NXN was the greatest experience of my coaching and athletic career, bar none.
That is so pathetic. Even North Koreans have more expectations out of life than you do. You need to join the Israeli Army so you can shoot Muslims in the back without fear of prosecution. Or how object injecting heroin.
Nah, what's pathetic is your attempt to draw me out. 0/10
HS xc dad wrote:
And you think xc is not an individual sport.
Have you had a lot of college recruiters coming knocking to recruit your whole team?
Wow, your logic is, um, amazing here. By your standard of logic, football must be regarded as an individual sport until college coaches start recruiting entire high school football teams.
I get it that your son did well. But as a high school coach, I have a pretty good hunch from reading between the lines of your e-mail the team didn't do so well. And Mr. Personality out front just might have had something to do with that?
By the way, I've never had a college coach who wanted to recruit my entire team, but I do have four members of last year's team who are ran varsity on four different Division I programs this fall. Surprise, it is about team!
i think it's obvious coaches like NXN because they get a paid trip out of it. Ask kids that went to FL and NXN and see which they enjoyed more. It's overwhelmingly FL. Both are good at what they do, but NXN is a team race and FL is for the cream of the crop.
road rashed wrote:
i think it's obvious coaches like NXN because they get a paid trip out of it. Ask kids that went to FL and NXN and see which they enjoyed more. It's overwhelmingly FL. Both are good at what they do, but NXN is a team race and FL is for the cream of the crop.
You are very wrong.
The kids who have gone to FL as individuals and NXN with their teams enjoyed NXN much more. Who wouldn't want to share that experience with their friends and teammates? (oh yea, xc dad's kid wouldn't)
hot tub time machine wrote:
HIstory wrote:Didn't read many replies in this thread. If i was a kid back in HS again i would compete at FL. It has all the history and tradition. It would be a great feeling winning it(which is great enough0 but to think of all the great ones that won FL before you.
You sound like my dad. He still buys the newspaper. Things change with time.
An some good things get ruined. Not every change is for the better. This would be ruining a good thing.
Long Live Both
Neither is what it could be...
NXN, butted in..it can only be of interest to coaches ands participants..it's too confusing for anyone else to follow.
The concept of Footlocker was simple and the gathering of the nations best was GREAT for even a marginal fan to watch.
Dilution for both.
HS xc dad wrote:
No one is talking about recruiting asshole prima dona kids. I'm just saying that individual performance is a big deal, whether you are blessed by running with Arcadia or stuck in Podunk USA where everyone else plays football.
Asshole prima donna kids are the best recruits. One Prefontaine or Galen Rupp can make a program for decades. "Team players" should be your disposable walk ons.
Sounds to me like a "beta vs VHS" type of thing. The team concept of NXN (even with individuals involved) is more interesting for the coachs (they get to go as do less "elite" team athletes) and Nike is prepared to foot the bill for this size field (as opposed to the 40 at FLN). I suspect that this, along with coaches discouraging athletes to go to FLN Regional meets, will win the day eventually, rather than the complaining (that has taken umteen pages so far) that one is inherently better than the other, and so FL will become watered down and become less attractive to prospective participants.
For a while I also suspect that there is still a choice, for those who don't qualify for one or the other, which athletes will want to be a part of - they care less about it being elite than the coaches and outsiders as they just want the trip and the experience. That is what it really should be about afterall - the experience.
The notion of being champion (in a made up fantasy really, as not all the best kids even try out - look at the national team XC qualifying meet in Feb to see that born out) is only important to a few athletes (who have a shot at it) and the idiots who frequent this site. No wonder so many kids quit the sport (burned-out)when I see the pressure applied by ill-informed or overly zealous parents, coaches, etc. in situations like with these two meets.
It seems that most h.s. teams out there will have only one runner at any particular time that can qualify for FLN or even be in contention in a regional race. How many times has a team had more than one runner qualify in the same race.
The sport is made up of individuals that train together. They race at different paces, due to many factors. Will the team's number 1 runner run in the pack to pull their nos. 4 and 5 runners? Doubtful.
My kids get recruited all the time and no they don't ask about the team- neither do they ask about the team when they recruit football players, basketball players, etc.
