The East African dominance started at the ‘87 WCs when Rosa provided Kenya with a flotilla of athletes loaded on EPO. Things really took off at the ‘88 Games. It’s taken decades for other runners to start to catch up via improved training methods and slighly better testing.
The East African dominance started at the ‘87 WCs when Rosa provided Kenya with a flotilla of athletes loaded on EPO. Things really took off at the ‘88 Games. It’s taken decades for other runners to start to catch up via improved training methods and slighly better testing.
You're about 5 yrs early it was more like 92
No. He’s correct. Look at the results. Rhe change was so abrupt as to be jarring.
No. He’s correct. Look at the results. Rhe change was so abrupt as to be jarring.
I remember the big change at the’87 Worlds and in ‘88 it really took hold. I had a sense a lot of it was artificial. Later on more info became available anout Rosa, Hermens, and other charlatans.
No. He’s correct. Look at the results. Rhe change was so abrupt as to be jarring.
Rosa didn't come to Kenya until 1991.
But as far as world distance domination, it was 6 years earlier, in 1981 that the East African nations of Ethiopia and Kenya started dominating World Cross Country.
No. He’s correct. Look at the results. Rhe change was so abrupt as to be jarring.
Rosa didn't come to Kenya until 1991.
But as far as world distance domination, it was 6 years earlier, in 1981 that the East African nations of Ethiopia and Kenya started dominating World Cross Country.
EPO was also most likely used prior to this by Seb Coe, Steve Ovett in the late 70s to mid 80s. While not yet easily available in synthetic form, labs like the Loughborough sports lab were able fo purify if. The researchers at Loughborough all had papers on EPO ....
East Africa only caught up a few years later once the synthetization of EPO made it available to the masses.
We may be witnessing something similar here, although it will be a much shorter cycle. I'd say most will be on the new drug this year, or it will be banned within 2 years.
But as far as world distance domination, it was 6 years earlier, in 1981 that the East African nations of Ethiopia and Kenya started dominating World Cross Country.
EPO was also most likely used prior to this by Seb Coe, Steve Ovett in the late 70s to mid 80s. While not yet easily available in synthetic form, labs like the Loughborough sports lab were able fo purify if. The researchers at Loughborough all had papers on EPO ....
East Africa only caught up a few years later once the synthetization of EPO made it available to the masses.
We may be witnessing something similar here, although it will be a much shorter cycle. I'd say most will be on the new drug this year, or it will be banned within 2 years.
Oh dear.
I'm sure the most likely scenario is that Coe and Ovett were taking EPO in the '70s, but just the same, do you have any reliable sources for anything in your post?
EPO was also most likely used prior to this by Seb Coe, Steve Ovett in the late 70s to mid 80s. While not yet easily available in synthetic form, labs like the Loughborough sports lab were able fo purify if. The researchers at Loughborough all had papers on EPO ....
East Africa only caught up a few years later once the synthetization of EPO made it available to the masses.
We may be witnessing something similar here, although it will be a much shorter cycle. I'd say most will be on the new drug this year, or it will be banned within 2 years.
Oh dear.
I'm sure the most likely scenario is that Coe and Ovett were taking EPO in the '70s, but just the same, do you have any reliable sources for anything in your post?
The proofs and claims are identical to the ones on East Africa taking EPO in the 1990s....
I'm sure the most likely scenario is that Coe and Ovett were taking EPO in the '70s, but just the same, do you have any reliable sources for anything in your post?
The proofs and claims are identical to the ones on East Africa taking EPO in the 1990s....
By "identical", do you mean "none"? I didn't ask for "proof", but "reliable sources". Testimony from insiders? From whistleblowing athletes or coaches or agents themselves? From disgruntled former employees or frustrated anti-doping personnel?
While there are many claims, there seem to be no proofs/reliable sources that East Africans were taking EPO in the 1990s, nor that Rosa was giving any athletes EPO, nor that these altitude inhabitants would be high responders to EPO, (say compared to sea-level athletes), nor that at least some sea-level Americans and Europeans wouldn't also be taking EPO in the 1990s, like their compatriots in cycling during the same timeframe.
I recall seeing leaked IAAF blood data reporting for the years 2001-2012, the largest dataset of its kind, with East African blood doping suspicion below the worldwide average across the whole period in question.
The proofs and claims are identical to the ones on East Africa taking EPO in the 1990s....
