Ranking WI collegiate distance programs

Former badger great wrote:

I am somewhat down on the Badgers also but these teams are an entire notch behind Wisconsin. They pumped out 13:51, 14:05, 14:05, 14:18, 14:24 this weekend. They also had a 7:51 3k and 1:49 800. Oh and they had 2 women run 15:44 and 15:47 which is faster than some of the guys mentioned. Milwaukee and Marquette probably don’t have a guy who would be in the top ten in Wisconsin’s distance crew.

I can’t believe how jealous Madison homers are getting about some good press from Milwaukee and Marquette. How insecure are you guys. Obviously the badgers have better talent and faster times, but the real topic at hand is how the programs are trending. Milwaukee and Marquette are having big seasons full of pr’s and tangible improvements. Do you really feel good about Eric Brown still running 1:49, or Joe Hardy running 13:51?? I’ve got news for you, those aren’t NCAA qualifying marks. UW use to get several people to nats, I don’t see that right now. Development is key. Not a whole lot of that going on in Madison.

Let it be known that the badger faithful is scared right now. Big momentum swing for the 414 schools. Rooting for both these programs to pull kids away from Madison.

This ^ At this point, getting 10 healthy and consistent individuals to the line during the season for Wisco seems to be their biggest difficulty. Wouldn't be hard to make Badgers top 10 because of high likelihood of burnout and injuries among their team... Nothing against Madison, but you got to admit that the program is in shambles. Unfortunate, but true

I think the topic is the ranking of the programs so when people start to ask if other colleges in the state are faster than Wisconsin, it is time to set the record straight. When did we stop judging based on performance? The Badgers would be lapping Marquette and Milwaukee guys in the 3k and 5k. I agree that Wisconsin does not develop kids any longer but they are able to recruit some of the best runners in the nation. If that continues, they will always be a team in the discussion. The times from this weekend did not include runners like McDonald, Hirsch, Gessner, or Hacker. I expect Wisconsin to make a run at the national title. Milwaukee and Marquette are not as good as the best D3 teams. I am not excited about that. They are both D1 programs who have scholarships to give. They are not developing kids any more than the D3 teams in Wisconsin are.

Noah Tagliapietra>Finn Gessner

Wow, it’s been crickets from the D3 faithful for a while now. Must be because you don’t look so hot compared to my Golden Eagles. But it’s good to hear from at least one of you on this one.

I love this post. I’ll never understand you D3 guys who identify with Madison. They treat you D3’s like dirt and poach your good kids. I have no clue why you root for them and dislike the other D1’s

Classic D3 mantra: The Badgers are amazing, and we Badgers of D3. And we “CHOSE” D3. We’re better than all the D1’s.

Give it a rest and return to your shanty’s.

Lol performance is still taken into account. But performance is more than just a one or two time fast performance from a d1 runner. Of course many of the Badgers will run faster times. But how often and at which points in the season? Obviously Madison should be having fast performances considering the talent they get. How often do the Badgers really produce "fast performances"? Not as much as they used to and if anything, they are running slower or stagnated performances over the past few years. Madison used to be great. Now, it's where great runners go to not improve and likely die. Performance criteria loses value when considering a fast performance occurs seldom for badger runners. Trajectory and consistency of those performances plays just as big of a role in the overall performance criteria as fast times. Nobody would argue that Madison can run faster times. However, what they have done with their talent and the likelihood most of them can run their PR or faster is sad and unimpressive.

+1

How many Badger men qualified for Outdoor Nationals last year?

How many will qualify for Indoor Nationals this year?

I believe Mick's numbers have been declining in these important figures.

People have mentioned UWM and Marquette as places where crappy kids take a free tuition waiver and then suck for 4 years. I’m here to say two things.

1. That use to be true. Look at some of the sludge that has been on both rosters.

2. A dramatic change is occurring, where that isn’t the case any more.

Higher education is too expensive. The days of just being a walk on at wisco or saying I want to paid full tuition to college so I can be a 8xD3 All-American aren’t as plausible from a checkbook standpoint anymore. Kids and their parents don’t want to take on that kind of debt.

Watch and see these well funded programs start getting talent. It’s already happening, and with that talent, comes more talent.

If I was a quality high school senior right now, I would be looking at Marquette, Marquette, and even Parkside. Here’s why.

