Top All Time Kansas Distance guys

[quote]Jayhawk wrote:

Coach Schmidt was a piece of work... I remember at the 72 cross country regionals I let him get inside my head. We were about a half mile from the finish and I was running about ninth and three of his guys were right behind me. He's running alongside screaming his lungs out and yells... get that dog faced bastard. I just about fell over, I couldn't believe what was coming out of his mouth. I folded up like a cheap suit and finished about 20th. It was awful... but I still respected the guy.

Oh, yeah that sounds familiar;

my senior year, it had been pretty loud and ugly between Schmidt and our runners at SMN. (of course, we baited him alot, too). About 1/2 way through the track season, my coaches Gish and Frye were becoming upset, taking it alot more seriously then we kids were. One of them, I can't remember if it was Gish or Frye, told me that they were going to keep an on him at the District Track meet out at South and if he went berserk on me and used profanities, they were going to deck him. That wouldn't have been a pretty sight, as Gish was a former lineman at KU and Frye was a 300 lb'r, who coached the weightmen at KU in the 60s at some point, before becoming the distance coach at north in '71. I had to 'settle them down' and assure them that it wasn't that serious and no big deal. Crazy stuff, but it was all part of the interest, fun and intensity of it all! (btw, we kids all got along for the most part at the opposing schools; but Verlyn did't like any fraternization with us).

SMNW wrote:

you have to remember that SMNW has only existed since 1969 and was pretty bad, (like an expansion team), for 5 years or so.

Just read this...

South opened in 66. That was the only year under Schmidt that they didn't qualify for state. The 3 teams that beat South at Regionals, went 1-3 at State.

[quote]jscott wrote:

[quote]Jayhawk wrote:

Coach Schmidt was a piece of work... I remember at the 72 cross country regionals I let him get inside my head. He's running alongside screaming his lungs out and yells... get that dog faced bastard. I just about fell over, I couldn't believe what was coming out of his mouth. I folded up like a cheap suit and finished about 20th. It was awful..

not to make you feel bad, but I thrived on Schmidt's abuse. I used it to run better. Clark Hamilton also from SMN, said the same thing. He said he and Nicolay were battling it out along with Tim Davis at some race and he was feeling awful and about to let go of those 2, when Schmidt yelled some derogatory comments aimed at Hamilton on the last 300 yards or so. It perked him up with a shot of adrenaline and he bolted past Nicolay and Davis to win. He thanked Schmidt afterwards, which really made Schmidt mad!

To this day I don't know why I let Verlyn get into my head. And you're right about the fraternizing. I was friends with South's Curtis Martin and it used to drive Schmidt nuts. Curtis and I were going to run a two man 6 mile relay at Loose Park my sophomore year. Curtis shows up with another South kid, McArter was his name I think, and tells me Schmidt forbade him from running with me. Those of you familiar with KC running will appreciate what happened next. I'm stuck with no partner and somebody points out this old guy who needs a partner and he looks like a charity case. I'm thinking it will just be a nice workout with this dude. The first loop the old dude comes around 50 yards in first. I about fell over... by the time it came to me for the last three miles it was neck and neck. I could only hang on for third... the old dude was Mike Chaffee... I learned then to never judge a runner by his looks.

What a great thread! I want to chime in with a correction to the all-time list in the 800. Rosedale’s Dave Peterson finished a tenth-second behind Clardy Vinson at the ’67 state meet. For some reason Verlyn Schmidt used to have Dave listed twice in his top-50 list, the low 1:53 and the 1:54. I saw Verlyn at the Relays a few years ago and pointed this out to him, and it looks like the faster time got dropped. There were some great duels between Peterson and Wyandotte’s Tyrone Brown over the years, and the ’67 state 800 was a three way last-man-standing war. Rosedale’s cross country coach back then was a top regional marathoner and equally highly-ranked wrestler who moved on to bigger things at SM West, Carl Owczarzak. Carl retired last year.

Another classic duel was Anderson’s and Callen’s same-time finish in the ’69 Relays two-mile.

