Russian Skater caught with PEDs STILL allowed to compete.

Bound4Glory wrote:

Great great great wrote:

Link:cdn.dmcl.biz/media/file/232349/OG_22_0...

This is the CAS decision.

My takes are.

Here are some key items:

1: A single use of this drug would result in concentrations in the range: 966 ng/ml –9000 ng/ml.

2: The amount detected in her sample was 2 ng/ml: about 500 to 5000 times lower than what would be expected if she ingested a full dose.

3: That amount (2 ng/ml) is well below the technical limit of detection, which is 10 ng/ml.  [Wait, what?  Why did they even consider this a positive result?]

4: Based on 3, RUSADA disputes the positive result and it may be a technical mistake by the laboratory.  They requested the B-sample also be tested.

5: In order to derive any benefit from this drug, it must be ingested on a regular basis.

6: Kamila was tested multiple times before and after December and all tests were negative.

7. TMZ is forbidden for use in children and produces side effects like dizziness, which would be counter-productive in a sport like figure skating.

pupil3142 wrote:

199. Here, it was obvious to the Panel that under the relevant provisions of the WADC
2021 dealing with the notion of Fault, it is not just possible but likely that Protected
Persons will receive anti-doping sanctions at the level of a reprimand or at the
bottom end (a few months) of the 0 to 2 years possible, principally because of
their lack of legal capacity and their youth and immaturity. See generally WADC
2021 Definitions: Fault, No Significant Fault or Negligence, and No Fault or
Negligence; WADC 2021 Articles 10.3.1, 10.6.3.1. The Panel does not make any
findings in this regard; that is to be done by the usual anti-doping results
management process given the very narrow remit of this Panel and what it was
called upon to consider. Having said that, it is clear that even if that process finds
a doping rule violation, the ability to show intention or fault of a minor athlete such
as this one might be difficult, and, lacking that intention or fault, the sanction is
likely to be on the low end of the range. Strict application of the rules as written
for Provisional Suspensions would almost certainly in every case involving a
Protected Minor result in a Provisional Suspension longer than the likely period
of actual suspension. This is not satisfactory from a legal point of view.

My emphasis.
This seems all there is to say at this point.

In the future;

2ng/mL is claimed to be under the detection limit of 10ng/mL. This is surely a factual item. If true then imho she is scot free.

The defence she is able to test is 'contaminated product'. This is different from snogging your grandfather, but that may be alleviated / replaced by the time factor.

The lab is an absolute disgrace. I send stuff to labs all over the world all the time. I dont do business with labs unless i get the report back within 5 working days of receipt of samples. every substance has a known standard, agreed test, and published detection level (and acceptance level). we did expect labs to have problems during covid. to our surprise, none did. there is constant communication between me and my single point of contact at the labs throughout the process. Me; sending and customs; them; customs, receipt, working - report.

Finally; endemic is used to specify that something is limited to that sphere. Therefore ped may be endemic to sport (almost by definition), but is certainly not endemic to russia since it exists outside russian sport. armstrongfails, but i bet he keeps digging.....

pupil3142 wrote:

Bound4Glory wrote:

Here are some key items:

1: A single use of this drug would result in concentrations in the range: 966 ng/ml –9000 ng/ml.

2: The amount detected in her sample was 2 ng/ml: about 500 to 5000 times lower than what would be expected if she ingested a full dose.

3: That amount (2 ng/ml) is well below the technical limit of detection, which is 10 ng/ml. [Wait, what? Why did they even consider this a positive result?]

4: Based on 3, RUSADA disputes the positive result and it may be a technical mistake by the laboratory. They requested the B-sample also be tested.

5: In order to derive any benefit from this drug, it must be ingested on a regular basis.

6: Kamila was tested multiple times before and after December and all tests were negative.

7. TMZ is forbidden for use in children and produces side effects like dizziness, which would be counter-productive in a sport like figure skating.

you are quoting out of context the points made by kamila's friends.

These points were not examined or rebutted and therefore have no standing at this point of time other then 'he said'.

HOWEVER - ouch. 1 and 2 are irrelevant. you have deliberately omitted that the guy admitted that 2ng/ml would be expected after about 5 days of stopping.

3 is very interesting and is a game changer. i find it very hard to beleive - its like knoxs dna.

4. agree, if true.

