HEPS Cross Country 2012

Hepstrack previews have started!

http://hepstrack.com/blog/2012/10/24/hepsxc-%E2%80%94-columbia-women/

C/M, This is not a track preview but an apology for what will happen this weekend.

C/M Runner wrote:

Hepstrack previews have started!

http://hepstrack.com/blog/2012/10/24/hepsxc-%E2%80%94-columbia-women/

Arroyo Yamin's got it.

kibitzer wrote:

As a fan of the League, I'd enjoy seeing the talent level (which they've had for years) be matched by performance.

And speaking of Harvard talent, I note that Adam Cotton is on the xc roster this fall, though I don't think he's competed--wondering whether he could debut at Heps.

I think Cotton running at Heps is unlikely. Harvard has a history of putting mid-distance people on the XC roster but none of them ever running any XC meets. Also, when Cotton returned to England for the summer, he shared on his blog that he had an achilles' injury that would prevent him from running for up to a year if he had surgery (although he never did). He apparently only started running again in August.Quotes from his blog:

kibitzer wrote:

For those who'd like to reminisce about last year:

http://nathancrumpton.smugmug.com/Sports/HepsXC2011/Heps-XC-MenWomenEdits/19804411_GX3kxx#

!i=1556522711&k=6GTrv9B

Thanks, I guess. Despite what the photos might indicate, conditions were much more miserable for the men. They were chilled through before they ever started. That cold rain...

C/M Runner wrote:

I think Cotton running at Heps is unlikely. Harvard has a history of putting mid-distance people on the XC roster but none of them ever running any XC meets. Also, when Cotton returned to England for the summer, he shared on his blog that he had an achilles' injury that would prevent him from running for up to a year if he had surgery (although he never did). He apparently only started running again in August.

Thanks for the link, C/M. That helped explain a lot. I remember seeing Cotton (trying to) run the 1500 at outdoor Heps, and just cringing--it looked so painful.

Agreed, many/most Ivy teams have middle-distance runners on the cross-country roster who rarely or never race. I note that Cornell's own Brit soph, Jade Williams, has been keeping a low profile, after running a moderate season of cross last fall. Perhaps she had a typical British competitive summer this year, and they don't want her to overrace--last year she was second at Heps 800 indoors, but didn't make the final outdoors. I'm sure it must be tempting to use her in everything (the CU website says that she's won National titles at 400, 800, 1500, 3000 and 5000 meters), but the CU coaches do seem to handle their athletes pretty conservatively.

__________________________________________________________________________________

It now looks like Princeton may be getting some rain on Saturday. Today and tomorrow should be rain-free, but high humidity and low winds could mean their course will still be soft from previous days' rain.

Thinking about that, and taking another look at the photos from last year's Heps, reminds me of the comment I overheard that day from a coach (no longer at the school) whose men's team had not performed well: "Maybe we should have gone with the longer spikes." Gee, ya think?

My team predictions (as recorded for the Letsrun polling):

Men's Heps Picks

1. Columbia

2. Princeton

3. Dartmouth (I'm assuming that Bleday will be running)

4. Harvard

5. Cornell

6. Brown

7. Yale

8. Penn

Women's Heps Picks

1. Cornell

2. Yale

3. Princeton

4. Harvard

5. Columbia

6. Dartmouth (assuming Abbey runs but Rutledge does not)

7. Penn

8. Brown

I definitely believe that no one team will be blown out of the water in the back half of the standings, so I think it will come down to a few points between the teams (I'd like to think that Dolan has done enough this season to help Penn out a little, but I understand it will take a few years for a more drastic impact)

men's top 20

princeton - 6 guys

columbia - 7 guys

harvard - 2 guys

dartmouth - 2 guys

brown - 1 guy

yale - 1 guy

cornell - 1 guy

penn - no one

It is a very real possibility that Columbia and Princeton could beat an All-Star team of the other 5 teams.

Cotton Balls wrote:

Odd that Harvard Coach Saretsky get zero mention in Cotton's exhaustive listing of the people he wants to thank for the improvement in his physical condition. What's up with that? And what about his explicit disrespect of "America/Americans?" Time to send this ingrate packin' bank across the Pond.

http://www.athleticos.org/blog/42806-First-year-at-Harvard

[/quote]

It somewhat sounds like he is...

"Thank you for the advice, i'm giving them no option of returning, no point in rushing back too soon." - Adam Cotton comment on the entry listed above.

Cotton Balls wrote:

Odd that Harvard Coach Saretsky get zero mention in Cotton's exhaustive listing of the people he wants to thank for the improvement in his physical condition. What's up with that? And what about his explicit disrespect of "America/Americans?" Time to send this ingrate packin' bank across the Pond.

http://www.athleticos.org/blog/42806-First-year-at-Harvard

[/quote]

I don't think Saretsky was coaching him at Harvard. Prior to even coming to Harvard as a freshman, he wrote in a blog that he was planning on being coached by his British coach, and that his main goal was to make the British Olympic team, not participate extensively with the Harvard team. As he indicated in his blog about Heps last year, the whole concept of competing as part of a team was new to him.

