Jakob and Filip to run 800m on tuesday june 30th

He never said his goal was just to make the Olympic finals. Stop putting words in his mouth. Good job comparing him to three 800/1500 guys too. It would be ridiculous if guys like Lewandowski and Mahkloufi had better 800m PRs, it’s not like they competitively ran that event at the Olympic level for years.

800m time does not correlate to finishing speed. Centrowitz for example has an 800m pr of 1:44 mid, Nick Willis is 1:45 high. Nowhere near the three athletes you mentioned, yet they’ve been extremely successful.

Finishing speed is all about how much you’ve tapped into your anaerobic system before you start kicking, and positioning as well. Look at Doha 1500 again and you will see Jakob doesn’t make his move, gets boxed in. And is stuck behind Mahkloufi and Lewandowski. His speed is matching both of those two +Jake wightman. Josh Kerr is moving backwards compared to him. Just because he doesn’t have a great 800m PR doesn’t mean he can’t medal at world champs/Olympics. He is inexperienced with racing and we’ve seen it many times over last year (him passing cheruiyot at Monaco, all the tripping going on in the 5k final, his going too early in the 5k). He still has much to learn tactically and will be able to contend for medals.

off and defense wrote:

This was 1 race. I looked at the NCAA last year to find a 1:46 guy about Jakob's age. Michael Rhoads ran 1:46. He ran the 800 a total of 14 times and ran as slow as 1:51.98. He was over 1:50 a total of 4 times during that season. So he varied about 5 seconds during those 14 races to get 1 at the time that Jakob ran his first time out. I think it is safe to assume that this was an sverage race for Jakob which means he could go 2.5 seconds faster on a good day and 2.5 seconds slower on a bad day. I would give him 1:43.9 as a possibility.

1.43.9? Nope. With 800m specific work (which would compromise his 5000m and probably his 1500m because this is dictated at all times by his 5000m ability) he runs maybe 1.44.7 - but honestly more likely is something like 1.44.9 and this is at his absolute peak.

Now I should follow up with my previous posting. That 1:46 is more of a time trial to test speed. This wasn’t after months of racing 400-600-800, which would lead to different results. I could see as fast as 1:43 THIS YEAR with specific speed work! Of course they have excellent training and excellent training partners with themselves. I hope they are enjoying the family training process and their parents hopefully enjoy watching their world class sons(and are proud of them)!

Alan Webb ran 1:43 and they have his type of strength.

ex-runner wrote:

Coevett expects 1:42

Everyone else expects 1:45

The only prediction I made in this thread is mid 1:44 to mid 1:45. Myself being obliged to be optimistic as the designated champion of Jakob here. If for some reason he chose to race the 800m at a big DL meeting later in the season if any do take place, I think he would run low 1:44 at least.

So no great surprise or disappointment from me. He is still a lot faster than Crammy was at the same age.

Ex-runner on the other hand claimed he and everybody else expected 1:45. Yet now he's shouting that I'm an idiot and he was right.

The quote above comes from the 3rd post in this thread.

The only person going home a winner is Armstrong and a couple of others.

Also, Jakob beat Filip, yet most weren't predicting that.

A couple of years ago ex-runner was calling me an idiot for predicting Jakob would win 1500 gold in Tokyo. Ex-runner was certain that Filip and Henrik would both have a much better chance than Jakob over 1500. I was a complete idiot who had never set foot on a track for thinking Jakob might have a shot at gold.

Btw, I haven't read your gibberish replies last night. I'm trying to spend less time here. Also mods please observe this thread and notice how it is ex-runner who is determined to pick a fight and insult rather than have an adult discussion. Then he whines that me and Subway are bullying him, lol.

slowwer wrote:

slowwer wrote:

# of Coe's 800m per season:

1978: 11

1979: 10

1980: 12

1981: 13

1986: 11

# of Cram's 800m per season:

1986: 12

# of Ovett's 800m per season:

1976: 16

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

Impala31 wrote:

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

Because of this one race? Come on.

Adult discussion? You have never engaged in anything of the sort. I ignore half the rubbish you post about me doping and not having 'the balls' to meet up and race you over 5k in real life and choose to stick to talking about athletics.

I said he ran slower than I thought he would, nowhere did I say I was right.

You stated Jakob was going to surpass Aouitas career best, which I, and others, did not agree with.

Unfortunately for you that didn't happen so you hid and now have come back to claim you never said any of those things, don't want to be on the forum anymore, you posted a couple of personal attacks, exaggerate the situation and whinge on both threads discussing this topic.

If you can't have a discussion without having a tantrum maybe consider not posting.