5 both sides will find doctors to say whatever they want.

6 irrelevant. la lost that excuse.

7 - see 5.

Great great great wrote:

pupil3142 wrote:

199. Here, it was obvious to the Panel that under the relevant provisions of the WADC
2021 dealing with the notion of Fault, it is not just possible but likely that Protected
Persons will receive anti-doping sanctions at the level of a reprimand or at the
bottom end (a few months) of the 0 to 2 years possible, principally because of
their lack of legal capacity and their youth and immaturity. See generally WADC
2021 Definitions: Fault, No Significant Fault or Negligence, and No Fault or
Negligence; WADC 2021 Articles 10.3.1, 10.6.3.1. The Panel does not make any
findings in this regard; that is to be done by the usual anti-doping results
management process given the very narrow remit of this Panel and what it was
called upon to consider. Having said that, it is clear that even if that process finds
a doping rule violation, the ability to show intention or fault of a minor athlete such
as this one might be difficult, and, lacking that intention or fault, the sanction is
likely to be on the low end of the range. Strict application of the rules as written
for Provisional Suspensions would almost certainly in every case involving a
Protected Minor result in a Provisional Suspension longer than the likely period
of actual suspension. This is not satisfactory from a legal point of view.

My emphasis.
This seems all there is to say at this point.

In the future;

2ng/mL is claimed to be under the detection limit of 10ng/mL. This is surely a factual item. If true then imho she is scot free.

The defence she is able to test is 'contaminated product'. This is different from snogging your grandfather, but that may be alleviated / replaced by the time factor.

The lab is an absolute disgrace. I send stuff to labs all over the world all the time. I dont do business with labs unless i get the report back within 5 working days of receipt of samples. every substance has a known standard, agreed test, and published detection level (and acceptance level). we did expect labs to have problems during covid. to our surprise, none did. there is constant communication between me and my single point of contact at the labs throughout the process. Me; sending and customs; them; customs, receipt, working - report.

Finally; endemic is used to specify that something is limited to that sphere. Therefore ped may be endemic to sport (almost by definition), but is certainly not endemic to russia since it exists outside russian sport. armstrongfails, but i bet he keeps digging.....

Where is the detail that supports the view that the reported concentration was below the detection limit; please.

Agree re explanation of “endemic”.Await an apology from Armstrong.

pupil3142 wrote:

199. Here, it was obvious to the Panel that under the relevant provisions of the WADC
2021 dealing with the notion of Fault, it is not just possible but likely that Protected
Persons will receive anti-doping sanctions at the level of a reprimand or at the
bottom end (a few months) of the 0 to 2 years possible, principally because of
their lack of legal capacity and their youth and immaturity. See generally WADC
2021 Definitions: Fault, No Significant Fault or Negligence, and No Fault or
Negligence; WADC 2021 Articles 10.3.1, 10.6.3.1. The Panel does not make any
findings in this regard; that is to be done by the usual anti-doping results
management process given the very narrow remit of this Panel and what it was
called upon to consider. Having said that, it is clear that even if that process finds
a doping rule violation, the ability to show intention or fault of a minor athlete such
as this one might be difficult, and, lacking that intention or fault, the sanction is
likely to be on the low end of the range. Strict application of the rules as written
for Provisional Suspensions would almost certainly in every case involving a
Protected Minor result in a Provisional Suspension longer than the likely period
of actual suspension. This is not satisfactory from a legal point of view.

My emphasis.
This seems all there is to say at this point.

In the future;

2ng/mL is claimed to be under the detection limit of 10ng/mL. This is surely a factual item. If true then imho she is scot free.

The defence she is able to test is 'contaminated product'. This is different from snogging your grandfather, but that may be alleviated / replaced by the time factor.

The lab is an absolute disgrace. I send stuff to labs all over the world all the time. I dont do business with labs unless i get the report back within 5 working days of receipt of samples. every substance has a known standard, agreed test, and published detection level (and acceptance level). we did expect labs to have problems during covid. to our surprise, none did. there is constant communication between me and my single point of contact at the labs throughout the process. Me; sending and customs; them; customs, receipt, working - report.

Finally; endemic is used to specify that something is limited to that sphere. Therefore ped may be endemic to sport (almost by definition), but is certainly not endemic to russia since it exists outside russian sport. armstrongfails, but i bet he keeps digging.....