Wyandotte was a distance powerhouse back then. They had a team thing going with red “club” t-shirts; at one time they had three, maybe four guys showing up at meets with “9:30 club” shirts. They put a big psych-out on the other Wyandotte county runners.

I was on the track at SM East when Ryun and Lawson averaged 61.5 quarters in the two-man ten mile relay. Man-o-man! You guys remember the 24-hour relays?

Great stuff. Thanks! I really hate to update lists by just word of mouth. I know it's been 40 years, but if anyone has the state meet results that would be great. This is the best I can come up with.

880-Yard Run - l. Clardy Vinson, Topeka;2. David

Peterson, Rosedale (K.C.); 3. Jerry Gerant, Shawnee

Mission Nonh; 4. Steve Anderson, Lawrence; 5. Paul

Bergman, Ward K.C.). Time: l:53.7*

http://www.kcctfca.org/Results/StateTFResults/1966-1967%20State%20T&F%20Results.PDF

http://www.kcctfca.org/Results/StateTFResults/statetfresults.html

I realize this thread has been KC oriented which is awesome...some of the stories about the runners here have been great and keep them coming...I remember growing up in western KS and thinking about how good the guys from Shawnee Mission were...I watched Reed Eichner almost break 9 minutes at the state meet and thought that was amazing...I ran across a name from Western Kansas the other day that I remember these guys because I raced them so often...Merlin and Marlin Spare...it was so funny because I could beat one of them when I raced them but could never beat them both at the same time and it was often a different one I would beat when I raced...one week Merlin and the next Marlin...

great stuff...I could look at those results all day for all those years and imagine those great races! Alot of those guys who came before me were 'gods' in our eyes. (funny how that works; guys older than you are looked up to, guys younger than us are just 'kids'), Jerry Gerant had the school record at SMN when I was there at 1:54. He went on to Pittsburg State and had a solid, but not spectacular career. Dave Peterson was a friend of mine in the early 70s. He went on to K-State and had a fine career and ran a 1:48 880 and 405 mile and was on many stellar relays.

anybody notice in those 1967 state meet results, John Riggins from Centralia, winning the 100? Yes, that's the KU and Washington Redskins football star.

I was on the track at SM East when Ryun and Lawson averaged 61.5 quarters in the two-man ten mile relay. Man-o-man! You guys remember the 24-hour relays?

I ran that 2 man ten mile relay in '72. Dave Anderson and Ryan Eichner ran away with it. I had Dave Peterson as a partner, who ran as fast or faster than those 2, but my average of 69 or so didn't hold up my end. I had such bad blisters the next day.

I also remember the 'mileage t shirts' that some schools had. I remember seeing Ryan Eichner in a 10,000 mile t-shirt. We adopted that at North when Frye took over the distance guys in '71 and we had a '500 mile shirt'...lol....I didn't make it; though I often wonder if guys padded their off season mileage to get a shirt.

How about the 1A 1973 results...Nolan Cromwell did okay that meet...

A better topic would be the top 10 CU alumni.

CU Fan wrote:

A better topic would be the top 10 CU alumni.

OK, just start the thread....do you mean CU alumni from Kansas or just CU alums in general. Marcus Walker, the great WE hurdler and Big 8 champion, is the 1st that comes to mind.

I think you guys have just come up with a great book idea: Kansas Greats - and the coaches driving them.

HMMMMM....

Is this Dennis Latham, the 4:15 miler from SME who ran against Anderson and Wisner in '69?

jscott wrote:

wow, I had no idea. (I've been living out of state for many years). It seems from your stats that Rose has gone well past the 'legend of Verlyn Schmidt' at this point. Is he as intense as Schmidt and pour on the volume and tough year round training? I remember Van in the early 70's, as a top road runner in the KC area, at a time when you saw very few post collegiate runners showing up at the local road races at Shawnee Mission Park, etc. He was a good runner and it appears, an even better coach.

