Alan Webb 800m this Saturday

Many people are shocked that Webb could run so bad but here is a little perspective. It was clear that not a great deal was to be expected from this race. If they (Salazar and Webb) thought he was in good shape then he would've been running at the Palace. Secondly the guys who were first and second have both run 1.47.0x very recently and were 1.49.5-1.49 high in that race in very rough conditions. Now considering everyone on here thought 1.48/49 would have been a good comeback race it seems that Webb has run 1.52 in a race where the conditions were worth about 2.5 seconds so this suggests maybe his race was prehaps 'worth' what many had expected.

Don't get me wrong this does NOT mean Webb is in great shape and will be running 3.30 this year. But it does show that prehaps he's in slightly better shape than saturday suggests. Salazar claimed 3.37 would be about what he expects this year if things go well. I would be pretty sure Webb has done no speedwork and is doing pretty basic stuff in terms of intensity/volume in training. Therefore his progression over the coming weeks should be quite good and maybe he won't finish up too far away from soild results, 3.38 or so just as Salazar predicted.

So Alan Webb ran 800m in a low-key race at what is basically 3:30 1500m pace or 3:45 mile pace.

That doesn't sound unusual for a coach to recommend as a target for a first race, for a miler coming back.

If he did this at World Champs, or Olympic Trials, that might be another story, but we are in an "off" year, where rebuilding is not a bad idea, especially for those who need it.

rekrunner wrote:

So Alan Webb ran 800m in a low-key race at what is basically 3:30 1500m pace or 3:45 mile pace.

That doesn't sound unusual for a coach to recommend as a target for a first race, for a miler coming back.

If he did this at World Champs, or Olympic Trials, that might be another story, but we are in an "off" year, where rebuilding is not a bad idea, especially for those who need it.

right - I think he ran at a little faster than 1500 pace to see what it felt like. He knows he can't actually run a 1500 at that pace, but wanted to get in a race situation and see what it felt like.

I don't want to be negative but the challenge is not with his fitness. He will be more fit, and he is more fit right now than the 1:52 reflects - in fact - I would be he could time trial 1:48 right now - the problem is that he simply has not truly competed well in a race in two years, and he didn't again over the weekend. Some may disagree but he has always been able to time trial well - not surprising given his immense talent.

Last year, I winced when I saw him training on the Reston trails. Head down almost always, not really enjoying his craft. I saw the same body language in the race over the weekend, particularly in the first 400m.

I don't wish to write him off in any way. But it strikes me a spectacular talent should find a way to enjoy racing a a way to express his talent - and that just doesn't appear to be the case. And until he does enjoy it and mixes it up, I think it a tough row for him.

I know what you mean about the disinterested body language from 2 years ago, but the video quality of the 800 wasn't clear enough for me to notice it this time.

Hopefully he is enjoying his running this time around.

giffypop17 wrote:It's cheaper to enter a race with a dozen 1:51ish guys than to hire a couple of them to pace your time trial)

Excuse me, but this just doesn't make any sense. I can't believe that Salazar/Webb need to "hire" people to run time trials with. And, even if that was true, since when would it be "cheaper" to fly to Europe to run rather than "hiring" a couple guys at home? None of this makes any sense...

But, the bottom line is that this whole thread is much ado about next to nothing.

Well, I may be wrong about hiring people, I don't know. However, who are the guys who are waiting in Oregon that are just going to jump at the chance to do it? You'd want a guy with 1:50ish ability at least. Sure, there maybe a couple dozen of them in Oregon, but most of them have their own races they're aiming for and it's not like Salazar's the coach of all of them. The only Salazar athlete who could do this currently would be Rupp, who's in Europe in the middle of his racing season. Maybe he wouldn't have to pay pacers, and could pull some favors in to get someone from one of the other training groups or from UO, but it would take a little coordination to get a couple guys at that level together.

As far as flying to Europe, I already addressed that, but you chose to ignore that part of my post. Salazar and Rupp are in Europe anyway, does it seem that outrageous that Webb might have gone with them to train? Considering what we know of Salazar in general, and Webb's situation specifically, I bet he wants to be as hands-on with Webb as possible. Which means Webb comes to Europe with them. Actually, if they're already in London, it would be a lot more time/effort to fly back to Oregon, organize a time trial, etc., than to, oh, say, just enter a local race with 6 or 7 guys seeded between 1:47 and 1:52. Seems like a no-brainer to me.

It makes sense if this was an isolated time-trial with no more intent to race, and it makes even more sense if they're hoping to race a few more times this season.

I'll repeat myself from before.

The only downside is all the message board confusion and drama here, which frankly I don't think they care about. Or maybe they like it. It's keeping Webb in our minds and in the discussion at least, instead of automatically throning Wheating king of American middle distance.

I'm convinced that at least 75% of this thread effort was trolling, followed by a good 15% of ingorant followers and 10% who are responding to those 10%.

10/10. One of the best troll attemps ever on here.

Simply way too much idiotic nonsense to have been powered by sincerity.

Webb aint done.

It's not even mental for Webb. It's running. It's physical. He was chronically injured for so long. All he needs to do is get fit. It's not as complicated as everyone makes it out to be.

Even with some of Manzano's poor races this year I feel like it was just a result of overtraining. His workout on WOW with Torrence was a clear sign that he is overtrained from time to time. The distress in his face was apparent from the beginning.

What I'm saying is don't hate on these athletes and blame it all on them being headcases. Running in my opinion is 95% physical, 5% mental. If you're physically prepared, the mental part is easy. If you're not physically prepared, the mental part doesn't even matter... In 2008 and 2009 Webb wasn't prepared physically from a combination of overtraining and injury. Stop bashing him for having some physical setbacks. He's going to be so good again.

Just curious - how old are you? I've seen so many runners go home because of burnout - 5% mental is a low figure I think.

To 20 year olds, it is hard to imagine burning out, but as you get older...you start to wonder why you are doing this to yourself and it can be impossible to continue - especially when it is likely that you will never be as fast as you once were.

trolls win wrote:

Webb aint done.

OK, Julie.

groundhog day