don't know. I am sometimes on the fence about her. The tactic of having Katelyn pace everyone yesterday was smart, but it would have worked equally well last year having Ellie pace her team mates to nationals. If she had, Katelyn likely would have qualified. I have wondered if she might have had a lapse in objectivity and let Katelyn fall because Katelyn might have gone to nationals and beaten Ellie. You can tell from interviews that Laurie Henes wanted that mother/daughter 5K champion narrative badly. Just a different perspective.
Katelyn seems to be the workhorse of this team. During the workout Wednesday segment, it was Katelyn forcing the pace when Sam Bush tried to slow down. Watching them all yesterday I had the feeling that they are all just super comfortable zoning out and tucking in behind Katelyn. Notice that they don't tend to run as well in races that she is not also in (thinking Sam Bush in the ACC 800 and then in the regional 1500). Bush even said in an interview that it was more fun in the ACC 5K because she had her team mates, but it was also easier because she had Katelyn. They have all reached a new level of running since Katelyn came back this past fall at 100% (super talents rising out of nowhere). That could be seen as a healthy team dynamic, but my suspicion lies in that Henes did not have her daughter Ellie play this role last year.
My concern about this is that Katelyn Touhy, although smart, seems like a "good girl" who readily follows the directions of those in charge. She has been described as super coachable a lot over the years, and in interviews she would often say things that seemed like she was parroting what her adults had told her. I hope she does not go into the final feeling obligated to take care of her team mates to the detriment of her own performance. She will have a lot to think about in that race, not the least of which is that her now fast enough team mates are going to also be gunning for her and have been trained to use her as their spring board to kicking time. The scenario that scares me, more than Nichols or Roe or Chalangnat, is that those 4 will work as a pack and take her down. I know that is a legit way the game is played, but if that happens I think it is worth examining the difference in approach when it is Katelyn leading versus Ellie. I also think that will really suck for her. This is just a different perspective based on podcasts and interviews and watching races over the past couple of years. I could be way off base, but I also know women, and all of the hearts and flowers of team love that they talk about kind of go out the window in 2 weeks. NC State has no chance of winning the team competition. This 5K is an individual race, and 5 competitive and talented girls are going for a win that they all want badly. Katelyn might be at a disadvantage here because they have been trained to use her. It will be those 4 versus her. She will be the one with no one to work off of.
I don't know. I am sometimes on the fence about her. The tactic of having Katelyn pace everyone yesterday was smart, but it would have worked equally well last year having Ellie pace her team mates to nationals. If she had, Katelyn likely would have qualified. I have wondered if she might have had a lapse in objectivity and let Katelyn fall because Katelyn might have gone to nationals and beaten Ellie. You can tell from interviews that Laurie Henes wanted that mother/daughter 5K champion narrative badly. Just a different perspective.
Katelyn seems to be the workhorse of this team. During the workout Wednesday segment, it was Katelyn forcing the pace when Sam Bush tried to slow down. Watching them all yesterday I had the feeling that they are all just super comfortable zoning out and tucking in behind Katelyn. Notice that they don't tend to run as well in races that she is not also in (thinking Sam Bush in the ACC 800 and then in the regional 1500). Bush even said in an interview that it was more fun in the ACC 5K because she had her team mates, but it was also easier because she had Katelyn. They have all reached a new level of running since Katelyn came back this past fall at 100% (super talents rising out of nowhere). That could be seen as a healthy team dynamic, but my suspicion lies in that Henes did not have her daughter Ellie play this role last year.
My concern about this is that Katelyn Touhy, although smart, seems like a "good girl" who readily follows the directions of those in charge. She has been described as super coachable a lot over the years, and in interviews she would often say things that seemed like she was parroting what her adults had told her. I hope she does not go into the final feeling obligated to take care of her team mates to the detriment of her own performance. She will have a lot to think about in that race, not the least of which is that her now fast enough team mates are going to also be gunning for her and have been trained to use her as their spring board to kicking time. The scenario that scares me, more than Nichols or Roe or Chalangnat, is that those 4 will work as a pack and take her down. I know that is a legit way the game is played, but if that happens I think it is worth examining the difference in approach when it is Katelyn leading versus Ellie. I also think that will really suck for her. This is just a different perspective based on podcasts and interviews and watching races over the past couple of years. I could be way off base, but I also know women, and all of the hearts and flowers of team love that they talk about kind of go out the window in 2 weeks. NC State has no chance of winning the team competition. This 5K is an individual race, and 5 competitive and talented girls are going for a win that they all want badly. Katelyn might be at a disadvantage here because they have been trained to use her. It will be those 4 versus her. She will be the one with no one to work off of.