To throw a little petro on the fire, some of Van Rose's teams that went on to run state were a bit weaker than Liberty, Lees Summit and Ble Springs teams. Some of Van's championship teams were like 3rd place at KC Metro's meet. It appears that the decline of power house teams from Wichita has aided the Sunflower Leagues dominance.

I too had a bit of a scuffle with Schmidt my senior year down in the locker room. He had confiscated my superman running shorts Jim Dillon and I wore at a SMS vs SMN dual track meet and had them in his coaches locer. I snuck into his office and took back my special shorts. He caought me coming out of his office and we proceeded to wrassle for the shorts. Not sure who won but there would be no lawsuit from me, I got what I deserved.

I am just thankful that my Dad got transferred my junior year from Philly to KC area and my Mom picked out a house in the SM South school district. I ran 1 XC race as junior, lillte regionals "C" race, took 5th in the race, 5th SMS finisher which put me at 19th man on the XC team. Humbling experience as I had been top man at a crappy suburban school in Philly. But I would have never have accomplished what I did without my 1 1/2 years as one of Verlyn's boys.

I do wonder what I would have run had I run for Verlyn all 3 years. Got to think I would have been low 9:00's.

PS I still have my Verlyn T-shirt in natural SM West colors. Just doesn't fit quite the same.

chgray wrote:

I too had a bit of a scuffle with Schmidt my senior year down in the locker room. He had confiscated my superman running shorts Jim Dillon and I wore at a SMS vs SMN dual track meet and had them in his coaches locer. I snuck into his office and took back my special shorts. He caought me coming out of his office and we proceeded to wrassle for the shorts. Not sure who won but there would be no lawsuit from me, I got what I deserved.

PS I still have my Verlyn T-shirt in natural SM West colors. Just doesn't fit quite the same.

Charlie: I remember that meet where you and Dillon wore the super hereo outfits and got in trouble. It was a B meet out at South. (why you were running a b meet your senior year, I have no idea). I went out after practice to watch my brother Tom run and got there in time to see it. lol...if I recall, didn't you have to stick around after the meet and run intervals as punishment?

A similar thing happened at SMN in X-C my senior year, (which I didn't run due to stress fracture). Steve Linquist, our #2 guy behind Marcus, got in trouble for cutting a practice the week of the 1st meet out at SM Park. He was put in B race as punishment. He decided to wear a beatnik/hippie type disguise to piss Frye off. It amounted to a funky headband, sun glasses and a Beatle wig. He threw off the wig about a 1/4 into the race, but the yearbook photog was out there and snapped his pic and I think it got into the yearbook. No scuffling with Frye for the sunglasses...lol...since Frye was the former strength coach at KU in the 60's when they had those 3 world class guys, led by Karl Salb. crazy, fun times, huh?

I vaguely remember some 'Schmidt T shirts'...didn't they have a drawing of his little head with the big glasses in his stocking cap? a caricature.

Charlie Gray said:

I do wonder what I would have run had I run for Verlyn all 3 years. Got to think I would have been low 9:00's. (quote)

That is quite possible; but the downside is you might have been burned out and not run or run as well in college and certainly not the fine post college and now masters career you've had? (just based on other South guys who were there all 3 years and actually under Schmidt in the summer programs starting in Jr. high). btw, did your buddy Jim Dillon run in college? He was a pretty good, hard working guy.

jscott wrote:I also remember the 'mileage t shirts' that some schools had. I remember seeing Ryan Eichner in a 10,000 mile t-shirt. We adopted that at North when Frye took over the distance guys in '71 and we had a '500 mile shirt'...lol....I didn't make it; though I often wonder if guys padded their off season mileage to get a shirt.

Yeah, I made it up to a "3000 mile shirt" (just ran junior and senior years), which, ironically, was colored green and yellow. Sadly, wearing it never seemed to help me run faster. You would have been ostrisized by the other runners if they suspected false reporting so we had really good integrity about reporting off-season mileage. We did have one guy though make it up to 8,000 miles (I think) and I wondered if some of those weren't in a car.