Keira D'amato is Suspicious

rekrunner wrote:

Lenny Leonard wrote:

Some of you really don’t understand how training for and racing the marathon works.

This is an understatement. Many here are using performance improvement as a basis for suspicion of doping, without understanding how, or even if, doping and elite marathon performance are related.

Likewise, many here are ignoring her suspicious performance improvement because she looks like them. Did you really say ‘… if, doping and elite marathon performance are related?’ Are you new here?

Lol, that wasn't a 10 minute drop from her personal best. She ran a 2:22 in December of 2020. It was a 3 minute drop in her pr. That is not unheard of. Also, not everyone has the best race on any given day. Chicago was extremely warm this year. If you follow Keira's races, you'll see that she thrives in time trial type races where she runs alone. Houston was similar, as she really wasn't challenged after 15k. And please tell me you follow her on strava so you can see the quality of work she does. Nobody here would be able to match that. Why can't we just assume people are clean? 95% of runners are, yet when a less famous runner does well, we question it. If Sara Hall set the American record in the Marathon, there wouldn't be this discussion and you know it.

Marathon training isn't magic. You think everyone who has run 2:34 marathon just stays in that shape until they run a faster time? When you say things like "she dropped 12 minutes," you are showing that you are ignorant about how training works. It's not like she was in 2:34 shape on 12/19/2020 and ten got 12 minutes faster on 12/20/2020. She got a minute or so better every couple of weeks. Fitness is progressive, not something that happens "magically."

What do you think about her half marathon progression?

8/24/19 Patrick Henry HM - 1:15:49 - age 34

9/15/19 Rock 'n' Roll HM (Philadelphia) - 1:13:30 - age 34

1/19/20 Houston HM - 1:10:01 - age 35

10/28/20 Michigan Pro HM - 1:08:57 - age 36

12/5/21 Mortgage Network HM - 1:07:55 - age 37

That is a very believable progression for someone with her current PRs. When you look at those at data points along with her marathons, it is not anything to be suspicious of.

Once you stop looking at marathon training as "magic," which so many people with no knowledge of training do, it gets easier to understand.

Can we ask wejo... could he personally have improved from being tier 2:18 (with a half marathon of 1:05) to being a 2:08 marathoner at the age of 36? Essentially this is what you're saying.... And , no less, after being out of the sport for nearly a decade and having kids....

Let's be real - During a total period of marathoning for 7 years the last 3.5 of which were geared around an absolute peak in ability & making the olympic team . the times produced were of the 2:40s - mid 2:30s... Was absolutely nowhere near sub 2:30.... And tduring a period where she was working as hard as she possibly could trying to make the trials and that oly team.... Absolutely No evidence of being sub 2:30. Yet suddenly in only 1 year- the body adapted and learned how to perform at world class elite levels 2:22. Doesn't work that way unless you are seeking chemical assistance. SORRY, not sorry, but sorry.

Somebody who couldn't competitively beat anybody (See results Grandmas, Berlin, Oly Trials in the 3.5 years approaching the Tokyo games) now is running times that will win pretty much any marathon major on any given day.... - she couldn't hang with the best but now has found the SECRET to crushing them at age 37! So is she suddenly working much much harder than she was in 2018/19? What drastic change to her training led to this apparent breakthrough?

If there were 2:22 caliber talent never mind 2:19, wouldn't that have presented itself somewhere... Somewhere? This is the Best Story since Ben Johnson... Doesn't mean that Carl wasn't on Steroids either - Just means its pretty obvious what's going on here.

Shows what little you know about speed.... If you run halves in 1:15 & 1:13, you think you're suddenly gonna develop wheels for sub 1:10 perfomances... Not unless...

SpeedQuest wrote:

So is she suddenly working much much harder than she was in 2018/19?

Yes. Now you're getting it.

SpeedQuest wrote:

What drastic change to her training led to this apparent breakthrough?

She literally posts all of her runs on Strava.

SpeedQuest wrote:

Shows what little you know about speed.... If you run halves in 1:15 & 1:13, you think you're suddenly gonna develop wheels for sub 1:10 perfomances... Not unless...

That half marathon progression...

I could see it from a solid D3 college runner (male) who slacked off for a few months, ran 3 days per week and jumped in to a half marathon. Then trained seriously for a year or two and and ran under 1:10.