A football player stands out as an individual just like some runners do.
But, get this- I had my #7 girl get a 66% scholarship a few years ago. The coach noticed her because her TEAM went to states 2 years in a row and was ranked in the top 5 in the state even when they werent section champs.
Believe me (and I speak from experience) any college coaches going to FL and Nike are going to see kids theyve already contacted- no surprizes.
Look at the athletes at each- many full rides at both races.
Thanks, I also have coaches ask about the sacrifices a runner would make for the team. I guess that "dad" doesnt have a lot of experience at this sort of thing.
Ive had 8 girls in the last 6 years get money and one more is about to. The college is always interested in their team work.
No, thats not it at all. The main point is that XC IS a team sport. The beauty of it is that it doesn't have to be. One kid can be a "team".
Believe me, your son would have loved the experience of leading one of my teams to the state championships. He would have had a group of guys pushing him to improve and to compete hard for the team and for himself. If he had a bad race, they would stand by him and tell him that the team is there for him.
I individualize the training, especially for the better runners. I would try to find the best program for you, to maximize your potential, to improve the team.
I had 40 boys this season and there were 6-9 training groups depending on the day. They all had specific target times that suited thier ability and age. On race day they supported each other AS A TEAM.
runn wrote:
If he had a bad race, they would stand by him and tell him that the team is there for him.
That's why they support him going to the Footlocker Nationals.
Yes they would. But if the team had a shot at making Nationals hed be there with them.
OK, I had a girl state champ in 11th grade- went to states as an individual.
In 12th grade her team went to states, she did not win states as a senior. She said she enjoyed the team experience more AND she got a full ride and is now in grad school.
4 other girls on that team got college money.
Corporate-wise Footlocker and Nike benefit from each other staging all expenses paid sales/marketing camps for high school runners and high school coaches. All businesses must advertise to stay in business. I think both marketing shows should remain separate and distinct, one for oriented towards the best HS Xc kids, the other focused on the best HS Xc coaches. The worst thing you can do in business is promote the same campaign as someome else is. You lose the punch, the edge, since the message has already been heard. Footlocker and Nike must have separate sales campaigns.
runn wrote:
Yes they would. But if the team had a shot at making Nationals hed be there with them.
OK, I had a girl state champ in 11th grade- went to states as an individual.
In 12th grade her team went to states, she did not win states as a senior. She said she enjoyed the team experience more AND she got a full ride and is now in grad school.
4 other girls on that team got college money.
Gee im sure she didnt get the money because she was also the state champ before... Plus it depends where she got the ride to. If its liek stanford or a good college(which it wasnt) then I could see, but girls have a lot more scholarship opprotunity aswell.
helping you out wrote:
HS xc dad wrote:And you think xc is not an individual sport.
Have you had a lot of college recruiters coming knocking to recruit your whole team?
Wow, your logic is, um, amazing here. By your standard of logic, football must be regarded as an individual sport until college coaches start recruiting entire high school football teams.
I get it that your son did well. But as a high school coach, I have a pretty good hunch from reading between the lines of your e-mail the team didn't do so well. And Mr. Personality out front just might have had something to do with that?
By the way, I've never had a college coach who wanted to recruit my entire team, but I do have four members of last year's team who are ran varsity on four different Division I programs this fall. Surprise, it is about team!
Wow, your logic is, um, retared here. Football and xc are nothing alike. You can get 5 runners from around the world and form a kickass team. Its harder to do with a team sport because you need to know your teammates and what they will do. In running you just run, its a simple sport, dont overthink it.
And my school's football team sucked ass, but our runnign back was the 2nd best i nthe state and got a scholarship. So yeah.
Rebuttal to point 2: Oh yeah, his son ruined the team? There are teams that dont give a shit at all! My team would be even worse without me attempting to motivate them or push them.
Suprise, they went to crap schools, or your entire team was good. And just ran varsity doesnt mean they even got a scholarship.
It can't be a team sport. I can't try to be the best I can while toting 18-19 minute kids as our 5,6,7. I cant workout with them and expect to get good. I'm screwed if I do.