There is no way Katelyn was beating Elly Henes a year ago. I do think her teammates this year are comfortable running with her leading (and setting a very even pace). I think part of Bush's problem in the 1500 is that she ended up in the very front - she runs best just hanging onto to someone and then kicking. In Eugene I think Tuohy will run her own race and the other 4 will (or should) work together at the same sort of 15:35ish pace. I would not expect Tuohy to try to lead until 3K at a minimum, maybe later depending on that pace. Roe as Astro noted seems the one likely to start going early if the pace is too slow. Covert, Chelangat and Gregory will all have a 10 K in their legs in Eugene while Tuohy, Nicholsm Roe, Valby and the other NC State 5K runners will not. Chelangat got a pass in that in East regional winning in over 34 minutes.
I don't know. I am sometimes on the fence about her. The tactic of having Katelyn pace everyone yesterday was smart, but it would have worked equally well last year having Ellie pace her team mates to nationals. If she had, Katelyn likely would have qualified. I have wondered if she might have had a lapse in objectivity and let Katelyn fall because Katelyn might have gone to nationals and beaten Ellie. You can tell from interviews that Laurie Henes wanted that mother/daughter 5K champion narrative badly. Just a different perspective.
Katelyn seems to be the workhorse of this team. During the workout Wednesday segment, it was Katelyn forcing the pace when Sam Bush tried to slow down. Watching them all yesterday I had the feeling that they are all just super comfortable zoning out and tucking in behind Katelyn. Notice that they don't tend to run as well in races that she is not also in (thinking Sam Bush in the ACC 800 and then in the regional 1500). Bush even said in an interview that it was more fun in the ACC 5K because she had her team mates, but it was also easier because she had Katelyn. They have all reached a new level of running since Katelyn came back this past fall at 100% (super talents rising out of nowhere). That could be seen as a healthy team dynamic, but my suspicion lies in that Henes did not have her daughter Ellie play this role last year.
My concern about this is that Katelyn Touhy, although smart, seems like a "good girl" who readily follows the directions of those in charge. She has been described as super coachable a lot over the years, and in interviews she would often say things that seemed like she was parroting what her adults had told her. I hope she does not go into the final feeling obligated to take care of her team mates to the detriment of her own performance. She will have a lot to think about in that race, not the least of which is that her now fast enough team mates are going to also be gunning for her and have been trained to use her as their spring board to kicking time. The scenario that scares me, more than Nichols or Roe or Chalangnat, is that those 4 will work as a pack and take her down. I know that is a legit way the game is played, but if that happens I think it is worth examining the difference in approach when it is Katelyn leading versus Ellie. I also think that will really suck for her. This is just a different perspective based on podcasts and interviews and watching races over the past couple of years. I could be way off base, but I also know women, and all of the hearts and flowers of team love that they talk about kind of go out the window in 2 weeks. NC State has no chance of winning the team competition. This 5K is an individual race, and 5 competitive and talented girls are going for a win that they all want badly. Katelyn might be at a disadvantage here because they have been trained to use her. It will be those 4 versus her. She will be the one with no one to work off of.
I agree with FastTuohy on the first part of this. Katelyn was no where near Elly’s level last year. I do think it was a mistake to have KT double in the 1500/5k at Regionals last year. Not sure the reasoning behind that. Then there were reports some of the team including her were sick and that compromised things even more. Hmmm…Even with her leading the nation in both events right now they didn’t try that again this year. I think it’s curious they had Bush double though. Obviously it worked out well for her given what happened in the 1500 yesterday but it is curious to me. Hmmmm…That said, Slo-Jo brings up an interesting point about competition within a team especially a women’s team. Sometimes it is all puppies and rainbows on the outside and the reality is more cutthroat. Now I’m not an insider of any kind, just your basic track fan, but my gut feeling is KT is pretty savvy and knows the deal whatever it may be (puppies/rainbows or piranhas LOL) but I really think she is on a different level than her teammates in the 5k and this won’t be an issue at all. There are competitors from other teams of course. It is not likely to be a kickers race in that scenario and even if that happens, who is to say KT isn’t the best kicker at this point? Worst case scenario? If it plays out real ugly as Slo-Jo describes then there is this option going forward: Transfer Portal. I don’t see it happening like that at all but if it did, teams would be lined up to bring her on board.
that was a great race for NC State. Valby also ran extremely well and held in decently. Very impressed with Starliper...that is a heck of a performance jump in a short amount of time. That girl is going to be a beast for them in XC.
Steelman and Bush did exceptional after doubling up events, and being disappointed in the first race. And Shaw looked solid the whole time.
Tuohy was extremely strong the whole time..it looked like Valby tried pushing for the lead a few times but was rejected. And when Tuohy decided to go, there was no doubt the field had no chance of hanging with her.
It would have been nice to see the end of the race to see what condition the runners were in.
I disagree that Tuohy will let the final race start any slower than this race, and may push the pace slightly faster...she does not need to lead, but there is no reason for her to let other runners hang around. She has a strong engine and an improved kick...I would expect her to make a strong surge with around the 1500m mark,
Going after her first National Title after 2 very close Indoor silvers, I would not expect KT to leave anything to chance.
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