The hard part is that 16:00+ college 5k runners don't generally become 1:07-1:08 half marathoners.

So you're telling me she only started training hard in the last year and a half which is responsible for the change.... that's absolute laughable! Turn-around time in performance wouldn't drop that drastically in that amount of time and you couldn't increase the work load necessary without fatigue unless you were using...

And if you are that naive - first to believe that her prep for the games wasn't "hard" or "of quality" and that she just turned it on like a switch in the last year - that's rediculous... second if you think at 35, 36, 37 you're going to learn how to find the speed to run 1:07xx when you couldn't come close to breaking 1:10 - that's rediculous... third if you think that it's reasonable to basically carry that half-marathon speed directly to the full marathon and that's not suspicious - that's just rediculous....

Clearly you didn't race and don't know anything about speed. That's blatantly Phys. of Ex. Drug Logic!

Whatever it is about, who has done enough to show that doping can produce a rate of progression, or a peak level of performance, in the marathon that is not possible without doping?

I'm not seeing it either. Her Jump at her age is super suspect and her marks at lesser distances do not indicate she can run this time at all.

Her Thon PR is faster then her 1/2 thon on basically the same course. NO WAY

Cus D'amato wrote:

I'm not seeing it either. Her Jump at her age is super suspect and her marks at lesser distances do not indicate she can run this time at all.

Her Thon PR is faster then her 1/2 thon on basically the same course. NO WAY

Her FULL MARATHON pace of 5:19 per mile is only 7 seconds per mile slower than her 10K PR. Her 10K PR if from early 2021 too at 32:16! That's literally not possible. Daniels' running formula equates her 32:16 10K to a 2:28:59 full marathon, and I think we would all agree that that should be about where her ceiling is at.

Cus D'amato wrote:

I'm not seeing it either. Her Jump at her age is super suspect and her marks at lesser distances do not indicate she can run this time at all.

Her Thon PR is faster then her 1/2 thon on basically the same course. NO WAY

She ran a 24:47 8K in November which is in the ballpark.

conversion calculator wrote:

Cus D'amato wrote:

I'm not seeing it either. Her Jump at her age is super suspect and her marks at lesser distances do not indicate she can run this time at all.

Her Thon PR is faster then her 1/2 thon on basically the same course. NO WAY

She ran a 24:47 8K in November which is in the ballpark.

For comparison, Deena set U.S. 8K road record of 24:36 in 2005. Not arguing that Keira is clean though.

I’m just as suspicious as anyone, but here’s my marathon progression:

CIM - 26y/o: 3:20 - trained hard but stupidly, 2:55 pace till mile 20 and bonked

Miami Marathon - 33y/o: 3:25 - didn’t train much

Jacksonville Marathon - 35y.o: 3:07 - trained really hard and smarter but bonked at mile 20

Rotterdam Marathon - 37y/o: 3:08 - trained really hard, but still bonked at mile 20

Valencia Marathon - 46y/o: 2:57 - trained really hard and really smart, lost weight, wore Vaporflys, didn’t bonk

Key takeaways:

- weight loss is a big factor (I lost 10 lbs for my Valencia marathon)

- the shoes

- a lot of people train really stupid for marathons (like me) when they’re not professionally coached

- not saying she’s innocent… any 2:19 women’s marathoner is suspect… but big improvement when you go from stupid training and bad dieting wearing bad shoes to smart training, good dieting and super shoes.

Lenny Leonard wrote:

SpeedQuest wrote:

So is she suddenly working much much harder than she was in 2018/19?

Yes. Now you're getting it.

SpeedQuest wrote:

What drastic change to her training led to this apparent breakthrough?

She literally posts all of her runs on Strava.

Suddenly working much harder is enabled by doping. Totally a red flag.

You're really asking who has shown that doping produces superior performances. The jury is out in that one because there is nothing conclusive. If we don't have the data it doesn't exist.

Tell anti-doping that. And the 1 in 2 championship athletes who are using. It obviously helps everyone except marathon runners.

Would you all listen to yourselves?

If someone DOESN'T work hard enough, and gets faster: doping.

If they DO work hard enough, and get faster: doping.

Sheesh.

So tell me what shady about her coach's history

Multiple post have made references to Sott Raczko working with Salazar. I'm pretty sure that never happen.