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

Stretching back to Snell, the only 1500m gold medalists who were as slow/slower at 800m were Keino, Rono, and El G. Every other gold medalist since Snell has a PB of 1:45 (Cacho) or better (everybody else).

El G, Lagat, and Manangoi are the only 1500m world champions without sub-1:45 800m PBs.

Coevett wrote:

Also mods please observe this thread and notice how it is ex-runner who is determined to pick a fight and insult rather than have an adult discussion.

What a pile of crap lol dude seriously?

You come after him every single time you post, call him a doper, a coward, etc.

I'm getting fat from all the popcorn.

Oh and your lies. You got called out several times on this thread and you NEVER admit it.

Portsea Cerutsea wrote:

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

Stretching back to Snell, the only 1500m gold medalists who were as slow/slower at 800m were Keino, Rono, and El G. Every other gold medalist since Snell has a PB of 1:45 (Cacho) or better (everybody else).

El G, Lagat, and Manangoi are the only 1500m world champions without sub-1:45 800m PBs.

What? Elijah Manangoi ran 1:44.15 in Birmingham 2018. And is said to be faster than Tim in workouts.

Portsea Cerutsea wrote:

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

Stretching back to Snell, the only 1500m gold medalists who were as slow/slower at 800m were Keino, Rono, and El G. Every other gold medalist since Snell has a PB of 1:45 (Cacho) or better (everybody else).

El G, Lagat, and Manangoi are the only 1500m world champions without sub-1:45 800m PBs.

Manangoi was actually a 400m runner before switching to the 1500m. He ran 46.5 in 2013, and his 800m PB is 1:44, so yeah he ran faster than 1:45, and he even had a realistic 1:43 flat potential at his peak.

+1

One of the rare sensible posts.

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

The speed needed to win a championship 1500 is the same speed need to win a championship 5-10k.

Coevett wrote:

As for ex-doper who lied about ever breaking 2 minutes and hasn't got the b a ll s to face me in a Parkrun next year

LOL @ Mr. Civil

I am sure ex-runner doesn't want to embarrass you as you huff and puff to break 28 in your park running.

Portsea Cerutsea wrote:

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

Stretching back to Snell, the only 1500m gold medalists who were as slow/slower at 800m were Keino, Rono, and El G. Every other gold medalist since Snell has a PB of 1:45 (Cacho) or better (everybody else).

El G, Lagat, and Manangoi are the only 1500m world champions without sub-1:45 800m PBs.

Comparing different eras isn't very realistic. 1.45 in Snell's era (1960-64) was absolutely streets away from anyone else - including half-milers - and no other miler/1500 runner in his era could get near that time (set on grass or cinders). We have to look at today's standards and fields for the benchmark. I would agree with those who suggest 1.45 capacity would be necessary today to medal over 1500. Anything slower will always be out-kicked at the longer distance. I would say Jakob is right on the cusp. I don't think he has faster than 1.45 in him. He is a 1500/5k runner. I will also be controversial and say I don't think he's going to get much better at even his best distances. I think he is now nearing his peak - a bit like an Amos at aged "18". Prodigies rarely become the best in their maturity. They have put everything in to being prodigies.

letsdrum wrote:

Expert of Experts wrote:

They have enough speed to win an NCAA conference meet. However, to be champions of the WORLD at 1500 they need 1:43 or better!

Even in the MIGHTY USA you need 1:43 or better to be a national champ at 1500!

1:46 speed is decent for 5k/10k but don’t underestimate the speed of CHAMPIONS. Most would be capable of sub 1:43 in peak conditions... Still a good time trial.

What a nonsense.

Depends on the runner.

When Steve Scott his his 800 PR of 1:45 something, he stated in his book that he knew he was in shape to challenge the WY of 3:47.33 (or so) by Coe. He soon thereafter ran is 3:47.69.

I would say, based on this 800, Jakob is in 3:48 shape

Hayduke wrote:

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

The speed needed to win a championship 1500 is the same speed need to win a championship 5-10k.

We have seen he lacked speed in Doha 5000

Hayduke wrote:

Impala31 wrote:

That doesn not look fast enough to win gold in 1500 at WC or Olympics. He can probably run a second faster with more speed work in another race but that means his life time potential is high 1'44 or low 1'45. Any 1500 gold medalist that slow recently?

Sure he can get bronze, maybe silver. But I think he should focus on 5000-10000

The speed needed to win a championship 1500 is the same speed need to win a championship 5-10k.

Totally wrong. Relatively recent championship 1500s have been won with splits like 1:46 for the last 800 and 50.6 for the last 400.