Wisco walk on

-debt

-coaches don’t care about you

-probably get hurt

-run unattached at d3 meets

WIAC

-debt

-never get to go to any good meets

-4 more years of high school

-crappy competition

MU/UW-M/UW-P

-scholarship

-travel to big meets

-compete for conference titles

-compete against the best

-opportunity to make an immediate impact and create a legacy

When you look at it like that, how have people not already figured this out by now.

Prime example, people have mentioned Noah T. The kid looks like a genius right now. He’s definitely getting school paid for. He is going to rewrite the UWM record books, he will get to go to big meets and will probably end up being at nationals some day.

Tell me where the drawbacks are is in that scenario. And more kids will follow. More will take the money, but this time the kids will actually be good runners to begin with and will help build there. Watch MU and Parkside do the same thing.

Change is hard and change is swift. The days of D3 glory or being the little walk on that could are going bye bye.

I spent 4 years of college being beat up by WIAC teams, but using "debt" (WIAC in-state is dirt cheap, and I doubt very few at Marq/UWM are getting a full ride on athletics), and "never get to go to any good meets" (as if none of the WIAC schools are at Drake/big indoor meets/DIII nats every single year) against WIAC schools, and "compete against the best" (name the last regional qualifier in the distances from either school) as reasons to go to Marquette/UWM over WIAC schools is pretty hilarious.

You either weren’t good enough to get a scholarship, or you were a fool not to take one and run against real competition.

It’s hilarious to me that you can’t differentiate the caliber of schedule those schools get to run.

What meets are you going to on a consistent basis that are on the level of Mt. Sac, Bryan Clay, GVSU, Meyo, NCAA XC regionals, Louisville XC, so on and so forth.

You “run” drake relays in the college (D3) not university (D1) section. You “run” Griak (D3), not even D2. Outside of 1 or 2 guys, D3 nats is a bunch of trash. Tbh, the horizon league championship is better than D3 nats. Big Easts are better than D3 nats. Hell, even the U of M or UNI meets are better than D3 nats.

Oh course a high and mighty La Crosse guy would say something like whose the last guy to make regionals. Well for one, Caleb Abfall made it in 2016, but please remind me just exactly how many of La Crosses kids would have made regionals last year? Oh yeah that would be zero bro.

You guys only point out these things about MU and UWM because you’re jealous they didn’t recruit you.

Yeah why would someone be jealus of running for d3 wiac schools that are better than milwaukee and marquette... smh

Iowa State meet the past weekend had 25 guys break 14 minutes. It is by far the most competitive indoor distance meet of the year and within driving distance from Milwaukee but none of the teams being discussed was there except Wisconsin. So it is a good point about attending large competitive meets. Go to a real college like Wisconsin, MN, IA, IL or even Bradley if you want to get to real meets which is where you improve. Marquette will always be stuck with guys running 14:45.

Yeesh. The Horizon league champs? The WIAC meet is pretty much on par.

I didn't go to La Crosse. Or any other WIAC school. I made my choice based on the quality of the education. But to thump your chest on how awesome Marquette/Milwaukee are in comparison to a bunch of regional state schools is funny, especially when the actual performances on the track are about equivalent.

Is it really fun to go to Marquette and be near the bottom at all those meets?

The fact that you even have to try to prove you're better than D3 already shows that you're losing this argument.

At least in D3 you get an opportunity to shine and go to Nationals and compete as a team. Can you honestly say you're doing that at Marquette?

You'll always be a trash program competing against Division lll schools.

Give us an example or two of U of WI and MN "improving" at these meets? Especially the last few years. There is seldom if any improvement. Based on all of the injuries and burnouts for both of these schools, results and talent wasted suggests otherwise. Nice try tho

Right now:

Wisconsin

Marquette

Milwaukee

Eau Claire

La Crosse

Platteville

Parkside

Oshkosh

Whitewater

Stout

Put Madison between LaCrosse and Platteville . Otherwise fairly accurate

Did any of the Wisco boys qualify for Indoor Nationals?

This thread has received a lot of attention when the OP just wanted to know peoples’ rankings of the programs. Everyone is off topic talking about improvement or injuries or potential. Rankings are based on performance. This poster got it right by just stating their rankings. I may have moved 1 or 2 but I will agree with the simplicity.

If someone asks about ranking Wisconsin basketball teams, I don’t think people would argue about improvement or potential. They would just rank based on who would win the game.