I am guessing that perhaps he might have also been miffed a bit if the Harvard coaching and training crew did not pick up on the potential seriousness of his Achilles issues and was continuing to let him train and compete. Harvard did not exactly have a stellar record with injuries last year on its mens team. Just a guess.

C/M Runner wrote:

I'd like to think that Dolan has done enough this season to help Penn out a little, but I understand it will take a few years for a more drastic impact

IMHO Dolan has *managed* his season and personnel about as well as anyone could have. He's given his teams the chance to experience winning (Brown race at Short) and general success. (If your team has no realistic shot at going to Nationals, why disrupt their classes and training to go to Wisconsin, in search of push-points that you can't get?)

Penn will be ready to go at Heps--it'll have to be their prime meet of the season--and I'll actually be surprised if both teams remain in the cellar (although simply being *competitive* for 7th place would be a big step up from last year).

Having coached both sexes, I agree that the Penn men may need another couple years of solid coaching and recruiting before they're a force, although their outstanding freshmen are already competitive, and could be leaders of a championship team by their senior year.

But women's teams can move up one whole level in the course of a single year. High-quality rookies are capable of contributing immediately, and--having been on the wrong side of some of Steve's recruiting in years past--I am confident that "high quality" will describe the recruiting class he'll bring in for 2013.

"D'Agostino will be sidelined as the Big Green head back to New Jersey for another shot at the conference title"

http://www.dartmouthsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=11600&ATCLID=205719840

d a r t mouth wrote:

"D'Agostino will be sidelined as the Big Green head back to New Jersey for another shot at the conference title"

Thanks for the info. I'm very, very sorry to hear it.

I'm sorry to hear it as well.

So, who do we think will take the individual title then? Kellner? Feldman? Kovach? Caldwell? Epstein?

Neer is not running.

C/M Runner wrote:

I'm sorry to hear it as well.

So, who do we think will take the individual title then? Kellner? Feldman? Kovach? Caldwell? Epstein?

Neer is not running.

I suppose Kellner would be the favorite--having finished second to D'Agostino at Paul Short--but she may be very conscious of running to help insure a team win. In that case she may not try a runaway like the one that garnered her the Heps 10k last spring, but may stay with one or more teammates a good part of the way.

If that's the case, her junior teammate Rachel Sorna (who has already finished ahead of Kellner in a race this season, and was fourth at Short) may have just as good a chance as anyone. She finished only two seconds behind Kellner at Wisconsin; they were the first and second Ivy finishers. (In fact, I believe the Big Red went 1-2-3 in that regard, including Emily Shearer--who has excellent finishing speed.)

A real out-of-left-field suggestion here, but anyone like Kovach (who may have the most native talent in the field)--or really ANY runner who basically has no team podium placing to worry about--could very well take the race. The Yale women, on the other hand, with an actual chance to take the team title, may be less tuned in to individual glory.

Of course, AD'A's absence has to affect people's team predictions. Dartmouth is no longer in (essentially) a score-four situation, but I actually think they'll do pretty well--there's a lot more to that team than one or two runners, and they could be one of about five teams fighting for that last podium spot. What a race that'll be!

On the men's side, I read the team predictions (summarized at HTC), but with a grain of salt. I may be the Big Red Fan, but *two* predictions of Cornell's men finishing first? That's a little outrageous...still, they have their best team in a few years and will be part of the tense fight for a podium place.

Men's Top Ten:

Harvard 1-2:

1) Korolev

2) Leakos

3) Bensten

4) Arroyo-Yamin

5) Murphy

6) Kelly

7) Gault

8) Feigen

9) Groves

10) Composto

Predictions? wrote:

Men's Top Ten:

Harvard 1-2:

1) Korolev

2) Leakos

3) Bensten

4) Arroyo-Yamin

5) Murphy

6) Kelly

7) Gault

8) Feigen

9) Groves

10) Composto

I have trouble understanding your reasoning behind the placers for the top three teams (Columbia, Princeton, and Dartmouth). Bendtsen, while a great runner, is not quite at the same level as Murphy-just look at Wisco for evidence. Even among Princeton runners, Arroyo-Yamin has the edge on almost any day over Bendtsen. You also put Gault in the top 10 but did not include Geoghegan, who has beaten Gault in every race this season, and likely will do so the same on Saturday. Also keep an eye on Royer from Dartmouth, who was at the top of the Ivy League as a sophomore, injured last year, and is recovering very well from injury. He has been improving every race and may be a top 10 threat as well. My top ten:

1)Murphy

2)Arroyo-Yamin

3)Korolev

4)Geoghegan

5)Leakos

6)Sienko

7)Bendtsen

8)Feigen

9)Gault

10)Groves