By "identical", do you mean "none"? I didn't ask for "proof", but "reliable sources". Testimony from insiders? From whistleblowing athletes or coaches or agents themselves? From disgruntled former employees or frustrated anti-doping personnel?
While there are many claims, there seem to be no proofs/reliable sources that East Africans were taking EPO in the 1990s, nor that Rosa was giving any athletes EPO, nor that these altitude inhabitants would be high responders to EPO, (say compared to sea-level athletes), nor that at least some sea-level Americans and Europeans wouldn't also be taking EPO in the 1990s, like their compatriots in cycling during the same timeframe.
I recall seeing leaked IAAF blood data reporting for the years 2001-2012, the largest dataset of its kind, with East African blood doping suspicion below the worldwide average across the whole period in question.
No. He’s correct. Look at the results. Rhe change was so abrupt as to be jarring.
I remember the big change at the’87 Worlds and in ‘88 it really took hold. I had a sense a lot of it was artificial. Later on more info became available anout Rosa, Hermens, and other charlatans.
You've got it all wrong !
Kenya did well in the late 1960s and early 1970s.
Europeans dominated the 1970s and 1980s because blood doping was legal. Blood doping was banned by the IOC in 1985 and soon thereafter by IAAF. So the performance of European teams like Great Britain, Italy, Finland etc. started to suffer while Kenya and Ethiopia emerged from the shadows.
1n 1987, the womens category was thorughly dominated by European teams that had state sponsored doping
Kenya did well in 1988 only on the men's side. The womens categroy was still dominated by state sponsored doping programs.
he first recombinant human EPO (rHuEPO) was approved for medical use in the US in 1989.
Thats when Kenya started to perform poorly again while Europe emerged. Morocco became stellar. Kenya performed rather poorly during the EPO era (1992 until 2004). While Europeans who never ran on the European circuit would emerge out of nowhere and win big races. I am talking the likes of Nils Schumman, Vejborn Rodal, Andre Bucher, Borzakovsky et al. All EPO freaks.
A test for EPO was formulated in around 2005. That was when European performances started to suffer again and Kenya emerged from its slump to win many medals at the 2008 Olympics after performing poorly in 2004. To put it plainly, when everyone gets tested , Kenya does well. When there is a new drug available for which there is no test, Europeans and North Americans do well using this new drug.
There is a new drug now enabling Americans, Germans , Norwegians etc to do well. Thats why they are coming out of nowhere and running fantastic times. Once this new drug is banned or a test is formulated, I expect Europeans and North Americans to start running poorly again.
Kenya is always behind the curveball when it comes to using the latest doping techniques. There are no innovative dope technicians like Salazar.
I remember the big change at the’87 Worlds and in ‘88 it really took hold. I had a sense a lot of it was artificial. Later on more info became available anout Rosa, Hermens, and other charlatans.
You've got it all wrong !
Kenya did well in the late 1960s and early 1970s.
Europeans dominated the 1970s and 1980s because blood doping was legal. Blood doping was banned by the IOC in 1985 and soon thereafter by IAAF. So the performance of European teams like Great Britain, Italy, Finland etc. started to suffer while Kenya and Ethiopia emerged from the shadows.
1n 1987, the womens category was thorughly dominated by European teams that had state sponsored doping
Kenya did well in 1988 only on the men's side. The womens categroy was still dominated by state sponsored doping programs.
he first recombinant human EPO (rHuEPO) was approved for medical use in the US in 1989.
Thats when Kenya started to perform poorly again while Europe emerged. Morocco became stellar. Kenya performed rather poorly during the EPO era (1992 until 2004). While Europeans who never ran on the European circuit would emerge out of nowhere and win big races. I am talking the likes of Nils Schumman, Vejborn Rodal, Andre Bucher, Borzakovsky et al. All EPO freaks.
A test for EPO was formulated in around 2005. That was when European performances started to suffer again and Kenya emerged from its slump to win many medals at the 2008 Olympics after performing poorly in 2004. To put it plainly, when everyone gets tested , Kenya does well. When there is a new drug available for which there is no test, Europeans and North Americans do well using this new drug.
There is a new drug now enabling Americans, Germans , Norwegians etc to do well. Thats why they are coming out of nowhere and running fantastic times. Once this new drug is banned or a test is formulated, I expect Europeans and North Americans to start running poorly again.
Kenya is always behind the curveball when it comes to using the latest doping techniques. There are no innovative dope technicians like Salazar.